User talk:BeeGoal

February 2021

Please refrain from making unconstructive edits to Wikipedia, as you did at 2020–21 Juventus F.C. season. Your edits appear to be disruptive and have been or will be reverted.

It is unclear why 2020–21 Juventus F.C. season lacks scheduled matches. These are available on the same page in other languages, and have been available in previous years. The scheduled matches are established by the Lega Serie A and have been published on their site. There is therefore an official source available for this information.

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Please ensure you are familiar with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines, and please do not continue to make edits that appear disruptive. Continued disruptive editing may result in loss of editing privileges. Thank you. Sakiv (talk) 12:33, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Please stop your disruptive editing. If you continue to vandalize Wikipedia, as you did at 2020–21 Juventus F.C. season, you may be blocked from editing. Sakiv (talk) 12:36, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Why is my adding information on an encyclopaedia "disruptive"? The information is verified by a primary source. You should engage constructively. You just jumped in over summer and altered the approach to this page - one that had been in place for years.

We add matches week by week. This has been decided by user who are more expert for these pages. Island92 (talk) 15:18, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Island92: Is there a reference for this discussion? The point of this change is not clear. There has been no engagement with users over the course of the season to explain why this change has occured. I've been trying to get an explanation for this regression all day, but haven't heard anything remotely satisfatory. @Sakiv: says it's because there's no concievable reason a reader may be interested in upcoming games that don't have a precise time, but this is patently untrue (I frequently check these these things - as other must since there's an entire industry producing content around this information, which again is published officailly by the governing body). - BeeGoal (talk) 16:50, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

You could try to discuss it in Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Football.--Island92 (talk) 17:10, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for that link. I note the official Style Guide for Club season pages does not set criteria for inclusion or exlusion of scheduled matches. From your comment, I take is there has been no discussion to date around this change of practice? (if there were any, I should think you would link to it). - BeeGoal (talk) 17:21, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Island92: and @Sakiv: I have asked about a change of practice here. If you have any views on the matter, it would be good to hear them. - BeeGoal (talk) 17:48, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Is it a coincidence?

Your appearance coincides with another user's raising of this topic on the Talk:2020–21 Juventus F.C. season. By the way, creating more than one account for the same person without a convincing reason exposes the user to permanent block.--Sakiv (talk) 19:01, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Sakiv: I saw the post and thought about it, so not exactly a coincidence I guess. I looked at the histories and your talk page too and I'm clearly not the first to be annoyed by this change (unless you think they're all me?!). I'm trying to improve the page, and here you've resorted to threats istead of engaging on content. There is an archived discussion on showing the rest of the match schedule. This shows most people disagreed with you and that the entire match schedule can be shown. Do you have anything to add to this? - BeeGoal (talk) 19:35, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

And you, what were you doing? You only engaged in discussion when I warned you and then reported you. I told you that you had to talk first and then highlight the adjustments you wanted. The season is nearing its end and there is no point in adding the rest of the 12 games. Then whoever told you that Serie A coaches or journalists need Wikipedia to know the next 10 or 12 matches for their team or other teams? They definitely have the entire calendar from the start of the league.--Sakiv (talk) 19:46, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Your re-edits were unjustified and not inline with either the Club season page style guide, or your previous discussion on the Project Page. I'm happy to have a discussion on substance over there, in the open in one place where others can pitch in. You'll notice that in good faith I have not kept updating the page despite the fact that your position here is clearly a minority. The point is one of principle - if there is no reason to remove the matches then they should be added. In any case, the only reason they're not there is you've removed them before. It's also not up to me to say who uses Wikipedia as a resource. All the information on all of Wikipedia exists elsewhere, so that everyone can just use another source (in my case Wikipedia in another language lol) is not much an excuse. The point here is that the upcoming matches are important information with an official source publishing them. From my perspective, that means if they can be included, then they should be. I'm happy to defer to the project page discussion, so lets continue there. -- BeeGoal (talk) 20:52, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

What you are claiming is categorically wrong. It was better for you to discuss this topic first until we reach consensus, and then make adjustments in case there is agreement. The one who should have opened a discussion before making any modification or re-editing is you who want to make an amendment to a page that has been stable for many months. We are not in a forum where we hold a vote or a referendum. I refer you to this policy: Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not#DEMOCRACY--Sakiv (talk) 21:21, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Sakiv: Again, I'd like to refer you to a more appropriate forum for discussion. I'm not quite sure what you mean by directing me to the Wikipedia is not a Democracy policy. Do you intend to just ignore any outcome of a discussion? Please answer that last point here, but direct any discussion on the subject of including the matches to the Project talk page. I note you have yet to make an argument for the current policy, other than claiming that no one finds them useful -- BeeGoal (talk) 21:34, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

That project has no power to approve any change to the articles but it is we who can do so on that article's talk page. You are the one who deals with Wikipedia as if it were a polling place. Stop personalizing the topic. You disagree not with me personally but with not adding the full match schedule. Once again, there is no point in knowing who will play Juventus on the last day of the tournament.--Sakiv (talk) 21:43, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]