Template:Did you know nominations/Hypnotico
- The following discussion is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by Allen3 talk 11:25, 11 November 2012 (UTC)
Hypnotico
[edit]- ... that Akon met, signed and helped launch Lady Gaga's career after the two co-wrote "Hypnotico", a song that was later recorded by Jennifer Lopez?
- Reviewed: Megabalanus coccopoma
- Comment: 5x expansion (sandbox-mainspace)
Created/expanded by Status (talk), Hahc21 (talk). Nominated by Hahc21 (talk) at 01:02, 29 October 2012 (UTC)
Regarding the quoted sentence, "Akon met, signed and helped launch Lady Gaga's career", it is not at all clear that Claude Kelly is being quoted from a post he made on his Tumblr blog. The hook makes it look like only two people wrote the song, when a group was involved. More importantly, Kelly's blog post is contradicted by a number of other sources which say that Akon has overstated his influence on Gaga, that she was discovered (and first signed) by Vincent Herbert. If you change the hook the DYK nomination will be closer to happening, but the article needs more work than that.
The Kelly quote must be attributed to him, and it should be clear that Kelly is contradicted by others. Also, somebody new to the topic who is looking at the article, it seems like Akon did not co-write the song. That other guy, Aliaune Thiam, helped write it. Of course they are the same guy but in the lead section it is not clear. Also, Los Angeles does not need California to help form the wikilink. Otherwise, the length and date are okay, the paragraphs are cited, there appears to be no plagiarism except that Kelly's quote needs attribution. Binksternet (talk) 04:29, 1 November 2012 (UTC)
- ALT1: ... that Lady Gaga was one of the writers of Jennifer Lopez's song "Hypnotico", originally recorded by singer Tami Chynn as "Silly Heartbreakers"?
- I am proposing this alternate hook for consideration. — ΛΧΣ21™ 04:56, 1 November 2012 (UTC)
- Okay, the ALT1 hook is approved. I made a few edits to the article to address my other concerns above. Good to go! Binksternet (talk) 15:19, 1 November 2012 (UTC)
- Kelly specifically stated that Akon helped launch her career, he never stated that he was the mastermind behind her career. We all know it was a mix of Vincent Herbert, Akon and Jimmy Iovine. ALT1 sounds very awkward, and is not interesting at all. The song wasn't originally hers, she later recorded it. That's interesting. Zac (talk · contribs) 15:01, 2 November 2012 (UTC)
I'm sorry, I cannot endorse this new version after you took out my changes. The article now says—three times!—that Akon signed Lady Gaga. I see this as a coatrack attempt to give Akon more credit than he deserves, more than is given at the Lady Gaga article where she says Vince Herbert was the first person to sign her. Binksternet (talk) 15:14, 2 November 2012 (UTC)
- He did sign Lady Gaga. Nowhere does it say that Akon was the first person to sign her. It's sourced. Gaga is signed to Streamline/Kon Live/Interscope; three labels are involved with her releases. What does the Lady Gaga article have to do with this article, again? Zac (talk · contribs) 01:37, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
- P.S., for the record, if you are implying I'm trying to make it sound like Akon made Lady Gaga happen, that would be wrong, as I actually don't like Akon at all... I'm not making anything up (it's sourced!). Zac (talk · contribs) 01:39, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
- It's just too much emphasis. Kelly wrote it in his blog but it is not very important. I reduced the quote from three appearances to only one, but I was reverted. It seems like a coat rack to me. Binksternet (talk) 04:35, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
- It's seems quite important to him. It's relevant to the song, he credits it as helping launch his own career, and also that Akon signed Gaga after the two co-wrote the song together. There's no bias here. I request somebody else to review this DYK. Zac (talk · contribs) 18:55, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
- Whether it is or is not important to Kelly is not what we should focus on. There are living people involved here, so what we have to focus on are the most reliably sourced facts. Kelly's blog is just about the lowest form we can accept—it does not serve as a basis for facts, only as a basis for his opinion. What we need to watch out for is the dumping of facts for Kelly's opinion. The article with its three repeated Kelly quotes is really too much of a violation of WP:BLP in that it uses Kelly's blog to make it sound like only Akon was involved in making Lady Gaga a star. Too much emphasis on Akon! Yes, Akon was important to Lady Gaga's career, no doubt about it, but there were many hands helping her up. She says that Vince Herbert gave her the biggest start. Let's not forget this is an article about a song, not an article about Lady Gaga's career. Binksternet (talk) 00:47, 6 November 2012 (UTC)
- As the songwriter of the song, which the article is about, yes, it is rather important. For the millionth time, he does not say, nor does the article say, "Akon made Lady Gaga a star". It says Akon signed and helped launch her career, which he did. That is all. Statυs (talk) 02:47, 6 November 2012 (UTC)
- But the three identical, repeated quotes are two too many. This reduction from three to one is what I'm talking about. I'm not trying to remove the quote, just make it less prominent (since it is only Kelly's blog.) Binksternet (talk) 02:59, 6 November 2012 (UTC)
- As the songwriter of the song, which the article is about, yes, it is rather important. For the millionth time, he does not say, nor does the article say, "Akon made Lady Gaga a star". It says Akon signed and helped launch her career, which he did. That is all. Statυs (talk) 02:47, 6 November 2012 (UTC)
- Whether it is or is not important to Kelly is not what we should focus on. There are living people involved here, so what we have to focus on are the most reliably sourced facts. Kelly's blog is just about the lowest form we can accept—it does not serve as a basis for facts, only as a basis for his opinion. What we need to watch out for is the dumping of facts for Kelly's opinion. The article with its three repeated Kelly quotes is really too much of a violation of WP:BLP in that it uses Kelly's blog to make it sound like only Akon was involved in making Lady Gaga a star. Too much emphasis on Akon! Yes, Akon was important to Lady Gaga's career, no doubt about it, but there were many hands helping her up. She says that Vince Herbert gave her the biggest start. Let's not forget this is an article about a song, not an article about Lady Gaga's career. Binksternet (talk) 00:47, 6 November 2012 (UTC)
- It's seems quite important to him. It's relevant to the song, he credits it as helping launch his own career, and also that Akon signed Gaga after the two co-wrote the song together. There's no bias here. I request somebody else to review this DYK. Zac (talk · contribs) 18:55, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
- It's just too much emphasis. Kelly wrote it in his blog but it is not very important. I reduced the quote from three appearances to only one, but I was reverted. It seems like a coat rack to me. Binksternet (talk) 04:35, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
- P.S., for the record, if you are implying I'm trying to make it sound like Akon made Lady Gaga happen, that would be wrong, as I actually don't like Akon at all... I'm not making anything up (it's sourced!). Zac (talk · contribs) 01:39, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
- He did sign Lady Gaga. Nowhere does it say that Akon was the first person to sign her. It's sourced. Gaga is signed to Streamline/Kon Live/Interscope; three labels are involved with her releases. What does the Lady Gaga article have to do with this article, again? Zac (talk · contribs) 01:37, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
- Kelly specifically stated that Akon helped launch her career, he never stated that he was the mastermind behind her career. We all know it was a mix of Vincent Herbert, Akon and Jimmy Iovine. ALT1 sounds very awkward, and is not interesting at all. The song wasn't originally hers, she later recorded it. That's interesting. Zac (talk · contribs) 15:01, 2 November 2012 (UTC)
- Okay, the ALT1 hook is approved. I made a few edits to the article to address my other concerns above. Good to go! Binksternet (talk) 15:19, 1 November 2012 (UTC)
- I am proposing this alternate hook for consideration. — ΛΧΣ21™ 04:56, 1 November 2012 (UTC)
I have removed it from the lead. Statυs (talk) 09:40, 10 November 2012 (UTC)
- I tweaked the image caption so that it is not an Kelly quote. That leaves exactly one Kelly quote about Lady Gaga being signed by Akon. Does that work for you? Binksternet (talk) 09:45, 10 November 2012 (UTC)
I see you have removed the image. That is a more extreme solution, one I would not have resorted to. Binksternet (talk) 16:49, 10 November 2012 (UTC)
