Template:Did you know nominations/Zhang Shichuan

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Yoninah (talk) 10:57, 13 June 2014 (UTC)

Zhang Shichuan

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... that Zhang Shichuan (pictured), who made China's first feature film, first martial arts film, and first sound film, is considered a founding father of Chinese cinema?
ALT1 ... that Zhang Shichuan (pictured), made China's first feature film, first martial arts film, and first sound film?

Reviewed: Pińsk Ghetto

Created by Zanhe (talk). Self nominated at 06:11, 3 June 2014 (UTC).

New enough and long enough. Other review elements pending. The article also appears to meet core policies and guidelines, including use of inline citations. However, spot checking raises questions about some close paraphrasing, including but not limited to:

(1) Compare: It produced "under Zheng's influence, didactic films such as Orphan Rescues Grandfather" with "under Zheng Zhengqiu's influence, it also made didactic films such as Orphan Rescues Grandfather".

(2) Compare: "When Zhang's 1928 martial arts film The Burning of the Red Lotus Temple became a huge box office success, he made 17 sequels ... within three years" with "In 1928, Zhang Shichuan's The Burning of the Red Lotus Temple became a huge success, and he made 17 sequels within three years."

These and any other examples need to be remedied before this can be passed. Cbl62 (talk) 20:33, 4 June 2014 (UTC)

I thought my paraphrasing was adequate. If you took out the proper nouns and exact numbers, only a few words were similar, such as "didactic", which is hard to paraphrase without sacrificing preciseness, and used in both English sources cited. In any case, I tried to rephrase the sentences the best I could, without altering too much of the original meaning (changing didactic to moralistic, for example, which is less than a perfect substitution IMO, though phrases like "huge success" were easier to change). Please let me know if it's satisfactory. -Zanhe (talk) 00:08, 5 June 2014 (UTC)

The last part of th hook, "is considered a founding father of Chinese cinema" adds little of value, as it can be easily inferred from his three firsts. So, I've proposed an ALT1. Edwardx (talk) 14:12, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

OK. Some effort has been made to reduce the close paraphrasing. Moving on to the hook fact itself, I agree with Edwardx that the alt hook is preferable. However, I have a problem with the part of it asserting that Zhang "directed" the first two films. Both the body of the wiki article and the source material on which it is based simply says that he made these two films. (Sources and article do say he directed the third.) Since he was sometimes a producer and sometimes a director, I don't think the hook fact is fully supported by the article or sources. Please either clear this up with better sourcing, or suggest an "alt" hook, perhaps that he "made" each of these films. Cbl62 (talk) 21:05, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

In the early years of cinema, there was no clear division of labor between "director" and "producer", so some sources say he made the films, and some say he directed them. It doesn't really matter to me, so I changed "directed" to "made" in the hooks. -Zanhe (talk) 03:15, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

Thanks Zahn. That should cover it. I do think the "alt 1" hook is best. Cbl62 (talk) 05:11, 7 June 2014 (UTC)