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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by MeegsC (talk) 15:45, 14 May 2021 (UTC)

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Jesús Soto Museum of Modern Art

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Jesús Soto Museum of Modern Art seen from courtyard garden
Jesús Soto Museum of Modern Art seen from courtyard garden

5x expanded by Kingsif (talk). Self-nominated at 18:30, 3 May 2021 (UTC).

Interesting museum, on few but fine sources, Spanish sources accepted AGF, no copyvio obvious. The image is licensed, but in small size perhaps less impressive than the one showing art in the garden, which would also save any trouble explaining that it displays art inside and outside. Thank you for the suggestions, - my choice would have been to say that the artist after whom it is named had it built in his hometown in Venezuela by a friend, or any bit of that, instead of that it was built fast. It's for Museum Day ;) - so should say something about what shown where why, not "built fast" (strike ALT3) nor what else the architect built (strike ALT4). I strike the original as way too long, and it also has no focus on museum. Suggestions for the article (not needed for approval, just to consider):
  • The article looks similar to the Spanish one, a translation (even if partial) should be credited on the talk, and it never hurts.
  • "by a variety of artists, including Soto" sounds to me like a variety of icecreams ;) - how about "By Soto and other artists"?
  • We should not "sandwich" text between an image and infobox, the image of the opening comes too soon, and should appear right. Perhaps get rid of the map in the infobox which is almost good for nothing?
  • "The III biennial "Pueblos en Resistencia" was held in the museum in 2019" - I may be not the only one who has no idea what III biennial means, please link or explain, and the specific title for the edition should probably be italic.
  • Design: the article is long enough, we don't have to describe the arrangement (around garden) twice within three sentences.
  • Art: "pieces with movement and dynamics" deserves a link.
  • Perhaps mention well-known Otero in the lead, which otherwise sounds as if only Soto?
  • Are there more external link, or refs in English? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:07, 4 May 2021 (UTC)
An Alejandro Otero sculpture at the Jesús Soto Museum of Modern Art
An Alejandro Otero sculpture at the Jesús Soto Museum of Modern Art
Thanks. It's hard to find sources since Soto has works of art in the (NY) Museum of Modern Art, and those take the top of all searches. The article is also freshly written after extensive copyvio removal, I didn't touch the Spanish article for fear it also contained copyvio. "III biennial"... well a biennial literally means "every two years" but is commonly used to mean an art expo (that happens once every two years), and III means third. I don't know much about that event so I can't help expand on it specifically. And I can propose a less interesting hook:
Kingsif (talk) 05:10, 5 May 2021 (UTC)
Thank you. For Google search, I have more success when searching - in addition to the name - to something specific. (working on Kammermusik (Hindemith) with both words awfully wide in meaning: the name of an player or dedicatee, for example, - for the museum it could be an artist on display) - Sorry, I didn't mean inside-out as a hook suggestion, just to take that image which shows it without word, - and thank you for that. It can be used for all (pictured) in hooks. - I understand the reluctance to rely on the Spanish article, and thank you for that as well. It was hard for me to tell. - I give my ideas a try, - can't review it though:
ALT6: ... that the Jesús Soto Museum of Modern Art (pictured), designed by architect Carlos Raúl Villanueva, was built in Ciudad Bolívar, Venezuela, after Jesús Soto donated artwork to his hometown?
Bolivar makes me think of Bolivia ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:47, 5 May 2021 (UTC)
Well if you think that's interesting, you may also be interested to know that Venezuela's full name is "Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela" - you can thank Simón Bolívar for both. Kingsif (talk) 13:52, 5 May 2021 (UTC)
I thank you. Dropping Venezuela:
ALT6a: ... that the Jesús Soto Museum of Modern Art (pictured), designed by architect Carlos Raúl Villanueva, was built in Ciudad Bolívar after Jesús Soto donated artwork to his hometown? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:19, 5 May 2021 (UTC)
My bet is that not everybody will know Jesús Soto, nor where he comes from, - that's your chance to tell people, rather than informing them that Roman villas were built around gardens, or builders from Spain worked in Venezuela, with little conection to the museum aspect. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:19, 5 May 2021 (UTC)
not everybody will know Jesús Soto, nor where he comes from, - that's your chance to tell people Honestly, I'd (much) rather not. I think this is where we work at cross purposes sometimes; having Spanish builders shipped over, being designed like a Roman villa, are unusual facts about the museum. To basically say that the museum is named after the artist in its name and is in the hometown of that artist (nothing unusual) is bland to me, and it's barely more than "this exists". And the hook isn't about Soto, if people want to find out about him, they can click through - but if the hook was about Soto, I wouldn't be saying (or approving) anything so simple as he is a Venezuelan artist; tell us something intriguing or unusual. That is DYK's purpose: if it's a subject people know about, they'll want to know more about a strange detail when they'd otherwise bypass the article, and if it's something they don't know about, they will be enticed to learn because of an unusual fact. Like an ice breaker. Kingsif (talk) 14:38, 5 May 2021 (UTC)
We will have to disagree. I find knowing that the museum is not named for someone rich who sponsored it to make his name bigger but an artist who gave for free much more interesting than that Spanish workers were called to work in Venezuela, which would not make me click because I'd think that now I knew it all. And that Roman villas were built around gardens, I knew before, and that it was taken as a good model, I also knew before. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:52, 5 May 2021 (UTC)
Seems so, but it looks like we're both assessing a general public response on what our own response would be so we're probably both at least a bit correct! What can I say, if a hook doesn't make the subject sound interesting, I wouldn't click through. Kingsif (talk) 14:58, 5 May 2021 (UTC)
exactly ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:02, 5 May 2021 (UTC)
Need a new reviewer for the ALT6 hooks (but they could look at all the hooks) Kingsif (talk) 14:40, 5 May 2021 (UTC)
not that like the hooks much but don't want to be in the way. ALT2 preferred. Unless someone wants to look at ALT6a. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:24, 13 May 2021 (UTC)
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