Template:Did you know nominations/Buchanan's Station
- The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by Bruxton (talk) 22:20, 2 April 2023 (UTC)
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Buchanan's Station
- ALT0
... that an overloaded blunderbuss that exploded when fired was mistaken for a canon and scared the 300+ Indian attackers at Buchanan's Station (pictured), into retreat?Source: Slate, Mike; Buchanan's Station : The battle that saved the Cumberland settlements; WebPage; Nashville Historical Newsletter online; retrieved December 2022 - ALT1:
... that 15-20 sharpshooters at Buchanan's Station (pictured), withstood an attack by a Native American confederation of over 300 warriors, including Tecumseh?Source: Slate, Mike; Buchanan's Station : The battle that saved the Cumberland settlements; WebPage; Nashville Historical Newsletter online; retrieved December 2022
- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Loophonium
- Comment: QPQ Done
Created by GenQuest (talk). Self-nominated at 21:36, 3 January 2023 (UTC).
Background discussion
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Overall: Article was new enough at nomination, is long enough, is well source, and is neutral. In terms of plagiarism - there is some close phrasing in the image caption that earwig picked up - it would be good if that could change. Additionally, the image caption is too long for a DYK, so please could it be shortened? Lajmmoore (talk) 14:04, 28 January 2023 (UTC)
Thanks to Hawkeye7 and Hog Farm for reviewing, and to GenQuest for updating per comments. I would like to make ALT1 work somehow, but the issue I'm having is that the source says "a mere fifteen sharpshooters" in the body text while acknowledging in the footnote that other sources say as many as twenty – would it be possible to address this detail somehow in the article either with an explanatory endnote and/or finding and adding one of the other sources that says 20? The other issue I had was that I wasn't able to verify that Talitoskee was leading – it feels like maybe one of your sources accidentally got deleted or dropped – so could you please go through that section and fix as well? Cielquiparle (talk) 16:03, 5 February 2023 (UTC)
References
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- Proposing new ALT hooks:
- ALT2: ... that 15 gunmen repelled an attack by hundreds of Chickamauga Cherokee, Creek, and Shawnee warriors during the Battle of Buchanan’s Station?
- ALT3: ... that Sally Buchanan was called “the greatest heroine of the West” for distributing ammunition during the Battle of Buchanan’s Station?
- ALT4: ... that Sally Buchanan was said to have carried bullets in her apron and distributed whiskey while singing during the Battle of Buchanan's Station?
- ALT4a: ... that a pregnant Sally Buchanan was said to have carried bullets in her apron and distributed whiskey while singing during the Battle of Buchanan's Station?
- Needs a full review in light of significant changes to the article, plus new ALT hooks. Hooks might need workshopping, etc., but article itself is now in much better shape. Cielquiparle (talk) 18:44, 25 March 2023 (UTC)
- Proposing new ALT hooks:
I'll take on the re-review here. Skimmed the article content, which looks fine (although I'd recommend avoiding the use of "Indian" and going with "Native American" instead). Hooks look fine from a first glance. QPQ is done. My primary concern at the moment is that HMDB is not a reliable source. A bit more to follow - will perform some basic source-text and copyvio checks this evening. Hog Farm Talk 17:02, 28 March 2023 (UTC)
- Thanks Hog Farm. I am the one who swapped in HMDB, mainly to swap this blogspot photo as a source, which seemed far worse. The point is that the historical marker itself was being referenced as a source, and as we all know, they aren't always correct, so I'll search for a better source and replace it. I think I've now mostly removed the few instances of Indian but left Northwest Indian Wars. Cielquiparle (talk) 17:30, 28 March 2023 (UTC)
- @GenQuest and Hog Farm: I have now removed the entire section referring to the Buchanan Log House, which had nothing to do with Buchanan's Station. The Buchanan Log House, referred to in the historical marker, was built by James Buchanan, son of Archibald and Agnes Buchanan of Clover Bottom – not Major John Buchanan of Buchanan's Station. See the Buchanan Log House website under "Myths & Mysteries". Cielquiparle (talk) 18:09, 28 March 2023 (UTC)
- @GenQuest and Cielquiparle: - I'm having some trouble figuring out how the citations align. "John Buchanan first came to the Washington District in early 1780, settling in the vicinity of Fort Nashboro. Buchanan left Fort Nashboro with a large party in the spring of 1784 [...] . It was situated between Mill Creek and what later became the Buchanan Mill Road" is apparently sourced to "Buchanan’s Station and Cemetery; WebPage; Nashville Historical Newsletter online; retrieved December 2022", but I'm not finding any reference to the Washington District, Fort Nashboro, or Buchanan Mill Road on that webpage? I'm not entirely for sure what DYK's stance on source-text integrity is, but after WP:DCGAR I've been trying to spot-check everything I review. Pinging Theleekycauldron as the resident rules expert. Hog Farm Talk 01:39, 29 March 2023 (UTC)
- @Hog Farm: all of the facts mentioned in the hook need to be sourced at the end of the sentence in their respective places in (at least one if there are multiple) the bolded article – that sourcing needs to be checked and verified to make sure the hook is accurate. By all means, please get any discrepancies cleared up :) theleekycauldron (talk • contribs) (she/her) 05:05, 29 March 2023 (UTC)
- I will fix it. I was trying not to rewrite the entire article, so I focused on the Battle section and added "Early hostilities" which already seemed like a lot, but given all the issues, I can fix the rest too. Cielquiparle (talk) 05:18, 29 March 2023 (UTC)
- Cielquiparle, please ping me when you're ready for me to pick the review back up. Hog Farm Talk 22:31, 30 March 2023 (UTC)
- @Hog Farm: Ready, thanks. Cielquiparle (talk) 10:03, 31 March 2023 (UTC)
- Cielquiparle, please ping me when you're ready for me to pick the review back up. Hog Farm Talk 22:31, 30 March 2023 (UTC)
- I will fix it. I was trying not to rewrite the entire article, so I focused on the Battle section and added "Early hostilities" which already seemed like a lot, but given all the issues, I can fix the rest too. Cielquiparle (talk) 05:18, 29 March 2023 (UTC)
- @Hog Farm: all of the facts mentioned in the hook need to be sourced at the end of the sentence in their respective places in (at least one if there are multiple) the bolded article – that sourcing needs to be checked and verified to make sure the hook is accurate. By all means, please get any discrepancies cleared up :) theleekycauldron (talk • contribs) (she/her) 05:05, 29 March 2023 (UTC)
- @GenQuest and Cielquiparle: - I'm having some trouble figuring out how the citations align. "John Buchanan first came to the Washington District in early 1780, settling in the vicinity of Fort Nashboro. Buchanan left Fort Nashboro with a large party in the spring of 1784 [...] . It was situated between Mill Creek and what later became the Buchanan Mill Road" is apparently sourced to "Buchanan’s Station and Cemetery; WebPage; Nashville Historical Newsletter online; retrieved December 2022", but I'm not finding any reference to the Washington District, Fort Nashboro, or Buchanan Mill Road on that webpage? I'm not entirely for sure what DYK's stance on source-text integrity is, but after WP:DCGAR I've been trying to spot-check everything I review. Pinging Theleekycauldron as the resident rules expert. Hog Farm Talk 01:39, 29 March 2023 (UTC)
- @GenQuest and Hog Farm: I have now removed the entire section referring to the Buchanan Log House, which had nothing to do with Buchanan's Station. The Buchanan Log House, referred to in the historical marker, was built by James Buchanan, son of Archibald and Agnes Buchanan of Clover Bottom – not Major John Buchanan of Buchanan's Station. See the Buchanan Log House website under "Myths & Mysteries". Cielquiparle (talk) 18:09, 28 March 2023 (UTC)
Checked sources I could access and they came up clean this time. I do not believe this should run as an image hook, as I'm not sold on the CC 4.0 licensing. Per Commons:Commons:Hirtle chart, assuming the photograph was never formally published, since we don't seem to know the photographer, we couldn't use it until 120 years after creation. If we can find an example of publishing before 1977 without a copyright notice, we're good to go, or if it was published before 1963 with a non-renewed copyright notice. There's a few other edge cases, but it's going to take more research than this is probably worth to run the image on the main page, so I'd advise that we don't run this as an image hook. Hog Farm Talk 15:58, 1 April 2023 (UTC)
- Thanks Hog Farm. Note to promoter: If you choose ALT3, ALT4, or ALT4a, please publish it as a double hook with Sally Buchanan (which I've gone back and bolded). The nomination for that one is here: Template:Did you know nominations/Sally Buchanan. (But I have no problem with simply withdrawing that other nomination, if you choose ALT2.) Cielquiparle (talk) 18:29, 1 April 2023 (UTC)
- 45.7% at earwig is on the high side, but it looks like titles and quotes. Bruxton (talk) 22:14, 2 April 2023 (UTC)