Template:Did you know nominations/Louis René-Villermé

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Cwmhiraeth (talk) 05:29, 28 March 2017 (UTC)

Louis-René Villermé

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Louis-René Villermé

• ... that the start of social epidemiology and use of longterm studies of the working and living conditions of the European laboring class were incorporated into the study of medicine in Paris by Louis-René Villermé?

5x expanded by Faithkbrown (talk) and Mary Mark Ockerbloom (talk). Nominated by MPJ-DK (talk) at 22:04, 8 March 2017 (UTC).

• @Faithkbrown: I fixed the nomination page for you, it was not done correctly. Side note I only linked the article in the hook, I leave it to you to link anything else you want. Side note, the hook is too long it is 312 characters long, the limit is 200 so you will have to suggest a different, shorter hook.  MPJ-DK  22:07, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

(edit conflict) @Faithkbrown: Thanks for writing up this article! There are a couple of issues that need to be fixed for this to pass:

• The version of February 27 was 1287 characters, while the current version is 5565 characters. This is shorter than the 6435 characters it needs to be a 5x expansion. If you expand the article a little bit more, this criterion will be satisfied.
• The first and last paragraphs of the "Works" section lack citations. In general, the article should have more wikilinks in it.
• The hook is too long. It has 311 characters, which is longer than the maximum of 200 characters. The hook should also have wikilinks in it.

Thanks. John P. Sadowski (NIOSH) (talk) 22:16, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

• ALT1 ... that social epidemiology and studies of the working and living conditions of the European laboring class were incorporated into the study of medicine in Paris by Louis-René Villermé? This modification of the hook is within length, if the originator agrees with the content. Mary Mark Ockerbloom (talk) 02:03, 10 March 2017 (UTC)
• ALT1b ... that Louis-René Villermé (pictured) is considered a founder of social epidemiology for work proving the association between poverty and mortality in early industrial France? Source: [1]

The article is still going to need ~800 characters of further expansion to be eligible. A good hook might be based on the statement in the Julia source that "his major contributions to social epidemiology proved the association between poverty and mortality" in early industrial France. It's a nice topic and I'd like to see it on the main page, but it needs that extra ~2 paragraphs of expansion first. John P. Sadowski (NIOSH) (talk) 04:57, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

• I rather liked this topic, so I've added some text (DYK check now estimates prose size at 6936 characters) and citations. However, if the expansion begins with the Faithkbrown edit of 27 February 2017‎, then presumably that should be the date this was listed under, and the nomination should have occurred before 8 March 2017? The nomination came from @MPJ-DK:. I've argued for lenience on timing before for very new editors (Contributions show Faithkbrown started editing on 7 February 2017). I'm willing to do some more work on possible hooks for the article, if people are willing to be lenient on the nomination timing. Mary Mark Ockerbloom (talk) 16:29, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

• ALT2 ... that although liberal French economist and epidemiologist Louis-René Villermé generally opposed government intervention, he strongly supported it in the case of child labor ? Source: "In accord with his liberal beliefs, Villermé's solution ... he held would result from the economic growth uniquely afforded by a flourishing private sector free from government interference... Villermé nevertheless did part company with his liberal laissez-faire contemporaries on one issue: He strongly supported government prohibition of child labor." Mary Mark Ockerbloom (talk) 17:06, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

• All I did was fix the nomination template to help out a first timw DYK nominator so.I agree that some leniency on time is okay since it is a first time Nominator. MPJ-DK  17:40, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

Mary Mark, you have proven your awesomeness once again. Yes, two days after the putative deadline isn't a problem. It would be nice if a free picture could be found. Google found this one, which is unfortunately quite low-resolution. John P. Sadowski (NIOSH) (talk) 05:05, 12 March 2017 (UTC)

Found some appropriately licensed higher-resolution versions here. John P. Sadowski (NIOSH) (talk) 06:26, 12 March 2017 (UTC)

• Thank you! Very nice photos, love the additions to the page. ~~Mary —Preceding undated comment added 21:49, 12 March 2017‎ (UTC)

• John P. Sadowski (NIOSH), are you still reviewing this nomination? If so, what is left to be done, and can you give an icon for its current status? If not, please note that fact here, and I'll call for a new reviewer. Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 17:36, 24 March 2017 (UTC)

@Mary Mark Ockerbloom: Did you want to suggest more hooks, or should I continue with the current ones? John P. Sadowski (NIOSH) (talk) 00:21, 25 March 2017 (UTC)

• ALT2 is an easy hook to pass; the sources are cited. ALT1 may be more a more interesting hook, but there's a lot going on in it. The most relevant paragraph in the article is likely "Villermé was one of the pioneering advocates of hygienic reform and one of the first in France to relate hygienic reform with that of social reform. He conducted numerous early studies on social epidemiology, the health disparities among classes in correlation with wages and living conditions, using his knowledge as a physician to incorporate data analysis as well as social investigations of the working class. He even conducted studies that related mortality rates with income." The Julia source is behind a paywall, but the viewable summary info shown may be enough to confirm ALT1; there are other sources cited as well. I don't feel a need to suggest more :-) Mary Mark Ockerbloom (talk) 14:52, 25 March 2017 (UTC)

New and long enough, within policy, Earwig shows no copyvios, QPQ not needed. I've reworded ALT1 above; both that and ALT2 are approved. John P. Sadowski (NIOSH) (talk) 21:46, 27 March 2017 (UTC)