Talk:Yamanami Keisuke

Yamanami's reason to escape

There are some speculations on Yamanami's reason to escape the Shinsengumi, it is still a mystery. It's important not to confuse fiction with historical data, or take a speculation to be a fact. Seven 06:11, 29 March 2006 (UTC)

In Shinsengumi : the Shogun's Last Samurai Corps by Romulus Hillsborough there is something mentioned about Yamanami's escape. The following story is quoted from this book.

The trouble with Yamanami seems to have originated over a disagreement in philosophy, though Shimosawa also cites a bitter rivalry with the other vice commander, Hijikata Toshizo. Yamanami was apparently vexed over the lately inflated self-importance of Kondo and Hijikata. He felt that they had forgotten the original purpose for which the members of the Shieikan had enlisted in the "loyal and patriotic" corps. The unyielding will to power that had lately consumed his erstwhile friends had diminished their former patriotic ideals. According to most sources, Yamanami's vexation was exacerbated sometime early in 1865, when Kondo and Hijikata, unhappy with their cramped headquarters at Mibu, decided to move to a more spacious location at Nishihonganji Temple in the southwest of the city. The temple priests were perplexed over the decision. Their attempts to rebuff the Shinsengumi were ignored by Kondo and Hijikata. Yamanami objected to what he considered coercion of Buddhist priests. "Certainly there are many other suitable places, " he admonished Kondo, and suggested that his commander reconsider. But his commander would not reconsider, and Yamanami resolved to pay the ultimate price. He composed a farewell letter explaining the reasons he could no longer, in good conscience, risk his life under Kondo's command. Then he defected.

Yamanami fled to the town of Otsu, about seven miles east of Kyoto on Lake Biwa. Although sources differ in the details of subsequent events, according to both Nagakura and Shimosawa, Kondo sent Okita to retrieve Yamanami. This was no easy task. For all of Okita's skill with a sword, Yamanami himself was an expert in the Hokushin Itto style. He was also proficient in jujutsu. That Okita apprehended him without a struggle seems to indicate that Yamanami resigned to this fate. Upon his return to Mibu, he was summoned to an assembly of Shinsengumi leaders in the Maekawa house.

Desertion," Kondo said, breaking an austere silence,"is prohibited by Shinsengumi regulations." Kondo spoke solemnly as he ordered Yamanami to commit seppuku, a propensity to kill. Yamanami calmly expressed his apprecation and happiness at being called upon to perform this most honorable task for a samurai. He then excused himself momentarily. When he returned to the room he had changed into formal attire. He placed a mat over the clean tatami floor so as not to soil it with his blood. He sat on the mat, assumed the formal position, and places his short sword in front of himself. He exchanged ceremonious farewell cups of water with them and courteously delivered his farewell speech. He asked Okita Soji to serve as his second, instructing the genius swordsman not to "lower your sword until I give the word." Then he gently took up his short sword and plunged it into his lower abdomen. After slicing the blade across in one straight line, he fell forward with a final thrust of energy, earning, according to Nagakura, "Kondo's praise for the splendidness" by which he performed this ultimate task.'

"Head Coach"

"塾頭" (Jukutou) is the "School Head," not one of the Senior Instructors (師範.)

Okita became the 塾頭 (Head Coach) at the Shieikan in 1861. Since Hijikata was officially enrolled at the Tennen Rishin Ryu school in 1859 and Yamanami was enrolled in 1860, they could only be Assistant Instructors (師範代). As for Inoue, he did have his "family business" (farming) to attend to and I believe he usually coached at the Tennen Rishin Ryu's dojos in Hino, rather than at the Shieikan. Seven 06:27, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

Yamanami Keisuke's name

I wasn't going to at first, but considering I had to manually correct this whole article and go to numerous other Shinsengumi articles to correct those, I felt it needs documentation on this talk page.

An IP editor with 3 different IPs, changed Yamanami's name to "Sannan" and claimed there was consensus to do so on the JapanWiki version of this page. I checked it out and the "consenus" was a single editor. Further, the ip editor claims "sannan" is widely accepted, I strongly beg to differ. In numerous texts, bios, and cultural references, the pronunciation of his name is presented as Yamanami. The ip editor's claim is un-sourced, therefore OR, and if they got it from Hakuouki, that is not a RS. In PMK, I think I recall him being called "sannan" as a nickname, but he was still Yamanami. This was a real person, not an anime character, RS use "Yamanami." I will assume good faith, but keep in mind consensus also depends upon sources, not just one person that speaks Japanese. When it comes to names especially, Japanese people get kanji pronunciations confused/ argue about them often, sometimes dialects and/or time period lead to different common usages. Next time before making such a major change, ask on the talk page first. Consensus must be achieved on each respective version of wiki, separately...but one person is definitely not consensus. Take care. Persistent Corvid (talk) 05:52, 26 April 2018 (UTC)