Talk:Wabasca, Alberta

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This article has previously been nominated to be moved. Please review the prior discussions if you are considering re-nomination.

Discussions:

Moved, 2 May 2011, from Wabasca-Desmarais, Alberta to Wabasca, Alberta, see discussion.
Not moved, 19 October 2023, from Wabasca, Alberta to Wabasca-Desmarais, see discussion.

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page moved. Vegaswikian (talk) 19:48, 9 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Wabasca-Desmarais, Alberta → Wabasca, Alberta – The official name of this community is the Hamlet of Wabasca according to its administrating municipality (the Municipal District (M.D.) of Opportunity No. 17), the Province of Alberta (Alberta Municipal Affairs), and Statistics Canada.

Municipal District supporting links – [1], [2], [3], [4]
Municipal Affairs supporting links – [5], [6]
Statistics Canada supporting link – [7]

The Hamlet of Wabasca-Desmarais was once the former official name of the community, as confirmed by two past ministerial orders in 1978 and 1988.
Based on the supporting links above, it appears the M.D. has been using the current official name of Wabasca since at least 2002, with Alberta Municipal Affairs recognizing it sometime between 2008 and 2009. Hwy43 (talk) 04:35, 2 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Support- Why even open it for discussion? It seems clear it is the official name. I'm just wondering where did Desmarais come from, was it two communities merging? 117Avenue (talk) 06:28, 2 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Considered not opening, but decided to open out of courtesy if any locals are watching the article that may be sensitive to the current official name without Desmarais. The former name still seems to be used by some. Google Maps shows that Alberta Transportation still uses the former name on way-finding signage at the intersections of Hwy 88 and Hwy 754.
If I recall correctly, Wabasca and Desmarais were separate communities, one on each lake, where Wabasca was a settlement while Desmarais was a mission. Hwy43 (talk) 06:47, 2 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Requested move 19 October 2023

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Not moved (non-admin closure) BegbertBiggs (talk) 22:09, 5 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Wabasca, Alberta → Wabasca-Desmarais – Last discussed in 2011. Today in 2023, both the M. D. of Opportunity and the Canadian census use Wabasca-Desmarais. This would appear to be the better title; Wabasca, Alberta can remain a primary redirect. 162 etc. (talk) 14:13, 19 October 2023 (UTC) — Relisting. estar8806 (talk) ★ 17:57, 27 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Note: WikiProject Canada has been notified of this discussion. estar8806 (talk) ★ 17:58, 27 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose: Whomever authored that particular webpage for the MD of Opportunity is seemingly unaware that the official name of the community is the Hamlet of Wabasca. This is confirmed in at least four official bylaws - the hamlet boundary bylaw, the Hamlet of Wabasca Area Structure Plan (ASP), the MD’s Land Use Bylaw (LUB) (do a word searches for "Wabasca" and "Desmarais"), and the MD’s Municipal Development Plan (MDP) (do the same word searches). In fact, the 2020 MDP unambiguously confirms that "Wabasca-Desmarais" is the former name of the Hamlet of Wabasca (see first paragraph in Section 6.2 on PDF page 32 of 63). The usages of "Wabasca-Desmarais" in the ASP are in reference to the Wabasca-Desmarais Healthcare Centre/Hospital and in the url of a blog website in footnotes.

The fact that the text on the MD community webpage provided by the proposer uses "Wabasca-Desmarais", "Wabasca/Desmarais", and "Wabasca" interchangeably provides little confidence what the actual name of the community is and doesn’t verify that "Wabasca" has been renamed back to "Wabasca-Desmarais", especially coupled with the evidence above.

As for the Statistics Canada link, StatCan is not the definitive source for the name of the hamlet. They often use incorrect or old names long after they are changed. In fact, I informed them of 14 name errors in advance of the 2021 census and they corrected them (e.g., "Pigeon Mountain" was renamed as "Dead Man's Flats" in the 1980s but persisted under its old name at StatCan for 30 years through to the 2016 census). Rather, the Government of Alberta is the definitive source for hamlet names. The 2023 edition of the annual Municipal Codes publication is the reliable, secondary source that verifies the hamlet’s name continues to be "Wabasca", which is consistent with all the bylaws referenced above.

Back the the MD's website, the maps webpage refers to the community as "Wabasca" in all four map links and never as "Wabasca-Desmarais". Wabasca-Desmarais, as the former community name, should simply redirect to Wabasca, Alberta. Cheers, Hwy43 (talk) 01:51, 28 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@162 etc.: at the time I suggested the name changes to StatCan, I also indicated that the Wabasca designated place didn’t match the official hamlet boundary. Thus I recommended that it be expanded to match actual boundaries, which meant merging the adjacent Desmarais designated place and the adjacent Desmarais census subdivision into the revised Wabasca designated place. StatCan also processed this, but I was silent on what the ultimate final name of the merged and expanded designated place should be. StatCan then erroneously hyphenated the names of the two original designated places together, making it appear like the community’s name was reverted back to its former name. As evident from the above, the reversion back to the former name is not the case. I read somewhere at StatCan that when it merges two geographies into one, its policy is to merge the names into a new hyphenated name. I strongly suspect that is what has happened here. In preparation for the 2026 census, I will recommend they fix the name now that they finally have the designated place boundary consistent with the actual hamlet boundary. Hwy43 (talk) 02:04, 28 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose per the comprehensive rebuttal by Hwy43. Note when closing, assuming it is closed as not moved, Wabasca-Desmarais should be created as a redirect to the current title. Jenks24 (talk) 11:21, 5 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.