Talk:Vedmak

Name / hoax

I have doubts that this article covers something notable. I cannot find any references for witcher outside the term as used in the context of The Witcher fiction. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk} 20:48, 30 May 2011 (UTC)

It is mentioned in a couple of Slavic mythology encyclopedies and Russian dictionaries outside the Witcher fiction, although I'm not sure about the "WP:DICTIONARY" part. -- deerstop. 08:17, 31 May 2011 (UTC)

Вѣдьмак/Vědmák = Wiedmak.--Юе Артеміс (talk) 15:52, 27 May 2015 (UTC)

Ok, this article is obviously... not right. To be clear: one slavic language (Czech) is my native;

- "vědma" is certainly NOT a word with bad connotation, therefore the part claiming that "unlike 'vědma', 'vědmák' can posses some good qualities..." is obviously wrong. Actually quite contrary, "vědma" is positive word - it comes from the word "vědět" (=to know, therefore "vědma" = "female who has the knowledge" - in this case you should picture knowledge as "lore" or "wisdom"). In mythological sense, "vědma" can also be understood as "female oracle" or "good female witch". There are some relations to keltic/slavic mythological roots (vědma = nature witch). There IS a relation to Christian understanding in which "vědma" is "satanic witch", but this meaning is mostly lost in our linguistic history.

- "vědmák" on the other hand has no meaning in Czech language at all - the only place it shows up are translated works of Polish author Sapkowski. But to my knowledge, even in Polish language is this word (=male version of "vědma") quite "innovative". I'm no linguist so I do not want to edit this page, but I believe that somebody should correct it (and for reasons mentioned above the 3rd reference doesn't seem to be trustworthy)

Sirien.neiris (talk) 21:28, 19 June 2016 (UTC)

Krsnik

Should we put "Krsnik" under See Also? Both are Slavic warlocks. I'm going through Slavic folklore and they fell similar. --2A00:EE2:907:FF00:3DD7:949C:3AD0:314E (talk) 17:06, 31 August 2020 (UTC)

Krsnik is not warlock, but I see no harm in listing him in "see also". Staszek Lem (talk) 20:27, 31 August 2020 (UTC)

Isn't he? "The krsnik is taught magic by Vile (fairies), and in traditional medicine has the ability to heal people and cattle." and "A warlock is a male practitioner of witchcraft" so doesn't that make him a warlock? --2A00:EE2:907:FF00:3DD7:949C:3AD0:314E (talk) 21:06, 31 August 2020 (UTC)

No he is not. By the way, it can be both he and she. (and this is even written in sources cited; see also here). The female krsnik is krsnica. (the latter word has two more meanigs: it is a kind of a pie and part of the hilt that runs across the blade; all words derive from "krst" or "cross") The second significant difference is that all superpowers belong to the person's soul and act when the soul leaves the body (e.g., during sleep).

Also, keep in mind that is that the krsnik article (together with many other mythology articles) is extremely poor, so please no not draw conclusions from them unless you have some expertise in the area. There are two serious problems with these subjects, of similar nature. The recent one is neopaganism, and it gravely contaminated true ethnography. The second one hails form 19th century, from the times of national awakening of smaller Slavic peoples (and not only them; Latvia and Estonia have the same problem). At these times intellectuals started to dig into the roots of the histories of their peoples and having little training in ethnography and mythology "invented" quite a few things. For a long time I want to write up an article pseudomythology, but it would require a significant effort. Staszek Lem (talk) 23:53, 31 August 2020 (UTC)

Slavic mythology and folklore is such a pain. Ok. What if I take back "Both are Slavic warlocks." and say "Both Vedmak and Krsnik are slavic folkloric beings with some access to supernatural abilities. Both can be of either gender; Vedmak&Vedma and Krsnik&Krsnica". Beings? Characters? Roles? How would you phrase this? I'm not good at writing. And I didn't know there are female "krsnica". Thank you. Should that be added to Krsnik's page? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A00:EE2:907:FF00:3DD7:949C:3AD0:314E (talk) 00:12, 1 September 2020 (UTC)

Not beings, but persons (humans). Where are you going to write this? Staszek Lem (talk) 05:35, 1 September 2020 (UTC)

I was talking about my "Both Vedmak and Krsnik are slavic folkloric persons..." sentence, that's it. I'm sorry. I just chose the wrong word (warlock) I didn't mean for this to spiral into such a long discussion. I just noticed that Krsnik and Vedmak are kinda similar and wanted to get a second opinion instead of just adding it. "they are kinda similar and could be in each other's See Also sections".

Slavic articles could probably get overhauled altogether, but then again the sources are poor and conflictory themselves. But there's probably very few people that research slavic myth and would edit the wiki. Btw, the french version of Baba Yaga's page is twice as long as the english and has so much more info. I'm doing research on her, but I can't read french nor russian, nor do I know anyone that does. And putting it into google translate just gives a mess. So I don't know what to do. But that's not really about this. I see you added Krsnica to Krsnik's page. Thank you. --2A00:EE2:907:FF00:F8D2:31A8:685F:8183 (talk) 14:15, 1 September 2020 (UTC)