Template talk:NRHP header

References vs. footnotes

Is there some way to build intelligence into this template, so that if a list article has a section for explanatory footnotes (see here, for example), then the notes at the top of the number and date columns will appear in that section rather than the references section? Alternatively, can a parameter be added that editors can manually use to the same effect? — Ipoellet (talk) 20:20, 8 February 2014 (UTC)

duplicate ref error

This template generates a reference error (for "NRHP color") when used more than once in an article (e.g. in any list articles where there are delisted properties). Magic♪piano 14:12, 10 October 2015 (UTC)

NRHP reference number footnote revision

Current version's text (which appears twice in the code, would need to be changed twice presumably):

The eight-digit number below each date is the number assigned to each location in the National Register Information System database, which can be viewed by clicking the number.

Suggested new version:

The eight-digit number below each date is the National Register of Historic Places reference number for the property. Click to see a National Park Service's Focus system report on the property, which includes selected fields from the National Register Information System database and sometimes National Register nomination documents and photos.

This would be accurate and an improvement. Any alternative suggestions, or comments, would be welcomed. --doncram 08:14, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

In general I don't like having the refnum linked at all, because of the low reliability, out of date info, and questionable data quality of NPS Focus. That said, I support Doncram's change except as follows:

The eight-digit number below each date is the National Register of Historic Places reference number for the property. Click to see a National Park Service's Focus system report on the property, which includes selected fields from the National Register Information System database and sometimes may include National Register nomination documents and photos.

Presumably "National Register of Historic Places" spelled-out in full will have been previously used on any page where this template appears. — Ipoellet (talk) 18:07, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

Yes to making any note briefer, including also that NRIS can be abbreviated.

But actually I agree that the reference number should not be linked to Focus. It often serves readers poorly to direct them to the Focus website; there's a reason we don't include links to it in the individual NRHP articles. Isn't it better for readers to follow the link to the Wikipedia article? --doncram 19:42, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

efn

In a related but separate issue, this note is not actually a ref or citation. Is there a way to make it appear in an informational footnotes section (separate from the references section) when there is one? — Ipoellet (talk) 18:15, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

It should be easy to have a note appear in a notes section, by using "group=note" as in <ref group=note>TEXT</ref> plus approximately ==Notes==<br>{{reflist|group=note}} at the bottom of the page. --doncram 19:42, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

Heading in bold?

Hello. Is it really necessary to have the row headings in bold? HandsomeFella (talk) 08:39, 24 July 2017 (UTC)

Do not used edit requests to ask questions. — JJMC89 (T·C) 14:01, 24 July 2017 (UTC)

Most people would have realized that the question was an implicit request to change from bold text to regular text. HandsomeFella (talk) 21:10, 24 July 2017 (UTC)

Template-protected edit request on 9 May 2019

1. Change: {|class="wikitable sortable" style="width:98%" TO {|class="wikitable sortable" style="width:100%"
2. Change: ! width = 8% {{{{#ifeq:{{{1|}}}|NHL|NHL|NRHP}} color}}| Image TO ! {{{{#ifeq:{{{1|}}}|NHL|NHL|NRHP}} color}}| Image User-duck (talk) 14:49, 9 May 2019 (UTC)

Is there some discussion that prompted these requests? There may be a reason that these settings were chosen. How do your proposed changes interact with {{NRHP row}}? Have you made the changes in the sandbox and demonstrated that they work using the Template:NRHP row/testcases page? If not, please do so. Thanks. – Jonesey95 (talk) 15:19, 9 May 2019 (UTC)

 Not done for now: Disabled request as no response from OP — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 21:23, 12 May 2019 (UTC)

Footnote wording

Can't we be more specific and change "Numbers represent an ordering by significant words." to "Numbers represent an alphabetical ordering by significant words." ? Matt Gies (talk) 19:39, 15 September 2020 (UTC)

@Matt Gies:  Done but I'm seeing some errors on this now. Do you see this also because I may have to revert and investigate further — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 16:56, 30 October 2020 (UTC)

@MSGJ: Thanks! And no, I don't see anything amiss. Matt Gies (talk) 18:47, 30 October 2020 (UTC)

Can you go to National Register of Historic Places listings in Minnesota#Benton County and hover above the number 6. See anything wrong? I don't know if you was caused by this change, but it sure looks bad — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 20:40, 30 October 2020 (UTC)

Fixed. That was a fun one. – Jonesey95 (talk) 22:02, 30 October 2020 (UTC)

modify to allow naming of table so rows can be counted

Trying out suggestion I raised at wt:NRHP#automated counting of items in tables...

I want to be able to set a name for the table in any NRHP list-article, so that {{sum}} and {{table row counter}} can be used to report the total number of NRHPs in multiple list-articles. Try here for two short NRHP tables based off contents of National Register of Historic Places listings in Brewster County, Texas and National Register of Historic Places listings in Culberson County, Texas.

Note that table names cannot include hyphens; they can only include upper- and lower-case letters and numbers.

Here is a simple table (with id set = "foo"):

Column 1	Column 2
Cell 1	Cell 2
Cell 3	Cell 4

whose number of rows is: 2 (counted by template:table row counter applied to "foo").

Maybe what I am trying to do is impossible? The template {{table row counter}}'s documentation states that it "does not work with nested tables, HTML tables, or tables contained in templates" and that "The template works by getting the wikitext source of a page....".

I am not sure whether or not the wikitext of a typical NRHP list-article page is simple enough for {{table row counter}} to work. NRHP tables are in practice created with use of templates {{NRHP header}} and {{NRHP row}}. They are not nested. I am not sure whether they are "HTML tables" or not, whatever that is. They are generated by use of templates, but I am not sure if that means they are "contained in templates". So I am not sure, but I don't necessarily see a problem with using {{table row counter}}.

But it may depend upon what is the "wikitext" of a page. When a reader goes to a NRHP list-article such as National Register of Historic Places listings in Brewster County, Texas, what they see is, I think, a page generated by application of the templates. But maybe a NRHP list-article's page needs to exist, always, in completely expanded-out form, so that {{table row counter}} can operate upon it. Or, when "table row counter" runs, can it operate upon the wikitext that is expanded out when the page is read? I dunno.

Trying, I have tried to set up naming of tables in {{NRHP header/sandbox}}. Here's a two-item NRHP table hopefully being named "NRHPtableTXBrewster" by use of {{NRHP header/sandbox}} with argument "tableID=NRHPtableTXBrewster":

	Name on the Register	Image	Date listed	Location	City or town	Description
1	Brewster County Courthouse and Jail	Brewster County Courthouse and Jail	July 17, 1978 (#78002899)	Courthouse Sq. 30°21′30″N 103°39′48″W	Alpine	State Antiquities Landmark; Recorded Texas Historic Landmark
2	Burro Mesa Archeological District	Burro Mesa Archeological District	September 11, 1985 (#85002309)	Address restricted	Panther Junction

And if a) the argument for naming of table is passed adequately and the coding is correct to apply it, and b) "table row counter" could parse that, it would hopefully report its number of rows being 2. What it does report is that the number of rows is: .

And here is a one-item NRHP table being given name "NRHPtableTXCulberson":

	Name on the Register	Image	Date listed	Location	City or town	Description
1	Butterfield Overland Mail Corridor	Butterfield Overland Mail Corridor	August 27, 2014 (#14000524)	400 Pine Canyon Road. (Guadalupe Mountains National Park) 31°53′36″N 104°48′57″W	Salt Flat vicinity	Extends into Hudspeth County.

whose number of rows is:

And here is the sum of the number of rows in the two named tables: 0

Currently it is not working, either because the argument-passing and use of if-then-else statements is wrong in {{NRHP header/sandbox}}, or because "table row counter" simply cannot work.

--Doncram (talk,contribs) 23:40, 28 June 2023 (UTC)

This may be an instance of Template talk:Table row counter#Count failure. The first cell in each row within {{NRHP row}} starts with ! so even if you try to count the rows in the expanded wikitext generated by the above templates, the counting does not work [edited to add: this may have been a false result; I was doing this in Special:ExpandTemplates, and when I copied the expanded wikitext to my sandbox, the counting worked]. I think this will require a fix to {{table row counter}}. Maybe it could have an option to include rows that start with ! – Jonesey95 (talk) 23:52, 28 June 2023 (UTC)

I don't think {{table row counter}} can work in this scenario. I have forked {{table row counter}} to {{NRHP row counter}}, but I am not at all good with Lua, so I don't have the "id" bit working. The template by itself will count the number of instances of {{NRHP row}} in the first table it finds that starts with {{NRHP header}}, like this: 2. To get the "id" part working, I need some Lua help. – Jonesey95 (talk) 00:50, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

Ah, I like your creating a "NRHP row counter". Per my comment below, the problem seems not to be rows starting with "!". Your approach, counting by numbers of instances of NRHP row invocations, seems clever and very helpful. It would be really great if this could work! --Doncram (talk,contribs) 01:45, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

(Without seeing Jonesey95's comment at 00:50, 29 June 2023) Thanks so much! Given comments at "Count failure", it sounds like the general problem is worth fixing. [Or maybe it has been fixed. --Doncram (talk,contribs) 01:45, 29 June 2023 (UTC)]

Hmm. If that was fixed, then the NRHP tables might be or might not be countable. As you suggest, currently "table row counter" should fail on "expanded wikitext generated by the above templates" given that all rows start with "!". And such "expanded wikitext" is modified not to start with "!", then "table row counter" should work.

Perhaps i/we should check that, and then whether modifying "table row" not to start rows with "!" will allow "table row counter" to work?

Hmm, trying to "expand out" the wikitext for a two-row table internally named "NRHPtable1":

	Name on the Register	Image	Date	Location	City or town	Description
1	Butterfield Overland Mail Corridor		August 27, 2014	400 Pine Canyon Road. (Guadalupe Mountains National Park) 31°53′36″N 104°48′57″W	Salt Flat vicinity	Extends into Hudspeth County
2	Butterfield Overland Mail Corridor		August 27, 2014	400 Pine Canyon Road. (Guadalupe Mountains National Park) 31°53′36″N 104°48′57″W	Salt Flat vicinity	Extends into Hudspeth County

whose number of rows is: 2. Currently that shows "2", i.e. it is counting correctly, which I did not expect. (In expanding out the rows, I didn't use the "refnum=14000524" information, and I set one as "type=HD" and one as "type=NRHP".)

So, Jonesey95 it looks to me like "table row counter" is in fact working on rows starting with "!". So the problem still could be either that I didn't pass the argument correctly or handle the if-then-else properly, or that "table row counter" cannot work on tables built out by templates. --Doncram (talk,contribs) 01:20, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

I don't much understand the Lua code in Module:NRHP row counter, but it seems you're on track... It apparently does find each row with a match to text string "NRHP header" and increment a counter so that it has counted all the NRHP tables on the page. And then it counts the number of occurrences of "NRHP row" in the first table.

Is it hard to adapt that to find, instead, a row with text string "id=NRHPtableTXBrewster" (which will be a NRHP header row, starting a table), and then to count the number of occurrences of "NRHP row" after that, within that table (or before any other table, i.e. any following occurrence of NRHP header)?

In the code "s:match('NRHP header[^\n]*tableID *= *" *(%w+) *"')", I am guessing you were looking for a row that both has "NRHP header" and matches on the tableID argument. Is it easier just to find the tableID argument, which should suffice?

In useful application, it will be necessary to sum the counts of named NRHP tables in multiple pages. To count the approximately 1,759 NRHPs in Minnesota, for example, one needs to count the rows in about 24 NRHP tables on the main National Register of Historic Places listings in Minnesota page itself (the 24 being the smaller counties) and the rows in about 63 NRHP tables on separate pages (for the bigger counties). Ideally the table of 87 counties on the main Minnesota page would mainly consist of 87 calls to (article-name, table-name) pairs. And at the bottom have the grand total being the sum of 87 calls (I suppose possibly repeating the 87 calls?) less a relatively fixed number, 14, the number of duplicates (NRHPs which cross county boundaries so are counted twice) to get to the grand total. Hopefully the "sum" template can handle one argument being "-14".

In each state main page, the NRHP table counter would be used to tally up all the counties in the state. And for Texas where the counties are assigned to about a dozen regions, the NRHP table counter would be used to tally the counties in each of the regions; these are not currently counted up manually, there is just a blank where the counts should appear!

Hopefully all this can work, saving much time every week or two when the NRHP table counts have been manually updated (and allowing for more reporting, such as the counts of regions in Texas). --Doncram (talk,contribs) 09:51, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

To be clear, User:Jonesey95, I think that your programming so far is interesting in counting the number of "NRHP tables" on a page, etc., but the programming does not need to be that general. It can address counting for only tables that are specifically named, within a specified article. I do kind of like naming them by use of the "id=" field in the NRHP header row, but I suppose they could be named in some other way not involving the NRHP header template at all. Hopefully this makes programming easier? --Doncram (talk,contribs) 11:26, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

References