Template:Did you know nominations/Center for the Study of Extraterrestrial Intelligence

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Allen3 ^talk 14:44, 31 December 2014 (UTC)

Center for the Study of Extraterrestrial Intelligence

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~~... that Apollo 14 astronaut Ed Mitchell testified that UFOs exist at a congressional briefing organised by the Center for the Study of Extraterrestrial Intelligence?~~

Reviewed: Popular image of Native Americans in German speaking countries

Created by Panyd (talk). Self nominated at 21:54, 13 November 2014 (UTC).

To avoid the (presumably) unintentional implication that UFOs exist at congressional briefings, let me suggest

ALT1 ... that at a congressional briefing organised by the Center for the Study of Extraterrestrial Intelligence, Apollo 14 astronaut Ed Mitchell testified that UFOs exist?

However, I'm immediately striking both hooks because (a) "testimony" isn't given at Congressional "briefings" staged by random unofficial organizations, and (b) the article doesn't say anything about Mitchell giving any such "testimony". The article has a slight WP:FRINGEy whiff to it (though I may be imagining that). EEng (talk) 23:11, 13 November 2014 (UTC)

Oh, Mr Greer is well known on the fringes, but he's got enough outside coverage, I feel, to warrant inclusion in the sane-people-club. Of course I would say that. In-depth coverage in The Independent and the Times etc. - I say that puts him in the mainstream's eye.

As for Mr Mitchell, I don't know what you'd call his statements in that case. He most certainly did, and continuously has, made statements to the effect that UFOs are real. As you can see [[1]], here (brought to you by crazy people, and then out of his own mouth, on camera, here and here. Give me a second on the briefing. Panyd^{The muffin is not subtle} 00:27, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

Nope, apparently the Independent haven't publicly published their back-catalogue, and I've lost my Lexis password for the evening. Suffice to say, I think verification in a major mainstream newspaper qualifies as solid ground. Panyd^{The muffin is not subtle} 00:33, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

Except in certain specialized religious contexts, "testimony" means sworn statements in an official setting. The phrase "testified at a congressional briefing" makes it sound like he was testifying at a congressional hearing, which he wasn't. This was a publicity stunt to which congressmen were invited -- did any show up? EEng (talk) 00:45, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

I believe ~30 showed up. They definitely didn't get the hearing they demanded afterwards. They were less than impressed. What would you call it? Statement? I'm unsure of myself. Panyd^{The muffin is not subtle} 01:18, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

I think any use of "congressional" will mislead readers as to the true context. Also, I think it needs to be clarified just what Mitchell said. If he said, "There certainly have been objects in the sky we've been unable to identify before they got away from us or just disappeared", that's one thing -- if he said, "I think intelligent beings from beyond earth have visited us", that's quite another. EEng (talk) 01:25, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

FINALLY found my Lexis login. The exact quote from the article is: In April last year, together with former Apollo 14 astronaut Ed Mitchell, he briefed members of the US Congress, putting forwards the testimony of a number of witnesses regarding UFOs and extra-terrestrials. - So what wording would be most appropriate to go with this? Panyd^{The muffin is not subtle} 11:08, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

Also also (I'll stop in a minute I swear) - the press conference they put together was in 2001. As far as I'm aware, nobody in any position of power showed up to that one, but it was a very different kettle of fish. Panyd^{The muffin is not subtle} 11:35, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

Also, from another source: Edgar Mitchell, ScD, Captain USN (ret.) Lunar Module Pilot, Apollo 14 and the Sixth man on the moon has written in a forward to Friedmans Flying Saucers and Science œIrrespective of how one views the pros and cons of 60 years of official denial of alien presence on and around our planet, the truth has slowly seeped out into public awareness and acceptance, due in part to many of the inane stories and contradictions offered by official sources. p.12 - So it's definitely aliens. Panyd^{The muffin is not subtle} 11:09, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

Then I recommend "told a group of US Congressmen" or something. Pure lunacy, of course. EEng (talk) 18:53, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

Bit of a shame to know that even astronauts can get sucked into this sort of thing. Still! How about ALT2 ... that Apollo 14 astronaut Ed Mitchell told a group of congressmen that aliens exist, at an event organised by the Center for the Study of Extraterrestrial Intelligence?

Do you think I should change anything in the article? I'm not very good at precision with regards to wording and I don't want to mislead. Panyd^{The muffin is not subtle} 19:10, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

I think ALT2 is fine. My further advice is that you change the word "testimony" in the article to "statements" or some such. EEng (talk) 19:37, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

I changed some words. Added some doubt to one statement, because although secondary sources are a-ok with Greer's account of a meeting, the CIA has never commented on it as far as I can tell. Does that mean I can have a nice tick? Panyd^{The muffin is not subtle} 19:46, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

- This is my equivalent of staring into the DYK community with puppy-like eyes and possibly whining slightly. Panyd^{The muffin is not subtle} 15:54, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

New article, spun out of a redirect on the same day as the nom. Long enough. Having gone through the comments above, I think it reads neutrally. I don't have access to those old newspaper references so I'm AGF on the sourcing. QPQ done. ALT2 is good to go. Fuebaey (talk) 17:04, 30 December 2014 (UTC)

Comment. Nima Baghaei, the creator of the article in question, was not notified of this Did you know nomination because the user has not edited in 1 year or more. (contribs) Did I make an error? Report it to my owner! —Cerabot (talk) 12:04, 30 December 2014 (UTC)