Template:Did you know nominations/Pssst

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by The Squirrel Conspiracy (talk) 03:25, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

Pssst

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... ~~that Pssst revolves around Robbie the Robot's objective to defend his plant from interstellar space slugs?~~

Reviewed: Montignac, Dordogne

Improved to Good Article status by Jaguar (talk). Nominated by SSTflyer (talk) at 07:48, 21 October 2015 (UTC).

Artcile is long enough and posted by due date. Hook is cited and ref verified. No copy vio noted. Text is neutral. QPQ done.Good to go.Nvvchar. 14:15, 24 October 2015 (UTC)

I have pulled this from prep as the hook violates supplementary rule C6, namely that for hooks about a work of fiction or a fictional character, the hook must involve the real world in some way. While admittedly this rule is no longer routinely enforced, I still enforce it when I feel the highlighted fictional fact is not sufficiently unusual. The fact that a video game features a robot defending against space slugs is scarcely worthy of interest given that there are countless video games featuring a main character defending against hordes of strange creatures. I think another hook will be needed. Gatoclass (talk) 11:38, 28 October 2015 (UTC)
- Gatoclass, I strongly object to your decision. While you find the hook "scarcely worthy of interest", that's a personal opinion, and it should not have any role in what does or does not get put on the main page. I find plenty of hooks on such non-fictional things as bishops and minor waterways to be entirely uninteresting, but since they meet the requirements for promotion and my own personal preferences have no bearing on the process, I promote them anyways. In regards to C6, I believe that basic plot descriptions should not fall afoul of the rule. It seems to me that the rule is in place to prevent things that are entirely grounded in a work's fiction, like "[Fictional character] is the [fictional title] of [fictional place]". I urge you to put back the checkmark or move this back to prep. The Squirrel Conspiracy (talk) 01:23, 31 October 2015 (UTC)

Sorry, but hook interest is one of the reviewing criteria and a hook can be failed on that criterion just as as it can be failed on any other. This hook is a clear violation of C6 in my view, but it's one criterion I am prepared to ignore these days IF and only if the game or story fact highlighted can be seen as genuinely unusual or exceptional for its genre. I submit that a hook about a video game that basically boils down to "main character defends base from hordes of strange creatures" manifestly fails that test given that the same can be said of countless video games. So I still think another hook will be needed. Gatoclass (talk) 02:56, 31 October 2015 (UTC)

Why not a hook about, say, the instantaneous loading? That would seem to be a genuinely unusual feature of the game. Or maybe that it was noted for "best graphics" of 1983? Or better still, combine the two? Gatoclass (talk) 03:02, 31 October 2015 (UTC)

How the hell is this a GA? In the first three lines I checked, I found a statement in the article that wasn't at all what the citation said, another line that used a word in quotes that wasn't actually in the cited article, and a statement that skirted the edges of original research. Three major sourcing issues in three lines is a serious problem. This article needs to be re-reviewed, and right now I am inquiring about whether there's any way to delist it until that happens. The Squirrel Conspiracy (talk) 23:19, 31 October 2015 (UTC)

I think The Squirrel Conspiracy has made a misunderstanding with the sources. I've raised the matter on his talk page. JAGUAR 00:19, 1 November 2015 (UTC)

I have responded outlining my concerns here, on my talk page. This DYK should not be promoted until this is resolved. The Squirrel Conspiracy (talk) 00:32, 1 November 2015 (UTC)

The GAR has closed, and as an olive branch for holding this up, I am going to go ahead and provide a few hooks for Gatoclass or another editor to review, so that this article can make it to the main page in short order.

ALT1 ... that a retrospective review of Pssst noted that its graphics were a significant improvement over those of previous games for the ZX Spectrum?
ALT2 ... ~~that Pssst was one of only a small number of ZX Spectrum games released in the fast loading ROM format?~~

This could probably also be made into a really good April fools hook, if Jaguar wanted to go that route. The Squirrel Conspiracy (talk) 00:07, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Those hooks look fine to me, but not as April Fools hooks. Gatoclass (talk) 00:45, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Gatoclass - Right, of course What I meant was that, between the name of the article and the plot, there was decent material to make an April Fools DYK hook with.

If the above hooks are fine, will you give them the checkmark? The Squirrel Conspiracy (talk) 01:32, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Yes I will The Squirrel Conspiracy, but I'm not going to bother if you are going to propose a different hook for April Fools. Gatoclass (talk) 05:12, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Gatoclass: It's up to Jaguar if wants an April Fools hook. I'd say that if he doesn't reply in a day or so, you should just review the normal ones. The Squirrel Conspiracy (talk) 02:16, 4 November 2015 (UTC)

I appreciate the compromise but I wasn't the one who nominated this, SSTflyer did, so I think it's up to him. I'm fine with it either way. JAGUAR 16:18, 4 November 2015 (UTC)

@Jaguar: since you are the expander of the article, you should definitely be more familiar with the subject than me. I would not mind this appearing on April Fools Day. sst✈^discuss 16:26, 4 November 2015 (UTC)

I understand. I wasn't aware of a DYK rule stating that a work of fiction or a fictional character, the hook must involve the real world in some way. I can tell you that I've had a successful DYK in the past about a fictional skeleton protagonist in another video game, so I'm not sure how a skeleton is allowed on the main page and not a robot! If SSTflyer agrees then I wouldn't mind having this appear on April Fools Day as it might be a worthier date. JAGUAR 16:30, 4 November 2015 (UTC)

So where is the April Fools day hook? Nobody's even proposed one yet. If I don't see a viable April Fools day hook here shortly, I am just going to verify the two alts and be done with it. Gatoclass (talk) 10:17, 6 November 2015 (UTC)

Gatoclass, I'd say just go ahead and review the alts. Jaguar seems fine with them, SST hasn't come by, and I'm not going to try to create April Fools hooks unless someone really wants them. The Squirrel Conspiracy (talk) 23:27, 7 November 2015 (UTC)

I couldn't verify ALT2 but ALT1 looks okay. Gatoclass (talk) 08:19, 10 November 2015 (UTC)