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Unconvincing

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@CRRaysHead90: We use plenty of keys in pro wrestling articles, most commonly in championship lists. A quick flick through a random sampling of them showed List of WWE World Heavyweight Champions, List of WWE Divas Champions, List of CZW World Heavyweight Champions, List of AAA World Heavyweight Champions, and List of TNA World Heavyweight Champions. None of these keys had text less than 100%. In addition, WP:ACCESS states "The use of reduced font sizes should be used sparingly". I don't believe this warrants an exception. NiciVampireHeart 09:30, 18 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I meant in general, not just on Wikipedia. CRRaysHead90 | #RaysUp 20:47, 18 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 29 July 2018

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The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: consensus to move the templates as proposed at this time, per the discussion below. Dekimasuよ! 20:28, 4 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

– Clear and consistent naming of professional wrestling templates. The only non-extending change is "PPV series" to "event series", as this template is used across all series articles regardless of their broadcast manner. Prefall 00:14, 29 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Interim champions

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There have been a few pay-per-view matches where there was an interim champion (see SummerSlam 2011). J4lambert (talk) 00:48, 7 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • Yep, so you'd put "Singles match for the Interim Pudding Pop Eating Championship" in the stip field, no need for a different "(C)" note, let's not complicate this. MPJ-DK (talk) 03:52, 7 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I've rewritten the Results table in Lua. Let's talk about some potential style changes.

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I've rewritten the results table in Lua. See Module:Sandbox/Prefall and testcases below. This allows for more flexibility, such as removing the arbitrary number constraints on parameters, allowing more dynamic elements, better maintenance tracking, as well as making it easier to make simple note additions. Instead of having to frustratingly add individual parameter checks to each row and grouping all of those parameters into the Key, all you need to do now is add the following in the "notes" table: 

regnxt = { 'N', taped_msg ..'<i>[[WWE NXT|NXT]]</i>' },
  • regnxt is the note value
  • N is the symbol next to the match number
  • The last entry is the explanation in the Key, with taped and live preset options

With this rewrite, I've gone ahead and implemented a few changes:

  • Improved readability of match numbers and note symbols. I didn't like how bunched together they were, how the inclusion of a note misaligned the match number, and how the note was formatted in general—both the 80% font size (which violated MOS:SMALLFONT) and the "raised" style using <sup> tags. To remedy these issues, I split the note into its own column, upped its font size to 90%, removed the <sup> tags, and made the match number retain its alignment at all times.
    • Sidenote 1, I moved notes to the first column and match numbers to the second column. Notes are such an important distinction that I think we should be leading with them. It'll be the first thing your eyes catch, immediately letting you know something about this match is different from the main card. This also places the match number closer to the match, which is nicer because they are always present.
    • Sidenote 2, the notes column will only be displayed when a note is present. Similarly, when the column is displayed but there is an empty cell, its border will be hidden to draw more attention to the notes that are present.
  • Improved readability of the Key by aligning the note symbols. They were misaligned before, causing your eyes to dart around the screen when reading notes that greatly differed in length.
    • Sidenote 1, the Key now sorts notes in the order they appear in the table, rather than a static order.
    • Sidenote 2, future/past tense is now dynamically applied to explanations in the Key based on whether the specific match(es) concluded or not (via "defeated", "ended in" or "won by" per WP:PW/SG).
    • Sidenote 3, explanations in the Key are more concise.
  • Removed a restriction where |time1= had to be defined for the Times column to be displayed. For example, |time7= can be the only time parameter defined and the entire column will be filled accordingly (this applies to the new Notes column, as well).
    • Sidenote 1, blank times now default to "—" per WP:PW/SG and {{N/a}}.
    • Sidenote 2, there is now a check for a valid time format (M:SS being the minimum). There will be a preview warning for invalid values, and when they are submitted, they will be considered blank and tracked.
  • Added auto-detection for champions (via "(c)"), so manually hiding the champions note or Key is no longer necessary. As a result, |hide= has been deprecated.
  • Added auto-detection for event completion based on the final match (via "defeated", "ended in" or "won by" per WP:PW/SG). As a result, |future= has been deprecated.
  • Introduced |noteN= in place of individual note parameters—|note1=pre is the equivalent of |pre1=yes. The old parameters will continue to work, but long-term they will be swapped over and deprecated. The singular |noteN= will make note additions easier (avoids an extra step for editors) and will have better technical performance. We didn't use a singular parameter in the original template because, I think, those of us who designed it were too inexperienced to implement it correctly.

Below are a couple testcases to directly compare the changes:

Comparison of an event with notes

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Module:Sandbox/Prefall
No.ResultsStipulationsTimes
H1Bianca Belair (c) defeated Iyo Sky by pinfallSingles match for the WWE Raw Women's Championship18:00
P2Seth "Freakin" Rollins defeated Omos (with MVP) by pinfallSingles match10:30
3Austin Theory (c) defeated Bobby Lashley and Bronson Reed by pinfallTriple threat match for the WWE United States Championship6:50
4Rhea Ripley (c) defeated Zelina Vega by pinfallSingles match for the WWE SmackDown Women's Championship—
X5Bad Bunny defeated Damian Priest by pinfallSan Juan Street Fight25:00
6The Bloodline (Solo Sikoa, Jey Uso, and Jimmy Uso) defeated Matt Riddle, Kevin Owens, and Sami Zayn by pinfallSix-man tag team match22:00
D7Cody Rhodes defeated Brock Lesnar by pinfallSingles match9:40
(c) – the champion(s) heading into the match
H – the match was broadcast prior to the pay-per-view on Sunday Night Heat
P – the match was broadcast on the pre-show
X – the match was taped for a future broadcast of Xplosion
D – the match was a dark match
Template:Professional wrestling results table
No. Results Stipulations Times
1H Bianca Belair (c) defeated Iyo Sky by pinfall Singles match for the WWE Raw Women's Championship 18:00
2P Seth "Freakin" Rollins defeated Omos (with MVP) by pinfall Singles match 10:30
3 Austin Theory (c) defeated Bobby Lashley and Bronson Reed by pinfall Triple threat match for the WWE United States Championship 6:50
4 Rhea Ripley (c) defeated Zelina Vega by pinfall Singles match for the WWE SmackDown Women's Championship —
5XPL Bad Bunny defeated Damian Priest by pinfall San Juan Street Fight 25:00
6 The Bloodline (Solo Sikoa, Jey Uso, and Jimmy Uso) defeated Matt Riddle, Kevin Owens, and Sami Zayn by pinfall Six-man tag team match 22:00
7D Cody Rhodes defeated Brock Lesnar by pinfall Singles match 9:40
  • (c) – refers to the champion(s) heading into the match
  • D – indicates the match was a dark match
  • H – indicates the match was broadcast prior to the pay-per-view on Sunday Night Heat
  • XPL – indicates the match was taped for broadcast on a future episode of Xplosion
  • P – indicates the match took place on the pre-show

Comparison of a basic future event with no notes

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Module:Sandbox/Prefall
No.Matches*Stipulations
1Roman Reigns (c) vs. Cody RhodesSingles match for the WWE Universal Championship
(c) – the champion(s) heading into the match
*Card subject to change
Template:Professional wrestling results table
No. Matches* Stipulations
1 Roman Reigns (c) vs. Cody Rhodes Singles match for the WWE Universal Championship
  • (c) – refers to the champion(s) heading into the match
  • *Card subject to change

Discussion

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I also have a couple questions:

Let me know your thoughts and any other suggestions you may have. Prefall 13:48, 24 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry to be pushy—it's been two weeks with no responses. There are a number of uncontroversial technical changes but I'd like feedback before I implement it into mainspace. Pinging everyone who has contributed to WT:PW in the last month: @GhostOfDanGurney, Old School WWC Fan, JDC808, HHH Pedrigree, Czello, Oknazevad, WrestlingLegendAS, Muur, Lee Vilenski, LM2000, Dilbaggg, and Fran Bosh: Prefall 11:00, 7 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Honestly, I know nothing about Lua, and rarely work on results tables, so I'm not of much help. Sorry. oknazevad (talk) 11:11, 7 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@Oknazevad: That's fine. I just want to know what you think about the results table itself (Is it easy to read? Can it be improved in some way?), propose any features that may be helpful, etc. Prefall 11:20, 7 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I prefer the superscript notes, to be honest. It makes them look like the footnotes they are. The separate column, especially being before the match number, is backwards to the way they should be. oknazevad (talk) 11:38, 7 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I could also move notes back to the second column if people prefer it that way. I previously tested it but thought it looked worse with the numbers further away from the match. If we continue using <sup>, the font size will at least need to be boosted to 85% to meet MOS:SMALLFONT. Prefall 11:46, 7 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I have no issue with pushyness in these types of Wikiprojects when seeking a consensus and appreciate the ping. I do also prefer the superscript notes. Otherwise, the improvements look good. ― "Ghost of Dan Gurney" (talk)  15:24, 7 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I don't know much about lua. Comparison of an event with notes When I clicked show nothing happened in mobile view. Show did work when I went into desktop mode (but it uses up the battery quicker). I don't mind version 1 or version 2. (Fran Bosh (talk) 17:57, 7 June 2023 (UTC))[reply]
The mobile issue was with {{Collapse}}. Collapsed content is supposed to automatically display on mobile, but it wasn't working. I couldn't figure out how to fix it, so I just went ahead and removed it. Sorry about that. Prefall 19:57, 7 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks. Should the note symbols (e.g. "P", "D") in the Key be sorted alphabetically? No I think it's better in the order they appear in the table. (Fran Bosh (talk) 22:23, 7 June 2023 (UTC))[reply]

I also don't really know much about Lua, but I do prefer the superscript and agree with oknazevad on his reason why. And I agree with Fran Bosh that the order of the symbols should be as they appear in the table. As for your question about the explanation for dark matches, I'd say keep mention of dark match, but to remove the redundancy, change description to "this was a dark match". --JDC808 ♫ 01:29, 8 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Re: dark match, that's another good option. Prefall 04:12, 8 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Something I just thought of: in an instance where there are multiple matches with the same note and there is a discrepancy in their completion, how should it be handled? E.g.,

  • 1P (complete)
  • 2P (still to happen)

Option 1 (one note, based on the last match)

  • Key: P – the match will be broadcast on the pre-show

Option 2 (one note, based on the first match)

  • Key: P – the match was broadcast on the pre-show

Option 3 (two notes, the second being dynamically created)

  • 1P (complete)
  • 2PF (still to happen)
  • Key: P – the match was broadcast on the pre-show
  • Key: PF – the match will be broadcast on the pre-show

The first option is how the table currently functions. It's a small detail and will only be noticeable for a short period of time, but I could add dynamic sub-notes (option 3) to cover these occasions. Prefall 04:49, 8 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Okay, it's been a week and I think that's all of the feedback we're going to get for now. I'm beginning implementation with the following changes:

  • Reverted to the superscript format for notes. The only difference is I've upped the font size from 80% to 85% to meet MOS:SMALLFONT.
  • Added temporary sub-notes for matches that have a discrepancy in status (described above as option 3).
  • Added validation of match order. Placing a completed match after a future match will result in a preview warning and be tracked if submitted.
  • Adjusted the dark match note from "the match was a dark match" to "this was a dark match" to avoid repetition of "match".

If anyone notices any issues or has more feedback to provide, please let me know. Prefall 07:03, 14 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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