Template:Did you know nominations/Sport in Vatican City
- The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by US Referee talk 00:49, 8 August 2024 (UTC)
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Sport in Vatican City
- ... that sport in Vatican City started in the 1st century, when a chariot racing track was built in what was then ancient Rome?
- ALT1: ... that in the aftermath of World War II, sport in Vatican City was encouraged by Pope Pius XII? Source: [3]
- Reviewed:
5x expanded by Arconning (talk).
Number of QPQs required: 0. Nominator has less than 5 past nominations.
Arconning (talk) 09:24, 28 June 2024 (UTC).
| General: Article is new enough and long enough |
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| Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems |
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Hook eligibility:
- Cited:
- See comment - Interesting:
| QPQ: None required. |
Overall: 
Source 1 doesn't seem to mention the facts in the hook, and the second source seems somewhat partisan and I'm somewhat suspicious of the quality of an article starting with "Did You Know". Does the academic source mentioned in the same paragraph in this article ([4]) mention it in any way? That would be much better. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 06:42, 29 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Flemmish Nietzsche: Sadly, the academic source doesn't back the claim up but it does back up the claim that an area in the Vatican was once a chariot racing track. Though I'm not sure what's Wikipedia's and the DYK's policy on "possibly statements" (i.e. ...that sport in Vatican City possibly started in the 1st century, when a chariot racing track was built in what was then ancient Rome?" I suggest using ALT1 instead if that's the case. Though I can make another hook if it isn't interesting enough. Arconning (talk) 06:27, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Arconning I checked that journal I suggested, fand you're right about it not being definite that the chariot track ever actually existed there. ALT1 is not the most interesting, but I could accept it if there's nothing else better you can find. How about "... that sport in Vatican City began in the 16th century with the first ever match of calcio fiorentino, an early form of football?" This might not be the "start" of sport in the area that is now the Vatican, but it seems to be the first major event when that area was under the control of an independent Papal State, so I think it would pass. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 07:28, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Flemmish Nietzsche For the hook that you suggested, I'm all for it but with some minor tweaks. Since we can't really determine when sport in Vatican City really started, I think we should put something like "governed by the nation", "started by the nation", or something shorter. (i.e. ... that sport in Vatican City started by the nation began in the 16th century with the first ever match of calcio fiorentino, an early form of football?"). Arconning (talk) 07:38, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Arconning "started by the nation" seems somewhat iffy, as it could be confused with "nation" meaning a group of people sharing a common identity rather than a sovereign state; maybe "state-sponsored" or "officially" would be better? (... that state-sponsored sport in Vatican City began in the 16th century with the first ever match of calcio fiorentino, an early form of football?") Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 07:45, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Flemmish Nietzsche "Officially" works fine with me. Arconning (talk) 07:49, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
ALT2: ... that sport in Vatican City officially began in the 16th century with the first ever match of calcio fiorentino, an early form of football?" Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 07:59, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Flemmish Nietzsche "Officially" works fine with me. Arconning (talk) 07:49, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Arconning "started by the nation" seems somewhat iffy, as it could be confused with "nation" meaning a group of people sharing a common identity rather than a sovereign state; maybe "state-sponsored" or "officially" would be better? (... that state-sponsored sport in Vatican City began in the 16th century with the first ever match of calcio fiorentino, an early form of football?") Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 07:45, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Flemmish Nietzsche For the hook that you suggested, I'm all for it but with some minor tweaks. Since we can't really determine when sport in Vatican City really started, I think we should put something like "governed by the nation", "started by the nation", or something shorter. (i.e. ... that sport in Vatican City started by the nation began in the 16th century with the first ever match of calcio fiorentino, an early form of football?"). Arconning (talk) 07:38, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Arconning I checked that journal I suggested, fand you're right about it not being definite that the chariot track ever actually existed there. ALT1 is not the most interesting, but I could accept it if there's nothing else better you can find. How about "... that sport in Vatican City began in the 16th century with the first ever match of calcio fiorentino, an early form of football?" This might not be the "start" of sport in the area that is now the Vatican, but it seems to be the first major event when that area was under the control of an independent Papal State, so I think it would pass. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 07:28, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
Unpromoted per discussion at WT:DYK, pending selection of a better hook. RoySmith (talk) 22:07, 28 July 2024 (UTC)- Bringing over some suggestions from WT:DYK:
- ALT3: ... that sport in Vatican City has included chariot racing, calcio fiorentino, and taekwondo?
- ALT4: ... that sport in Vatican City has been seen as a way to express Catholic spirituality and principles?
- ALT5: ... that although sport in Vatican City has been seen as a way to express Catholic spirituality and principles, the church opposed the participation of women?
- @Flemmish Nietzsche: As the original reviewer, can you review the above hooks? Thanks. Z1720 (talk) 04:09, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
- ALT3 seems mostly good, although it would be best to include only sports played explicitly when the Vatican was independent; swapping out chariot racing for cricket would ensure that and proper sourcing for all claims. "... that sport in Vatican City has included cricket, calcio fiorentino, and taekwondo?" ALT4 and ALT5 don't seem very interesting or surprising; I would expect the Catholic church to desire to "express Catholic spirituality and principles" and to have somewhat of a bias against women. @Arconning: do you agree with the proposed change to ALT3? Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 15:02, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
- @Flemmish Nietzsche Yep, seems good. Arconning (talk) 15:06, 5 August 2024 (UTC)