Talk:Viroconium Cornoviorum

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Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was Do Not Move Viroconium Cornoviorum → Viroconium

The name was simply Viroconium; for some reason tribal names are being automatically appended to Romano-British towns when this was not always the case - unlike the Venta names, for instance, there wasn't another Viroconium to confuse it with. Paul S (talk) 00:01, 21 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Object -- The present article title is the full formal name of the town. Since it was the cantonal (tribal) capital of the Cornovii, the full name was Viroconium (which is cognate with Wrekin) of the Cornovii. However Viroconium should continue to exist as a redirect. Peterkingiron (talk) 17:57, 21 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Can you cite a source confirming this "full formal name" rather than simply Viroconium? Paul S (talk) 22:35, 21 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Offhand "No", as I do not have the requisite books to hand. However, I think it is on an inscription from the Baths or forum preserved in the museum there, and it is probably in Rivet and Smith, Place-names of Roman Britain, possibly in Ordnance Survey's tabulation of information in their Map of Roman Britain. I think the addition of the tribal name in the genitive plural applies to all tribal capitals. Peterkingiron (talk) 22:46, 21 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, I can't get hold of Rivet & Smith, but the OS Roman Britain just has it as Viroconium, no suffix. For primary sources, the Antonine Itinerary mentions it twice, as Uriocono and Viroconio (datives), no tribal suffix, even though other places listed (e.g. Venta Icenorum) do. Paul S (talk) 14:49, 22 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The entry in Rivet's Place-names of Roman Britain is headed "Viroconium Cornoviorum". It then goes on to say that only the Rravenna itinerary refers to it as such. There is some uncertainty, but as "Viroconium Cornoviorum" is the title the book first uses, I think we should do the same. Nev1 (talk) 15:00, 22 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

It looks as though whether Cornoviorum gets appended or not depends on which manuscript you are using as a source. The Vatican one appends. Paul S (talk) 20:36, 22 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The name

The interpretation of the name is not correct. The syllables should be split as follows: Uir - oc - on. That's 'man' - 'abundance' - plural suffix. It was probably intended to convey a meaning of a densely populated area of fellow-tribesmen.WallHeath (talk) 17:37, 19 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

A E Housman

I am astonished there is no mention of one of A E Housman's most successful poems 'On Wenlock Edge the wood's in trouble' https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/44413/a-shropshire-lad-31-on-wenlock-edge-the-woods-in-trouble -

"'Twould blow like this through holt and hanger
When Uricon the city stood:
'Tis the old wind in the old anger,
But then it threshed another wood."

"The gale, it plies the saplings double,
It blows so hard, 'twill soon be gone:
Today the Roman and his trouble
are ashes under Uricon."

I propose adding it Wolstan Dixie (talk) 12:01, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]