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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Cwmhiraeth (talk) 05:20, 9 June 2017 (UTC)

DYK toolbox

Andreas Schager

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As Siegfried in Berlin in 2016
As Siegfried in Berlin in 2016
  • Reviewed: Mariano Gagnon
  • Comment: I don't know where to add "according to a critic from Vienna" to the "sensation", but it was pretty much according to everyone in the audience ;)

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 14:54, 7 May 2017 (UTC).

  • The article is long enough and new enough with no copyright violations. Everything, including the hook, is reliably sourced. I did the best I could to verify the German sources with an online translator, but there is only so much those tools can do. However, I trust that the nominator did an adequate job with those sources. The QPQ is complete and the image is free use. SL93 (talk) 01:21, 21 May 2017 (UTC)
  • I keep coming by to promote this to an image spot, but I don't find the hook sharp, as it's mentioning too many details (possibly because the image depicts him as Siegfried and not as Tristan) and glosses over the "sensation" part. May I suggest:
  • ALT1: ... that Andreas Schager's (pictured in 2013) performance in Wagner's Tristan und Isolde in Minden was called a "sensation" by a critic from Vienna?
  • I also suggest that the image be cropped just to show the singer. Yoninah (talk) 18:23, 1 June 2017 (UTC)
Well, I am certainly not sensationalist, but this one (in my life!) was a sensation as Tristan in a small house, and still as Siegfried in a big house a few years later. The pictured performance is in Berlin, and of course we could stick to that one, but for my fond memory of the other. "Vienna", however, is not important. The critic devoted a long paragraph to his performance, but nothing but "sensation" is snappy enough for the DYK purpose, and most of it is hard to translate. It is repeated in this Berlin headline: "Andreas Schager a sensational Siegfried at Staatsoper Berlin"[1]. "This headline is too long: "A Good Tenor Is Hard To Find, Let Alone One Who Can Handle Wagner" I hope that you see the tendency, - it's not only one critic. We can shorten the hook by "Parsifal in Bayreuth", but that may be the part most readers will know. Perhaps they also know that the first Tristan ever died after a few performances. It's one of the most stressful parts a tenor can sing, and most can't.
ALT2: ... that Andreas Schager was convincing when he first performed Wagner's Tristan in Minden, and went on to Siegfried at the Staatsoper Berlin (pictured)?
ALT3: ... that Andreas Schager performed Wagner's Tristan first in Minden, called a sensation, and went on to Siegfried at the Staatsoper Berlin (pictured)? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:01, 1 June 2017 (UTC)
yes - the caption will clarify that it is the Berlin Siegfried pictured. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:21, 1 June 2017 (UTC)
  • @Gerda Arendt: could you add the "sensational" Siegfried fact to the article? Yoninah (talk) 19:30, 1 June 2017 (UTC)
I wasn't sure if it's a reliable source, - are you? (I could hopefully quote from a review.) - I am sure this is, but not everybody is. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:23, 1 June 2017 (UTC)
  • OK, I added the referenced information you suggested about him singing from the wings. It certainly makes a hookier hook! Would you like to propose it, or should I? Yoninah (talk) 21:11, 1 June 2017 (UTC)

Thank you. Perhaps add the roaring applause? - Try a hook, but it will be tricky to include the image because that is clearly the Götterdämmerung-Siegfried, - also he was in his private clothes doing the stunt ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:54, 1 June 2017 (UTC)

As Siegfried in Berlin
As Siegfried in Berlin
  • ALT4: ... that when the lead tenor failed to show up for Act I of Siegfried in Berlin in 2013, Andreas Schager (pictured) sang the part from the wings while an assistant director appeared on stage in costume played the part on stage? Yoninah (talk) 13:29, 2 June 2017 (UTC)
Thanks for the offer, but let's perhaps not blame the poor missing one by name on the Main page. Singing with someone else acting is not unusual, and add nothing to the singer, while two giants of conducting do, also Mozart and Wagner (even if not mentioned by name) say something about versatility:
ALT5: ... that tenor Andreas Schager (pictured on stage) interrupted The Magic Flute with Simon Rattle to step in on short notice as Siegfried for Daniel Barenboim?
ALT6: ... that tenor Andreas Schager (pictured on stage) interrupted The Magic Flute with Simon Rattle to step in as Siegfried for Daniel Barenboim when the scheduled singer was missing 20 minutes before the performance?
I guess ALT6 is too long. I am still sure that Tristan is the more interesting and mature part ("Siegfried, very young, very handsome, very brave, very stupid", see Anna Russell), but also - sadly - that something like this may awake more interest ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:38, 2 June 2017 (UTC)
But he didn't "interrupt" his performance; he was waiting for it to happen. Personally, I think you are analyzing the hook in-depth because you are so familiar with opera, but for novices like me, ALT4 (without identifying the lead tenor) is very hooky. But we can wrap up this nomination very easily by just going with ALT2a (or ALT3, if you add the ref to the article). Yoninah (talk) 15:18, 2 June 2017 (UTC)
It doesn't say "performance of the Magic Flute", - he was in rehearsal - which he interrupted - and was back in time for the performance, but that's again too much for a hook. I don't think the DYK critics will accept the ALT3a critic as reliable enough. ALT3 is fine with me. As we dropped Bayreuth, we'd have room for The Proms and La Scala, how is that.
ALT7: ... that Andreas Schager was called a "sensation" when he first performed Wagner's Tristan in Minden, and went on to Siegfried (pictured) at the Staatsoper Berlin, La Scala, and The Proms? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:29, 2 June 2017 (UTC)
  • YES! Hook refs verified/AGF and cited inline. Rest of review per SL93. ALT7 good to go. Yoninah (talk) 15:47, 2 June 2017 (UTC)
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