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Template:Did you know nominations/1981 Iraqi embassy bombing

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The following discussion is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Allen3 talk 12:39, 6 February 2014 (UTC)

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1981 Iraqi embassy bombing

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Created/expanded by Plot Spoiler (talk). Self nominated at 22:47, 11 December 2013 (UTC).

  • I have found this
  • No QPQ made.
  • There is some close paraphrasing problem with these sentences "On December 15, 1981, a suicide bomber drove a car loaded with about 100 kilograms of explosives into the compound of Iraq's embassy in Beirut and detonated. The blast leveled the embassy, killing 61 people and injuring 110 others." (The Business of Martyrdom). Also I believe these sentences should be in-lined sourcesd (not just at the end of the paragraph). In addition, I don't know quite where the number 110 injured comes from as the "Martyrdom" and most other sources say "more than 100!. AP says 110, but they have got the numbers of dead all wrong.
  • Article long and new enough.
  • Hook is interesting and in accordance with in-line cited sources. It is a bit too long and I think it could be shorted to simply saying "considered the first modern suicide bombing", leaving out the examples of other suicide bombings that would follow.
  • Iselilja (talk) 10:31, 13 December 2013 (UTC)
  • Thanks for the careful review Iselilja. I think I've addressed all your concerns now. Plot Spoiler (talk) 20:05, 14 December 2013 (UTC)
Hello, that's fine. Though, there are still some close paraphrasing issues in the "Bombing" section, in my opinion.
  • The article's first sentence says: "On December 15, 1981, a suicide bomber drove a car loaded with about 100 kilograms of explosives into the compound of Iraq's embassy in Beirut and detonated."
  • The Business of Martyrdom books says: "On December 15, 1981, a suicide bomber drove a car packed with explosives into the compound of Iraq's embassy in Beirut. The driver detonated the explosives"
  • I think you need to rewrite the sentence somewhat. - I know it's not always easy to change the words and still keep the story accurate, but it needs to be done according to the policy on close paraphrasing. Iselilja (talk) 20:28, 14 December 2013 (UTC)
  • Good call. Hopefully this addresses those concerns[1]. Plot Spoiler (talk) 20:42, 14 December 2013 (UTC)
Thank you. I am not normally so nitpicking about close paraphrasing, but the established standard for what is acceptable seems to be pretty strict here at DYK. Approving ALT1 as hook. Very interesting hook, imo.
  • I have pulled this hook from prep because it appears there are other candidates for the title of "first modern suicide bombing.[2][3] A new hook may need to be found. Gatoclass (talk) 13:24, 15 December 2013 (UTC)
  • There are always going to be other candidates for these "first" titles of all sorts of historical incidents. Their appears to be a strong consensus though that this attack initiated the modern tactic of suicide bombing. Also, why I used the term "considered". Plot Spoiler (talk) 15:31, 15 December 2013 (UTC)
You only supplied three sources and I already found several that say otherwise, so I'm not seeing a "strong consensus". At the very least, you would probably have to change the hook from "considered" to "considered by some". I will do a more thorough search of sources tomorrow, but in the meantime you may want to consider an alternative hook. Gatoclass (talk) 15:46, 15 December 2013 (UTC)

I'll send this over to someone else to review. Iselilja (talk) 13:32, 15 December 2013 (UTC)

Checking with Gatoclass to see what the results were from his search; have struck both hooks because it seems clear that "considered" by itself is not adequately supported by a wide range of sources. Assuming a revised (or completely new) hook is needed, that's the next step; after that, we can try for a new reviewer. BlueMoonset (talk) 18:29, 3 January 2014 (UTC)
I was expecting PlotSpoiler to respond to my last post, but since he has not done so, I can probably resuscitate this nom by adding a little info to the article myself and tweaking one of the previously proposed hooks, but obviously after doing so I will no longer be able to approve the nom myself. Gatoclass (talk) 06:57, 10 January 2014 (UTC)
I still think the original hook is good. I provided three unique sources saying it was considered the first modern suicide bombing. Plot Spoiler (talk) 18:36, 12 January 2014 (UTC)
Plot Spoiler, the original hook is not going to pass as is. It's time to move on. You were offered "considered by some", or asked to come up with a new hook. If you're unwilling to do either, then we either wait for Gatoclass to add to the article and tweak an earlier hook, or close the nomination altogether. BlueMoonset (talk) 21:07, 12 January 2014 (UTC)
I'm quite satisfied with "considered by some" if that would work. Plot Spoiler (talk) 00:02, 13 January 2014 (UTC)
  • Article is new enough, long enough, well referenced, no close paraphrasing seen. ALT1 hook refs verified and cited inline. QPQ done. ALT1 good to go. Yoninah (talk) 21:57, 5 February 2014 (UTC)
  • Did you mean ALT2 (the new hook proposed by Gatoclass)? --Orlady (talk) 04:36, 6 February 2014 (UTC)
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