Template:Did you know nominations/Elisabeth Munksgaard

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Cwmhiraeth (talk) 05:34, 1 September 2017 (UTC)

Elisabeth Munksgaard

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~~... that Danish historian Elisabeth Munksgaard discovered a Viking helmet 130 years after it was placed in a museum?~~ Munksgaard 1984, p. 87: "The object has for 130 years led an unnoticed existence in our public galleries until I stumbled on it two years ago. And it is quite true that the best finds are often made not in the field, but in the museums. This wing-shaped opject is not a saddle mounting, but the eyebrows and nose-guard of a helmet, made of iron and bronze."
- ALT1:~~... that Danish historian Elisabeth Munksgaard was ushered into retirement by an eleventh century king?~~ Jørgensen 1998, p. 6: ""she argued that several of the Mammen textile remains could be parallelled in details of the 1031 drawing of King Canute in the Liber Vitae. About the time of her writing this paper, the Draper's Guild of Copenhagen offered to fund the reconstruction of a costume based on the twin sources. It took two years and the united efforts of seven skilled craftspeople, a textile conservator and two textile archaeologists, but in May 1990, shortly before Elisabeth's retirement, the magnificent result was presented to the public: King Canute in all his splendour. It was a memorable event and a fine finale to Elisabeth Munksgaard's academic career. "

Reviewed: Diopatra cuprea
Comment: Created last month by me, expanded last week by @Ipigott: for #1day1woman. Might be a day late, but its a new article on a little-known historian with some significant contributions.

5x expanded by Usernameunique (talk) and Ipigott (talk). Nominated by Usernameunique (talk) at 10:14, 13 August 2017 (UTC).

Interesting life, on few but good sources, Danish and offline sources accepted AGF, no copyvio obvious. The ALT is a good idea, but a bit too quirky for my taste, - how about something mentioning splendid finale of her career, - "ushered to retirement" sounds as if the old king still had influence ;) - Article: How do you feel about an infobox? Can you integrate the first (lead) section in the chronology, and then summarize the whole article in the lead? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:52, 13 August 2017 (UTC)

Thanks @Gerda Arendt:! Added an infobox, and will work on revising the lead and chronology later today or tomorrow. Here are some alts.

ALT2: ~~... with "King Canute in all his splendour", the retirement ceremony for Danish historian Elisabeth Munksgaard validated a theory she had proposed a quarter-century earlier?~~

ALT3: ~~... that Danish historian Elisabeth Munksgaard was given a "splendid" retirement ceremony with a costumed eleventh-century king?~~

(technically "splendour" is in the source, not "splendid," but alteration is minimal)

Thank you for the ALTs. I prefer ALT3 as easier to understand. Strictly speaking, the nomination is late, but it's sufficient new information on a good subject for me to approve. When you integrate the lead narration and write more lead, you may get closer to a solid 5* expansion, or even make it. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:01, 13 August 2017 (UTC)

Pulling back from prep, and striking both ALT2 and ALT3. The facts for both hooks are nowhere in the article, a requirement for DYK, and one which both Gerda Arendt as approver and Alex Shih as promoter should have checked. (It's not enough to be in a source somewhere; it needs to be in the article and sourced.) Further, it is not okay to change a quoted word, and "splendid" cannot be quoted in ALT3 if that hook is eventually resurrected by adding material to the article. BlueMoonset (talk) 18:20, 13 August 2017 (UTC)

I am sorry, should have said in prose that the hooks are fine, provided the article was worked on, and I should not have used the symbol. Usernameunique, please write them below again, leaving "splendid" without quotation marks. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:57, 13 August 2017 (UTC)

Sorry for the problems @Gerda Arendt and BlueMoonset:. Hopefully this is closer to what you had in mind:

ALT4: ~~... that Danish historian Elisabeth Munksgaard was given a "fine finale" before her retirement with a costumed eleventh-century king?~~

ALT5: ... that retiring Danish historian Elisabeth Munksgaard was given a "fine finale" with a costumed eleventh-century king?

ALT6: ... that with "King Canute in all his splendour", the finale to Danish historian Elisabeth Munksgaard's career validated a theory she had proposed sixteen years earlier? --Usernameunique (talk) 23:13, 13 August 2017 (UTC)

ALT7: ... that after identifying an artefact that had been misidentified for 130 years, Danish historian Elisabeth Munksgaard declared that "the best finds are often made not in the field, but in the museums"?

Thanks for offering these! Will you take care of the lead question? ... and put the last ALT6 fact in the article more clearly? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:07, 14 August 2017 (UTC)

@Gerda Arendt: Added a paragraph on the Tjele helmet fragment to fully flesh out the material covered in the lead. Also added ALT7, above, and made the fact in ALT6 more directly stated in the article (also slightly reworded ALT6). These changes also take the article from approximately 538 characters to 3176, a 5.9* expansion. Please let me know if I should do anything else. Thanks! --Usernameunique (talk) 22:26, 15 August 2017 (UTC)

Thank you, much improved, and a solid expansion that even DYK check acknowledges! I'd still prefer the details about the "finale" in the body of the article, in chronology. ALT7 is interesting, but general and longish. My favourite is short ALT5, - two much theory in ALT6, and readers may feel they know it all. How is this:

ALT8: ... that Danish historian Elisabeth Munksgaard was given a "fine finale" to her career with a costumed eleventh-century king? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 06:47, 16 August 2017 (UTC)

Thanks Gerda Arendt, that looks good to me. (Made a minor grammatical change—"of her career" to "to her career"—and renamed ALT8, as I proposed ALT7 above.) Am I missing something about the "finale"? It is mentioned both in the lead ("... the 'finale' to her career was the installation in the museum of a replica of the king"), and in the body ("It was unveiled shortly before Munksgaard's retirement in 1990 ... in a 'fine finale' to her career"). --Usernameunique (talk) 08:15, 16 August 2017 (UTC)

ALT8 preferred, - I didn't read enough the last time ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:35, 16 August 2017 (UTC)