Talk:Vampire/Archive 10

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Iron.

I have recently heard that vampires are allergic to iron. This makes no sense at all because there is iron in blood. I know they are mythical. And also where has the 'type of vampire' section gone? I had noticed that they had missed out pure blood's. If anyone can tell me that the iron thing is a load of bull, please do. :) Assyria hightower (talk) 12:16, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

Erm, no that is faeries which are supposed to be allergic to cold iron. Note that this is all folkloric. I was always perplexed by the 'cold iron' thing, as if a little carbon (in steel) somehow neutralises iron's toxicity to critters....aaargh, I am talking like a gamer again (has a cold shower). In short, erm....fuggeddaboutit. Casliber (talk · contribs) 14:31, 23 August 2009 (UTC)

Off topic for this article, but "cold iron" just means plain old iron: hot forged, cold forged, not forged, whatever. The idea that it was a special kind of iron was some nonsense picked up by fiction writers unfamiliar with the original stories and expanded upon over the years. The tradition folklore demonstrating iron's use against fairies included examples of items of all types: horseshoes, nails, swords, etc. Steel would work just as well. DreamGuy (talk) 15:42, 23 August 2009 (UTC)

Removed text on garlic study

I removed this text:

Based on a experimental study with leeches the traditional belief that garlic has prophylactic properties is probably wrong.

Obviously, since vampires are fictional, there can be no proof or disproof of the theory that garlic repels them. Besides, leeches are a poor substitute for vampires; this study needed a better experimental control. 9) -- Beland (talk) 04:53, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, that was a major tangent that made no sense being in the article. DreamGuy (talk)

Folk Beliefs Needs reference

The following section need references. In particular I don't think there is credible proof of any notion of Vampirism in the culture of the ancient Hebrews. If there is no reference for this it should be taken out.

"The notion of vampirism has existed for millennia; cultures such as the Mesopotamians, Hebrews, Ancient Greeks, and Romans had tales of demons and spirits which are considered precursors to modern vampires." —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.162.97.100 (talk) 03:33, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

Spirits such as Lilith and others are mentioned, and referenced, through the text. Casliber (talk · contribs) 04:00, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

Jewish magic and superstition: a study in folk religion By Joshua Trachtenberg, Moshe Idel talks about Vampires with regard to the Hebrew community as does Wilson, Katharina M. (1985) "The History of the Word "Vampire"" Journal of the History of Ideas, Vol. 46, No. 4 (Oct. - Dec., 1985), pp. 577-583.--BruceGrubb (talk) 04:42, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

Update URL for Vampire article

Can an established editor please update the following URL?

Re: Reference [120]

"Despite being dismissed by experts, the link gained media attention[119] and entered popular modern folklore.[120]"

Please note GeoCities is closed, kindly change the above URL to http://www.bydewey.com/drkporphyria.html

Many thanks.

bydewey@yahoo.com

Author/Webmaster A Research Guide for Students www.bydewey.com

Dr. Kujtan's Medical Matters www.bydewey.com/drk2009.html

Bydewey (talk) 06:17, 9 November 2009 (UTC)

Mythology/Folklore section

That section so happens to be the most important one, and from what I gather mythology of a vampire like creature comes from almost every civilization. I think their should be a seperate article that goes over every culture not just a limited few as to keep the page within the limits of page size. This section needs to be much much bigger, cause at the moment its misleading people into thinking that vampires myths have been so few, combined with sections that speak about how vampires have been 'supposedly' debunked by a simple 'Premature burial' and 'rabies' it makes a very poor article. If any of you really consider vampire mythology a serous subject then take my advice. Once you see the information of all the countries that have folklore, and how far they date back... the results may come of a shock. 124.169.40.173 (talk) 09:46, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Many of the myths from other cultures do indeed have their own articles, like jiangshi. Casliber (talk · contribs) 10:55, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Perhaps you could add links to all other articles pertaining the vampire myths through this one... considering this is the main one. Perhaps adding a "See Also" with links at the bottom. The Unbeholden (talk) 16:31, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Various ones are bluelinked through the article. I find see also sections of little use - either a term is already discussed and linked in the main body of the article, or the link is so tenuous or general that it is unclear why one takes precedence over any number of other possible links listed. The article is also very big so I try to avoid repetition if possible. Casliber (talk · contribs) 19:28, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Understandable. though I did find one link that hasn't been bluelinked. I added it, as it appears to be quite a important link. Detailing all the vampires in folklore from around the world. I've even expanded it with a few I've read about. The Unbeholden (talk) 08:07, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

Films and Television

I can't believe that you mentioned Dan Curtis' Kolchak series and missed referring to his earlier (1966-1971) Dark Shadows horror-opera which brought Barnabas Collins as the anti-hero vampire and had kids running home from school in droves to wear their fake vampire fangs and watch the program in the late afternoon. At least a passing mention should be made. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.88.188.242 (talk) 21:01, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

I know, there are so many we could still add, but the article is huge. We do have subpages on vampires in film and tv though. Casliber (talk · contribs) 21:13, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

Ok - I confess... I was one of those kids. I still have the fangs, a poster, and the "Dark Shadows" LP with the songs from the series..  :) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.88.188.242 (talk) 21:21, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

Vampires and the Anthropic Principle

This might be interesting to add to the article. :) http://www.firstthings.com/blogs/firstthoughts/2010/02/10/vampires-and-the-anthropic-principle/ 216.69.219.3 (talk) 23:50, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

Interesting blog - be good to get the original paper and cite that (blogs aren't generally reliable sources unless the author is notable. Casliber (talk · contribs) 02:06, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

If the blog actually reflect the paper's contents then the paper has serious problem based on the reliable source martial already in the article. First, not all actual vampire myths had them drink blood. Some consumed strength, others drained youth, and so on.

Second and more importantly, not all vampire myths said the the act of consuming human life force resulted in additional vampires.

The Astral (everywhere), Baital (India), Ch'iang Shich (China), Gaki, (Japan), Ghul (Arab region), Lamia (ancient Greece), Loogaroo (Haiti), Pananggalen (Malay), Strix (ancient Rome), and Vyrolakos (Balkan region) are all examples of vampires (or vampire like beings) that did NOT create more of their own kind by feeding.

In fact according to the myth the Vyrolakos could even have children with a human and is the classic origin of the Dhampir (half human half vampire). Since the premise the article is based on can be shown to be intrinsically flawed the article even if found is useless.--BruceGrubb (talk) 23:50, 16 February 2010 (UTC)

Edit request

{{editsemiprotected}} 205.242.229.69 (talk) 22:38, 25 March 2010 (UTC) under film you should add the twilight saga. It has brought back the "Vampire Genre".

• Mild oppose. I don't believe that's necessary or overwhelmingly appropriate. The influence of the Twilight series on the "Vampire Genre" comes much more from the books than the films, and it's noted in the Literature section. Strong oppose for describing Twilight as having 'brought back the "Vampire Genre"'. —chaos5023 (talk) 22:47, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

Not done; no references to reliable sources supplied, and no consensus  Chzz  ►  00:02, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

 Not done

In modern fiction: video games

Can we please have a small section in the "In modern fiction" section about vampires in video games. As another form of media, vampires in video games has made an impact with the popular Castlevania series which revolves around the Dracula story by Bram Stoker. Also other note worthy games like Night Trap, Vampire Rain, the BloodRayne series, Legacy of Kain series and more. So can we please have this addition to the article? --VitasV (talk) 05:20, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

Don't forget the Vampire: the Masquerade games. In any event, it would help a lot if you could provide some references to reliable sources that people could use to build such a section into the article. —chaos5023 (talk) 05:23, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

Deciding what modern cultural vampire depictions should 'make the cut' in this article was (is and will be) really tough, there are just so many to choose from. Given as how we have to rely on secondary sources, we really need a secondary source discussing one or more of these as a notable depiction of vampires. If you can find one, that's a start. Casliber (talk · contribs) 05:37, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

• I have created a small subsection from such a source. Colonel Warden (talk) 06:53, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

Twilight was not the "quintessential vampire novel"

The introduction states:

"However, it is Twilight and Bram Stoker's 1897 novel Dracula that is remembered as the quintessential vampire novel and which provided the basis of modern vampire fiction."

I'm not going to say that Twilight isn't popular, but I don't think it should be called the quintessential vampire novel, and is definitely not the basis of modern vampire fiction. Twilight was published five years ago, and as far as I know, there have not been any vampire fiction that is based on the vampires in Twilight (sparkling, &c). —Preceding unsigned comment added by JeffreyAylesworth (talk • contribs) 01:05, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Pending changes

This article is one of a number selected for the early stage of the trial of the Wikipedia:Pending Changes system on the English language Wikipedia. All the articles listed at Wikipedia:Pending changes/Queue are being considered for level 1 pending changes protection.

The following request appears on that page:

Comments on the suitability of theis page for "Pending changes" would be appreciated.

Please update the Queue page as appropriate.

Note that I am not involved in this project any much more than any other editor, just posting these notes since it is quite a big change, potentially

Regards, Rich Farmbrough, 00:31, 17 June 2010 (UTC).

Listed as an unassessed article

According to the star on the top right of the article, it is featured. However, it says that it is "An unassessed article from Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia" on the top left. Could someone fix that? Lawl talk 20:43, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

Weird. what browser are you using? I find that google chrome often 'misses' assessments. Casliber (talk · contribs) 21:08, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

The year 6555

The article contains this text: "The first recorded use of the Old Russian form Упирь (Upir') is commonly believed to be in a document dated 6555 (1047 AD)." 6555 counting from what? eyeball226 (talk) 00:53, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

Never mind, it was the Byzantine calendar. Just found out by searching the year 1047 AD in other calendars. I've made the number 6555 in the article link to the Byzantine calendar article.eyeball226 (talk) 00:58, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

Lead restoration

As there have been two subsequent restorations to the lead section after I rephrased it on 10/30 with new cites, I'm restoring to that ealier date. Most of the lead changes were made by taking material from the main body to keep the lead more as a summary. However, since I did add a number of new general sources that weren't yet in the body, I feel that my modifying the lead first instead of adding material to the body was not the best procedure, especially with a FA. Some of the cites came from the Bram Stoker article and they seemed useful here, but probably not in the lead. --Wikiwatcher1 (talk) 07:56, 5 November 2009 (UTC)

The Stoker reference is from Penguin books--hardly a scholarly publication; furthermore, it deals primarily with the modern vampire--a creature who has become separated from the vampire of myth and legend. Also three of the six references in the opening I restored are English: Bunson who is already cited 15 times, Dundes from University of Wisconsin Press book, and finally no less than an article from the Encyclopaedia Britannica. I would ask any editor that wants to remove these sources to realize that two of them are on the top rung of WP:RS and are hardly superseded by later books of questionable scholarly merit.--BruceGrubb (talk) 07:28, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

I would recommend the following for future editors:

• (1871) Appletons' journal of literature, science and art‎ Page 188

• Atwater, Cheryl (2008) "Living in Death: The Evolution of Modern Vampirism" Anthropology of Consciousness Volume 11 Issue 1-2, Pages 70 - 77

• Giblin, James L. (2001) "Review: Vampires and History" African Studies Review, Vol. 44, No. 1 (Apr., 2001), pp. 83-87

• Oinas, FJ (1978) - "Heretics as Vampires and Demons in Russia" The Slavic and East European Journal Vol 22 No 4 443-441

On a slightly iffier stance:

• Konstantinos (2002) Vampires: The Occult Truth Llewellyn Publications (to separate what is movie and literature based from the actual myths and legends.)

• Maberry, Jonathan (2006) Vampire Universe Citadel

• Russo, Arlene (2008) Vampire Nation Llewellyn Publications

• Wright, Dudley (2006) The book of vampires Dover Publications

While not all by scholars these do help in sorting the actual vampire of myth and legend from what movies and literature have created.--BruceGrubb (talk) 08:28, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

Vampire just hate garlic —Preceding unsigned comment added by 110.174.149.127 (talk) 08:54, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Political Interpretation

I have found a source that could be particularly useful in elaborating the 'political interpretation' section: http://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/2009/11/cultural-notebook-3/

217.205.110.52 (talk) 23:56, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

Is there a reason that Marx's explicit identification of Capital with vampires, written in a satire of gothic literature, isn't in here? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 210.103.36.58 (talk) 01:07, 26 August 2010 (UTC)

Creation of vampires section

The section of the article is supposed to be about folfloric creation of vampires, instead it seems to be a section detailing methods of preventing creation of vampires. Many of the things description section should be in the identifying vampires section. Sephiroth storm (talk) 04:04, 11 December 2009 (UTC) I accept this and there's a question on it. If this creation is tried out what is effect? As if it changes a man into a vapire. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.164.37.46 (talk) 16:55, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

Folk Beliefs\Creating Vampires

Shouldn't one of the main formula's documented for creating a vampire be, being bitten by a vamipire?
Or was this only a formula used in fiction, and not an actual folk belief? Is this method stated anywhere in the article? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.88.188.242 (talk) 21:07, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

Mythology gives us more methods than simply one vampire biting a person to create a vampire. The list of those at particular risk of becoming a vampire is incredibly long: excommunication, untimely violent death, suicide, witches, stillborn, the improperly buried, and being born with teeth, a caul, very dark or blue eyes, or having red hair. Also some vampires (such as the Baital, Ch'iang Shich, Gaki, Penanggalen/Kephn, and Strix) did not create more of their own kind by feeding. This is because some of these vampire were demonic spirits possessing corpses or humans who made pacts with supernatural entities. In the examples of actual vampire "attacks" I have heard no mention of the victims being treated like vampires.--BruceGrubb (talk) 05:31, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

Does the vampires are there even now?--Reshmi--from India —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.164.37.46 (talk) 16:57, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

Etymology

Vampire or Dhampire derives directly from the the Albanian language. Proto-Albanian or Illyrian. Old geg, vam or dham, which means teeth, and pi, pire in Albanian which means to drink, drinks. The research of the etymology lacks proper linguistic research and the references are rather misleading. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.83.124.212 (talk) 20:35, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

Old gheg dialect is vam or new gheg dham, (modern Albanian dhemb, dhembe - which is more toske dialect oriented) which means teeth and also fang, and pi, pirë in Albanian which means to drink, drinks. Vampir or Dhampir, to drink with teeth. Vampire have long fangs. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.83.124.212 (talk) 20:43, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

We need reliable sources. Just some claims made on a talk page don't help. Find actual experts who have been published who say that. Lots of people think they have etymologies for all sorts of words, but most of them are wrong. The idea that "vampire" comes from words meaning "teeth drinks" doesn't sound at all plausible, as long fangs used for drinking blood weren't a component in the vast majority of the legends. DreamGuy (talk) 15:46, 23 August 2009 (UTC)

The Albanian word for Vampire is Dhampir (Dham = teeth and Pir = drink/suck) … In the Albanian language the verb pir/pin/pi means simultaneously to drink and to suck … (e.g. the albanians say: "mushkonja/shushunja me ka pir gjakun" = "the mosquito/leech sucked my blood"). Thus the name Dhampir means Teeth-sucker … sucking via teeth)). Dhampir is the original name of the later corrupted and slavicized "vampir". Dhampirs are evil nightly creatures with sharp and long teeth, very strong, quick, heavy and are mostly invisible to the eyes of the normal People. They fear the fire, the water and the daylight, but like the music. These are dead people which were angry. They get up from the grave and come at night, bite people and animals and drinks their blood. Dhampirs are very sadistic; they terrify, beat up, and rape women and/or kill people.

Only a Dhampirash (Dhampirash = the child of a vampire father and a human mother) is capable to see the Dhampires, and knows how to fight or kill them.

He must make a circle from some burnable material and blood on the ground; afterward he lures the vampire into the circle while positioning himself in the middle of the circle, playing the fife (recorder) or whistling. Then he puts fire on the circle, so that the terrified Dhampire from the fire cannot flee, forcing the Dhampire to fight him.

Dhampirash must kill and burn the Dhampire, or new Dhampires will rise from every glow of these fires of a circle. When he has him killed and completely burnt, he must take his ashes/cinders and throw them in a river. (I told shortly and only the most important one)

Old tales from the Albanian folklore (Kosovo).

Slavs, Romanians and Roma (Gypsies) cannot pronounce the Albanian letter DH (DH = TH English like in The,Then,They,This,That etc.) so they usually replace it by the more convenient letter V. And some of Slavic people replace it by letter L (e.g. the Bosnians).

When a Slav, Romanian or Roma (Gypsie) spells the Albanian word Dham for Teeth, he pronounces it as Vam (?), because he is incapable to say Dham (teeth). The Bosnians spells it as Lam.

When the Slavs came to Europe, they came into contact with the Albanian (Pelasgo-Illyrian) tales. Later they changed, corrupted and slavicized the name Dhampir into "Vampir" and "Lampir" (similar to other Albanian words), because they could not pronounce the original name Dhampir. Now, they try to claim these words for themselves, as well as others that were similarly amended from the Albanian vacabulary, but the original meaning of these words is lost, because they carry no connotation in Slavic or any other language, except for Albanian.

(Wikipedia: Serbian вампир/vampir, or, according to some sources, from Hungarian vámpír. The Serbian and Hungarian forms have parallels in virtually all Slavic languages. The Bosnian Lampir which was the name of the oldest recorded vampire Meho Lampir.: Bulgarian вампир (vampir)...)

The world вампир in Bulgarian refers to the Bram Stocker's vampires. The traditional blood sucking creature in the Bulgarian folklore is called вопир or упир and is basically a shapeless ghost that drinks the blood of young children. The reference to vrakolak (върколак, връколак) seems lacking sources - върколак in modern day Bulgarian means werewolf and probably comes from the word вълк which means wolf. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.86.82.106 (talk) 22:59, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

I have translated this by online translating service from German to English, and I tried to make clearer. I hope it is clear enough, for those who want to understand. Thx --User:!i!i!i!i!i! 20:20, 4 September 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.73.235.63 (talk)

I have forgotten to say that the Albanian word for the female vampires is Dhampiresha/Dhampireshe ... (e.g., Luan (m) Luanesha/e (f) = lion (m) lioness (f), or Mbret (m) Mbretresha/e (f) = king (m) queen (f) etc. --User:!i!i!i!i!i! 01:30, 5 September 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.73.235.63 (talk)

There is no relation of Illyrians with Vampires, or the Greek mythical Pelagians(or Pelasgians with Illyrians) with vampires or any relation with Albanian folklore and Illyrian one and no established relation with language let alone specialized words. This is all we know of Illyrian mythology.Megistias (talk) 06:44, 22 September 2009 (UTC)

You seem to know it all Sir (aside from a good command of English, that is). Can you please explain how did you come to the conclusion that Illyrians and Pelasgians differ (besides the timeframe)? Who were Illyrians? What do you know about them and their folktales? --User:!i!i!i!i!i! 04:40, 23 September 2009 (UTC)

Please note that Polish for "vampire" is "wampir" not "wąpierz". Perhaps "wąpierz" is a regional term but I have never heard of it and I am born and raised Polish. The following sentence should be amended:

The Serbian form has parallels in virtually all Slavic languages: Bulgarian вампир (vampir), Croatian upir /upirina, Czech and Slovak upír, Polish wąpierz, and (perhaps East Slavic-influenced) upiór, Russian упырь (upyr'), Belarusian упыр (upyr), Ukrainian упирь (upir'), from Old Russian упирь (upir').

Please the correction below:

The Serbian form has parallels in virtually all Slavic languages: Bulgarian вампир (vampir), Croatian upir /upirina, Czech and Slovak upír, Polish wampir, and (perhaps East Slavic-influenced) upiór, Russian упырь (upyr'), Belarusian упыр (upyr), Ukrainian упирь (upir'), from Old Russian упирь (upir').

In addition, "upiór" is a general term for many sorts of scary monsters and does not necessarily mean "vampire" in the Polish language. I would recommend removing it from the sentence. 198.103.184.76 (talk) 17:08, 20 April 2010 (UTC) Ulla

Add More

I think you should add more ideas and more data about vampires not all vampires are fake but most of them live in Europe and they are now not found very often because when people see them they kill them with a wooden stake and push it in their hearts and then the majority of vampires are like 55-33 and if people were to leave them alone then maybe we wouldn't have this problem so maybe if you research more about vampires than maybe people will be more interested and if not then you can fly to Europe. That is all i have to say so maybe you should take my advice and do as i say. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.255.26.99 (talk) 02:55, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

Facepalm — The Hand That Feeds You:^Bite 13:17, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

For the sake of the human psyche, please refrain from reading this wall of text.. Upon A Spikéd Branch (talk) 17:02, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

You must include some real pictures of a vampire. Fly to Europe and have a clear research about vampires and their pictures.However we donot know the real apearence.And exsistance of vampires is a common question so I too ask the same. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.164.38.84 (talk) 17:12, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

Mathamatical proof that the existance of vampires is impossible

That section looks terribly out of place on wikipedia; can't it be mentioned under one of the broader section heads? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.240.240.101 (talk) 16:55, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

If you think you can find a better place for it, please do so. Grundle2600 (talk) 18:57, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

Seeing this thread, although I have some doubt whether it's significant enough to mention at all, in order to give it a fair shot at fitting in I changed it from a sore-thumb section to a paragraph under "Modern beliefs". --Pi zero (talk) 20:43, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Yeah - I was contemplating removing it or doing something - thanks for that. I found it a little hard to take seriously. Casliber (talk · contribs) 01:30, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

if the mathematical proof is correct then why it has been mentioned about identifying and creation of vampires? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.164.37.46 (talk) 17:02, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from 209.102.243.127, 11 October 2010

{{edit semi-protected}} please add in Vampires do not sparkle. 209.102.243.127 (talk) 23:48, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

Why? --Cybercobra (talk) 00:08, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

Only really needs to be mentioned on a page bout Twilight vampires that they do, so unneeded here. Casliber (talk · contribs) 06:21, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

{{Edit semi-protected}} Please remove the mention of godess kali, in the Ancient beliefs section, as kali and vampire are not compatible, while vampire is usually a creature across culture that suck blood or feed off it. This concept is not true about kali, kali did not suck blood or live of it. only reason blood is associated with kali, is because she had to defeat the demon Raktavija( rakt = blood and vija = seed, hindi), and only way was to lick every bit of his blood that fell on the battle ground as she slay the demon, else a new clone of raktavija will spring up. kali don't have a thrist of blood or any charastic of vampire, you can check out the wiki page of both kali and raktavija.

Mannu.ray (talk) 10:40, 24 December 2010 (UTC)

I disagree; it seems relevent to me. It's only the one sentence, which says, The Ancient Indian goddess Kālī, with fangs and a garland of corpses or skulls, was also intimately linked with the drinking of blood. - and it is referenced.

That would appear true, despite what you are saying - it does not claim the goddess lived off the blood, or anything else. Just the association.

In the context of the paragraph, the short mention makes sense to me.

So, for now, I will cancel out this edit request.

If you disagree, then please continue the discussion below this message, and seek consensus for the change. If there is an agreement for the edit, please re-request. Thanks,  Chzz  ►  18:26, 24 December 2010 (UTC)

 Not done

{{Edit semi-protected}}

Well what you said is a valid point and I agree with you. And just by mentioning kali do not associate her with vampire. But I would suggest one line change "was also intimately linked with the drinking of blood" to "drank the blood of a monster she had to slay, as any drop of his blood on the ground would spring up new clone". you may rephrase it as you may see fit. So that reader may know the full context. well people can always check the wiki page for kali, but some one just browsing may not. Thus this way no misconception will arise for those who may not have knowledge of the Indian culture.

202.129.215.8 (talk) 10:53, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

Etymology

Upyr means somebody who resists (death?). Related words are "upiratsa" (to resist) and "uporniy" (stubborn).--MathFacts (talk) 06:52, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from Marina.mickovska, 30 March 2011

This article is translated in macedonian so if you can add an link to the macedonian page mk:Вампир or this the link to the article http://mk.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=%D0%92%D0%B0%D0%BC%D0%BF%D0%B8%D1%80&stable=0&shownotice=1

Greetings Marina.mickovska (talk) 22:40, 30 March 2011 (UTC)

Marina.mickovska (talk) 22:40, 30 March 2011 (UTC)

 Done – Ajl^talk 23:19, 30 March 2011 (UTC)

Terrible first sentence

The first sentence of this article has significant problems. I would love to edit it boldly but I know that this article is very strongly defended by some wikipedians and I don't want to create animosity. So, if anyone cares, I see the following problems in the first sentence of this article (and though I'm sure these issues have been addressed before, I feel that they still need to be considered for revision): First, the definition given in the first sentence is too narrow (and the entire article suffers because it must reflect that fact). The definition does not include any real vampires--mosquitoes, fleas, a few species of bats, or real people who drink blood as a life-style choice. I know that other definitions exist for these--"hemophage," "sanguinarian," etc, but inclusion in other definitions doesn't exclude them from the definition of "vampire." Another issue is the phrase "life essence." What is that? It is undefined. Like "soul," "chi," or "aura" it is a concept which can never be completely defined and is certainly not accepted by everyone. It is not defensible by third-party scholarly sources. So if the definition were to be expanded and more inclusive, the "life essence" concept fails to define the nature of real vampires found in the real world. I doubt a scholarly source exists to support the notion that Desmodus rotundus feeds on the "life essence" of cattle rather than the nutrients found in the blood. I realize that plenty of books out there exist to define the notion of "life essence" as it pertains to vampires in fiction, but no legitimate scholarship exists--at least, not legitimate enough for inclusion in a definition. Scholarly opinion I will grant, but not definition. Ok. I'll stop there. Please respond to this boldly and honestly. I'm all ears. MorbidAnatomy (talk) 17:22, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

(1) I have never heard of anyone referring to mosquitoes as vampiric. The first step is to find a reliable source describing them or fleas as vampiric before we'd think of including them in the definition, and even if it were found, it'd be a stretch of definition so may only warrant a place in hte body of the article not the lead (2) the "life essence" is folkloric, not real - I don't accept its reality, but some old stories do, so I don't see what the problem is. Casliber (talk · contribs) 19:06, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Well, vampire bats are so named because they drink blood. Logically, other animals which drink blood are also natural vampires--hence my inclusion of mosquitoes and fleas. We could add leeches to the list as well. I disagree that their inclusion would be a "stretch of definition"--rather it would complete the definition. It seems that drinking blood is the only thing that is required to be a vampire in the real world. The vampire of fiction so described in the article's definition seems to be "stretched" to include a concept of "life essence." I realize that there are plenty of self-proclaimed "energy vampires" who would disagree with me but the evidence to be found in nature indicates that blood drinking is vampiric, absorbing life essence is not. I agree that a source should be found--I searched my shelves but I don't seem to have one. I will say that I was not the first to append the word vampire to mosquitoes and fleas. I have seen televised documentaries about vampires which included them--so the idea was not my own. I also realize that anecdotes about unnamed documentaries is not sufficient evidence. But it enforces the point that others have thought the same as I do, and so a usable source likely exists somewhere. I will keep my eyes open for one. I ask that others do the same. MorbidAnatomy (talk) 20:07, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

If you go back to the mythology vampires drained the lifeforce not blood. Depending on the locality a vampire could feed on the breath (the vampire suffocated the victim), strength or stamina (consumption in some places was thought to be the sign of a vampire attack), or some other aspect of the lifeforce. In fact, two films pulled from these lesser known aspects of the vampire mythology: Captain Kronos - Vampire Hunter (vampire drains youth) and Lifeforce (film) (vampire drains lifeforce directly). As I pointed out back in 2009 the non-fiction books at the back of GUPRS Blood Types (many of which are used as references in this article) are far better than Twilight as reference material:

• Barber, Paul (1988) Vampires, Burial and Death (Yale University Press)
• Bunson, Matthew (1993) The Vampire Encyclopedia (Crown Publications) (used 12 times)
• Melton, J. Gordon (1994) The Vampire Book (Visible Ink Press)
• Summers, Montague (1928) The Vampire, His Kith and Kin (Routledge and Keegan Paul)
• Summers, Montague (1929) The Vampire in Europe (Routledge and Keegan Paul)
• Twitchell, James B, (1975) The Living Dead: The Vampire in Romantic Literature (Duke University Press)

To which I would now add

• Maberry, Jonatha (2006) Vampire Universe

As I said back then what most people know about vampires comes more from a mixture of Stoker's Dracula, Schreck's Nosferatu, the Universal Picture films of the 1930s and 40s, and Hammer pictures of the 1960s and early 70s then anything out of actual tradition and mythology. Literature and films have created a new folklore for the vampire--one that is very unlike what people actually believed about them.--BruceGrubb (talk) 02:42, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

It's funny though, when you read the books, the change wasn't sudden - many bits were gradually added and changed over the decades. Just as I am sure that many folks didn't believe in them in the 1700s and earlier, and some folks still believe in them (judging by posts around the place). Casliber (talk · contribs) 02:57, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

I don't know if there was a change so much as the formation of a new mythology out of the old. Remember that according to Skol's V for Vampire "vampire" didn't even exist in the English language until 1732 and no one is entirely sure just where it came from (Turkish (Oxford English dictionary), Lithuanian (Vampire Encyclopedia), Vampir- a term used for a paticular blood draining/strangling reverent out of the Slavic states have all been suggested as possible origins). It is like trying to look for what is now known as "silhouette" before 1759, sadism before Marquis de Sade lived, or many other examples--the term simply didn't exist so you get connection by association.--BruceGrubb (talk) 03:54, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

Bram Stoker's Werewolves

Imho, there are no werewolves in Bram Stoker's 'Dracula', I admit, I didn't read the book, but very recently read 'Dracula's Guest' by Bram Stoker and even the wolves in there were no werewolves. The origin of the werewolve mythology is totally unrelated to the origin of the vampire myth or stoker's novel.

Please someone remove that reference from the third paragraph: "provided the basis of modern vampire fiction. Dracula drew on earlier mythologies of werewolves and similar"

Even the article about the novel does not even contain a reference on werewolves.

Even if the source cites such a thing, it is obviously a strange claim at best.

84.177.174.141 (talk) 04:17, 10 April 2011 (UTC)

"In Stoker's notes we found the quotation from Baring-Gould's work Book of Werewolves, "canine teeth protruding over lower lip when mouth closed." p. 87. In Romanian folklore the vampire and werewolf are often connected." (The essential Dracula 1979 pg 23) Bram Stoker's notes for Dracula points out the same thing as does Dracula was a woman: in search of the blood countess of Transylvania, The new annotated Dracula (2008) and many others. The information is verifiable.--BruceGrubb (talk) 02:55, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

Macedonian?

According to Kazimierz Moszyński, the Serbian word was derived from Macedonian. Aleksader Brükner states the classical concept of vampires spread into Europe during the 17th century in the form of Macedonian fables. Ref: Leposava Spirovska, Tanas Vražinovski. Les vampires dans les croyances et legendes Macedoniennes (Skopje, 1988), p. 8. --203.173.29.119 (talk) 08:57, 21 May 2011 (UTC)

Real

vampire's are real thier's a vampire sell on youtube well alot and so many have transformed thier selves into one and one of them drank thier friend's before but he aended up passing out the vampire not the human Many people believe that vampires are real can you mention this in the article? --Christianandjericho (talk) 09:36, 5 August 2011 (UTC)

Do you have a source which says that? That is always a good place to start in these situations. Casliber (talk · contribs) 12:21, 5 August 2011 (UTC)

Political interpretation

In the section titled "Political Interpretation" it would be useful to had:

In his entry for “Vampires” in the Dictionnaire philosophique (1764), Voltaire notices how in the end of the 18th century the folkloric belief in the existence of vampires but that now "there were stock-jobbers, brokers, and men of business, who sucked the blood of the people in broad daylight; but they were not dead, though corrupted. These true suckers lived not in cemeteries, but in very agreeable palaces." Marx similarly famously defined capital as "“dead labour which, vampire-like, lives only by sucking living labour, and lives the more, the more labour it sucks”.

As references I would give: 1. Voltaire's enty vampire, here: http://oll.libertyfund.org/?option=com_staticxt&staticfile=show.php%3Ftitle=1660&chapter=202474&layout=html&Itemid=27

2. Academic articles on Marx's repeated use of the vampire as a metaphor for capital, there are several This one published on Cultural Logic us very good and available under Creative Commons: clogic.eserver.org/2010/Policante.pdf — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nuandame (talk • contribs) 00:06, 11 January 2012 (UTC)

These would make an interesting and pertinent addition. I have my hands full at the moment but when things settle might digest and add. Anyone else is welcome to as well. Casliber (talk · contribs) 01:58, 11 January 2012 (UTC)

Elder Scrolls IV?

Vampirism is also a condition obtainable in Skyrim as well as Oblivion. May want to just say "The Elder Scrolls Series". — Preceding unsigned comment added by Langaswh (talk • contribs) 13:57, 20 January 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 5 February 2012

I have found an error in wich an article states that Tinjan a village in istria is in modern Croatia. Tinjan is in Slovenia, I would appreciate if you could fix this error. The arcticle is about vampires: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vampire Under the medieval and later european folklore you can find in the second paragraph a line: "One of the earliest recordings of vampire activity came from the region of Istria in modern Croatia, in 1672.[75] Local reports cited the local vampire Giure Grando of the village Khring near Tinjan as the cause of panic among the villagers."

Hope you will fix the problem. Cheers from Slovenia 193.77.216.21 (talk) 17:06, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

 Not done No reference provided, articles on Jure Grando (referenced, but not in English) & Tinjan contradict the assertion, and Tinjan, Slovenia does not support the request. Dru of Id (talk) 22:17, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

Where did Vampirism really start?

Hello I am Cynthia C. Ladd and I curious where Vampirism really actually started because Vlad Tep'e Dracula never drank human blood and I curious who Lilith real was? And then I know that Queen Elizabeth Bathory never drank it she only bathed in so she look more beautiful but seriously where did all this vampirism really start? — Preceding unsigned comment added by CynthiaLadd (talk • contribs) 19:01, 7 February 2012 (UTC)

If you read the article, it goes into detail on this. Also, Lilith is a fictional character. — The Hand That Feeds You:^Bite 12:17, 8 February 2012 (UTC)

well thats easy it started way before people say it did. first to arrive was indeed dracula in transylavaina. then arrived the american vampires. soon it spreed to all of europe and great britian. but dracula was not the first.

The Dark Vampire Lord, has answered this if you wish to ask me more email me at TheDarkVampireLord@Hotmail.co.uk — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.106.8.188 (talk) 21:53, 19 February 2012 (UTC)

Vampir coms from the albanian Dhampir, Dham=teeth pir=sucker. of this fact the south-slavic natioans and turks knows the vampire-mythos too, befor doing knows the west-european nations/usa. --84.75.44.193 (talk) 21:15, 21 February 2012 (UTC)

Sesame Street character?

How is it possible that Count von Count, perhaps one of the most well known vampire characters, is not mentioned in this article? -itay 89.139.11.37 (talk) 00:44, 21 August 2011 (UTC)

For much the same reason Count Chocola and Count Duckula aren't mentioned--there is already a List of fictional vampires daughter article and listing them here serves no real purpose.--BruceGrubb (talk) 18:24, 2 October 2011 (UTC)

is it just me that finds it funny the category is named "list of fictional vanpires" ? heh --Hagnat (talk) 20:53, 22 December 2011 (UTC)

See Vampire lifestyle. --Pi zero (talk) 02:40, 23 December 2011 (UTC)

The first documentary of Vampire: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jure_Grando — Preceding unsigned comment added by 93.209.146.235 (talk) 12:41, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 25 February 2012

Jjbarker (talk) 19:51, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

Not done: Adding this link would violate our external links guideline. elektrikSHOOS (talk) 05:19, 26 February 2012 (UTC)

'Opir' Norse section a red herring

I believe this section is more or less a red herring that does not warrant inclusion, or at least a mention of its status as a red herring:

The first recorded use of the Old Russian form Упирь (Upir') is commonly believed to be in a document dated 6555 (1047 AD).[25] It is a colophon in a manuscript of the Book of Psalms written by a priest who transcribed the book from Glagolitic into Cyrillic for the Novgorodian Prince Volodymyr Yaroslavovych.[26] The priest writes that his name is "Upir' Likhyi " (Оупирь Лихыи), which means something like "Wicked Vampire" or "Foul Vampire".[27] This apparently strange name has been cited as an example both of surviving paganism and of the use of nicknames as personal names.[28] (It is also possible that, in this context, Upir is simply a transliteration of Norse name Öpir)[29]

As we can see from the talk archive 7: Talk:Vampire/Archive_7 The etymology of vampire has not been sufficiently proven to descend from the Upir as mentioned in the above account. A quote from a Wiki editor from the Archives:

First of all, to clarify, I was the one who made the most recent re-write (using another IP), so it might seem that I am biased. However, (apart from other minor deteriorations that have occurred over time) I definitely believe that the above sentence should be removed from the article, and I have serious doubts concerning its source. The technical issue of totally faulted referencing (see below) aside, there is no mention outside of Wikipedia of either the "Prolander script", or anybody named Tallas, either in German or in any other language. The content makes no sense, because nobody ever claimed that "vampire" came from "Old Russian upir' or later forms"; "vampire" is believed to have come from Serbian "vampir", of which Russian upyr etc are merely cognates; the reconstructed original proto-Slavic form (with a nasal o) is given in the article. The wording stating that the etymology of 'vampire' is not even "linked" to "upyr" is simply wild - because whatever the origin of "vampire" and "upyr", absolutely nobody has ever denied and could possibly deny that they are related! And - just the final point - there could be no "paper fragments" in the 10th century, because there was simply no paper in the West at the time (see [paper] for the history). I'm sorry, but I don't think the current reference (if it deserves the name) is sufficient to source the existence of a "Prolander script". Even if one supposes that everything is true, even if one accepts the claim that such a script *is* indeed mentioned in an anonymous one-half-column review in an unspeakably obscure journal that happens to be circulated mostly to museum libraries, the very fact of this extreme obscurity calls for caution. A theory which is still so obscure that almost nobody knows that it even exists (and it is indeed hard to check if it does) can't be propagated by Wikipedia. Especially as that theory (that the origin of the word is Germanic) contradicts everything that has been known so far.

Some further problems with the referencing and with SuzieT's credibility: s/he claims to be a library historian and yet doesn't know how to write references: after initially writing "Prof.Tallas" etc, s/he appears to cite Tallas "et al" as the author of the review of Tallas' own book - a book which remains unnamed - and neither the journal nor the book get a date; even this is a sufficient reason to consider the claim unsourced. Other suspicious facts are obvious from the initial exchange of words with Bbik - s/he has even given the professor different names. S/he has also spoken of the "now more widely accepted 'Öpir Ofeigr' theory" - when even the article that cites it is cautious and makes it clear that the theory is at least controversial among Swedish scholars. More importantly, the whole "Upyr lichiy" stuff has little relevance for the etymology of the word "vampire", despite SuzieT's constant suggestions of the contrary; this does not shed doubt on the existence and relative antiquity of the word "upyr'" and all of its Slavic cognates (and few would suppose that it is descended from the Swedish name, I hope). --91.148.159.4 21:14, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

CormanoSanchez (talk) 18:55, 29 April 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 10 May 2012

I wanted to make sure you include a note that this page is related to the mythical types of vampires only and not to real vampires. The first line of the article should state this so people don't get confused. I haven't seen anything on Wikipedia to link to on real vampires, but it should still be noted that this page is about the fictional types. It would even be better still if there was a section on real energy vampires and Sanguine vampires as well. This way you have a more complete page on vampire facts. LightworkerNaven (talk) 00:19, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Not done: Unnecessary, since there is no verifiable information on real vampires—and thus no article. —C.Fred (talk) 00:30, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Collective noun

I would like to suggest that there is another commonly used collection noun, a "clutch of vampires". It has been used in some novels, but is most prominent from the title of an anthology by Raymond T. McNally, A Clutch of Vampires. (ISBN: 0517174367, 1974). Just a short list of novels with this term are: The Greyfriar by Clay Griffith and Susan Griffith (2010), The Lost Slayer by Christopher Golden (2003), and Under Wraps by Hannah Jayne (2011). It has also been used in nonfiction works such as: The Vampire Killers: A Horrifying True Story of Bloodshed and Murder by Clifford L. Linedecker (1998) and The Vampire Ritual Book by Michelle A. Belanger (2007). --Dan Shaurette (talk) 04:15, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Interesting - I'd seen a humorous suggestion ("a clot of vampires") in an RPG magazine in the 80s. But seriously, the above looks promising, but one would be looking for a secondary source talking about the term. Casliber (talk · contribs) 05:11, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Indented line

Indented line

Edit request on 17 May 2012

There is new literature

Section: Etymology

Sentence: "Vampires had already been discussed in German literature." Please change into: "Vampires had already been discussed in the 1690s in French literature and later in German literature."

Zepotti (talk) 22:00, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Interesting - will take a look...Casliber (talk · contribs) 22:22, 17 May 2012 (UTC)

Done Mdann52 (talk) 16:06, 30 May 2012 (UTC)

The Entire Christianity section is based on false information

Vampires didn't exist yet in Medieval times. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.144.50.78 (talk) 17:41, 12 June 2012 (UTC)

The article reflects the sources in describing the development of vampire lore Casliber (talk · contribs) 21:21, 12 June 2012 (UTC)

Yes they did "exist" in ancient and medieval times, at least that is what the chronicles are telling us. They just had different names (revenants, for example). — Preceding unsigned comment added by VampiroTransilvania (talk • contribs) 02:28, 11 August 2012 (UTC)

Minor amendment(s) to article awaiting authorised editor

I don't have the necessary editing authority, but suggest that "grave-much" should be changed to "grave – much". — Preceding unsigned comment added by Northern winter (talk • contribs) 15:55, 15 June 2012 (UTC)

Sorry about the delay, done. Casliber (talk · contribs) 21:50, 25 July 2012 (UTC)

Untitled

• Article merged: See old talk-page here

Dont forget the vampires depicted in the Magic: The Gathering trading card game. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Arkitan (talk • contribs) 03:29, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

Romanian lore incorrect information (I am a Romanian, and it happens I know pretty well our lore)

The information about Vampire Academy being based on two Vampire types according to Romanian lore is absolutely false. I am a Romanian and I can assure you there is not such lore here, the author just took different names for the same creature and used it without any regards to the characteristics of the creature in the Romanian lore. There is only one race of Vampires here, the Strigoi, also known as the Moroi etc. (they had many names and many different characteristics according to every region, but is, none the less, the same creature - an undead or a revenant; and they do not suck blood either, just taking the lifeforce of their victims which are soon to die in a way similar to the vampire way - growing pale, melancoholic, ill etc.). The information should be change something like Vampire Academy pretends being based on Romanian lore or loosely borrows some concepts from Romanian lore or something like that. — Preceding unsigned comment added by VampiroTransilvania (talk • contribs) 02:39, 11 August 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 25 August 2012

vampires were first created before god said "let there be light and there was light" these creatures are the remainders of the demons that inhabited the planet before light was ever in existence ergo that is why they burn in the sunlight. They needed the darkness to help oxygen go round their bodies but when light came they needed human blood to survive because their own blood can not carry the oxygen they need round their body in the sunlight but human blood can do that for them; the blood cells in the vampire blood kills of the human blood which is why they need to continually drink blood from human beings. 2.96.28.202 (talk) 23:35, 25 August 2012 (UTC)

That's an interesting theory, got a source?--Jac16888 ^Talk 00:06, 26 August 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 27 November 2012

Nessadora (talk) 11:48, 27 November 2012 (UTC)

 Not done as no specific edit was requested. Feel free to raise this again and tell us what change you would like to see made to the article. --McGeddon (talk) 12:22, 27 November 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 26 April 2013 / First recorded Serbian judicial references against Vampire Hunt exhumations 1349 Emperor Dušan's Law Article 20

121.44.234.107 (talk) 16:58, 26 April 2013 (UTC) Serbian Emperor Stephen Uroš IV - Dušan The Great strictly forbids exhumation, staking and burning supposed "Vampires". This is detailed in Czar Dušan's Law Edict of 1349 - 3rd Serbian Constitution , Article No. 20. (1st Serbian Constitution 1219 "Zakonopravilo" by Prince Rastko-Sava Nemanjić later Saint Sava, 2nd Serbian Constitution by King Stefan Uroš II Milutin). Punishment to the local authority and community a hefty fine of 500 Perpers a medieval currency in Serbia used along with Dinar, and stripping local priest of title and the right to practice..."as judged by my imperial court" (this is 400 years prior to Habsburg Empress Maria Theresia's ban in 18th century). There is a question on timing of the code introduced in 1349 which coincidentally happens to be at the same time of the "Black Death" plague. This devastating period (at the time) of unnaxplained circumstances of death left great paranoia amongst populace across Imperial Serbia during reign of Dušan the Great, and the rest of the European continent. No studies so far have made thourough connections with Vampirism with the outbreak of the "Black Death" but the timing of the introduction of the "Article 20" may well be the earliest attempts to control and contain the Plague and other infectious diseases what might have been interpreted in Medieval Serbia as Vampirism. Currently there are no discovered surviving written records of the 2nd Constitution of Serbia by king Milutin referenced later in Dušan's Law "Dušanov Zakonik" of 1349 to compare and examine if previous references to "Vampire hunting" practice ban and exhumation of corpses existed. No recordings on such practices exist in the 1st Serbian Constitution "Zakonopravilo" from 1219.

For additional information on reference material contact ab_vg@hotmail.com

Not done: please be more specific about what needs to be changed. —KuyaBriBri^Talk 17:05, 26 April 2013 (UTC)

History of the "Vampire" name

The word Vampire originates from Albanian word Dhampir and is in use also in other Balkan nations. For example, in many parts of Slavic world Vampires are called other names like ( вукодлак, лампир, лапир, вједогоња, једогоња) (on cyrilic), also in many parts of Serbia and Balkans. It originates from Slavic belief: "If someones dead body is not burned to ash his soul will forever be trapped on this world, and it would never find peace " So they burnen their dead on a big pyre, but in times of war it happened that someones body was never found or not treated like it should so his soul camed back to haunt the living. ~You should this add to the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by IgorVGD (talk • contribs) 18:44, 26 November 2012 (UTC)

Igor, it is in the etymology section. Casliber (talk · contribs) 19:18, 26 November 2012 (UTC)

The Albanian word for Vampire is Dhampir (Dham = teeth and Pir = drink/suck) … In the Albanian language the verb pir/pin/pi means simultaneously to drink and to suck … (e.g. the albanians say: "mushkonja/shushunja me ka pir gjakun" = "the mosquito/leech sucked my blood"). Thus the name Dhampir means Teeth-sucker … sucking via teeth. Dhampir is the original name of the later corrupted and slavicized "vampir". Dhampirs are evil nightly creatures with sharp and long teeth, very strong, quick, heavy and are mostly invisible to the eyes of the normal People. They fear the fire, the running water and the daylight, but like the music. These are dead people which were angry. They get up from the grave and come at night, bite people and animals and drinks their blood. Dhampirs are very sadistic; they terrify, beat up, rape women, kill and eat people.

Only a Dhampirash (Dhampirash = the child of a vampire father and a human mother) is capable to see the Dhampires, and knows how to fight or kill them.

He must make a circle from some burnable material and blood on the ground; afterward he lures the vampire into the circle while positioning himself in the middle of the circle, playing the fife (recorder) or whistling. Then he puts fire on the circle, so that the terrified Dhampire from the fire cannot flee, forcing the Dhampire to fight him.

Dhampirash must kill and burn the Dhampir, or new Dhampires will rise from every glow of these fires of a circle. When he has him killed and completely burnt, he must take his ashes/cinders and throw them in a river. (I told shortly and only the most important one)

Old tales from the Albanian folklore (Kosovo).

Slavs, Romanians and Roma (Gypsies) cannot pronounce the Albanian letter DH (DH = TH English like in The,Then,They,This,That etc.) so they usually replace it by the more convenient letter V. And some of Slavic people replace it by letter L (e.g. the Bosnians).

When a Slav (serv), Romanian or Roma (Gypsie) spells the Albanian word Dham for Teeth, he pronounces it as Vam (?), because he is incapable to say Dham (teeth). The Bosnians spells it as Lam (Dham).

When the Slavs came to Europe, they came into contact with the Albanian (Pelasgo-Illyrian) tales. Later they changed, corrupted and slavicized the name Dhampir into "Vampir" and "Lampir" (similar to other Albanian words), because they could not pronounce the original name Dhampir. Now, they try to claim these words for themselves, as well as others that were similarly amended from the Albanian vacabulary, but the original meaning of these words is lost, because they carry no connotation in Slavic or any other language, except for Albanian.

(Wikipedia: Serbian вампир/vampir, or, according to some sources, from Hungarian Vámpír. The Serbian and Hungarian forms have parallels in virtually all Slavic languages. The Bosnian Lampir which was the name of the oldest recorded vampire Meho Lampir.: Bulgarian вампир (Vampir)...)

If Romanians/Vlachs and hungarians speak Albanian, they say: "eve" (means edhe = also), "Via " (means Dhia = goat), "Uve" (Udhe = path), "Voma" (Dhoma = room), "Vam" (Dham = tooth) and "Vampir" (Dhampir = Vampire)

And if the Bosnians speak Albanian, they say: "ele" (means edhe = also), "Lia " (means Dhia = goat), "Ule" (Udhe = path), "Loma" (dhoma = room), "Lam" (Dham = tooth) and "Lampir" (Dhampir = Vampire).

The Albanian word for the female vampires is Dhampiresha/Dhampireshe ... (e.g., Luan (m) Luanesha/e (f) = lion (m) lioness (f) etc.

There are also Albanian surname "Dhampiri", and this surname means "Vampire".

Ænës — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.73.233.192 (talk) 06:50, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

WOW ... using a slur "serv" for Serbs..."incapable to pronounce words"...just add untermensch and jews are guilty for all and it feels like nazi news propaganda bulletin... i know Albanians lost touch with reality ages ago but common...next thing you will say Latin is a dialect of ancient albanian ... "scientific" and "historical" claims we hear today about Illyrians and Albanians have real life credibility as AHNENERBE findings in Tibet...for people in Balkans its getting ridiculous, every word, every invention, ANYTHING - and some albanian pops up with "proof" its theirs... saying some or any nation/race has limited linguistic skills is just horrible...trying to hogg history from ancient nations in South Europe is not the way to make history for your people ...Chechnya is hard to pronounce...you can pronounce "Ch"...can you? You should...its homeland of Albanians ... ancient Illyrians must be rolling in their graves--Jarovid —Preceding undated comment added 10:42, 7 May 2013 (UTC)

Anthropological studies of the creation of Vampires

Is there a study similar to the one Wade Davis did on Haitian zombie powder for Serpent and the Rainbow; but for vampires? It seems strange that no one such as National Geographic has done a comprehensive study. CyensoredScribe (talk) 16:19, 17 September 2013 (UTC)

Can you elaborate on this please - I have no idea about this. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:41, 18 September 2013 (UTC)

Davis published a book about the time he spent with some Haitian Bokors for National Geographic. The Bokors showed him the ingredients of the two zombie powders they allegedly used to create zombie mind slaves; which included tetrodoxin, datura and part of a recently buried child's brain. So is there a similar preparation used to create vampires known to some other culture? These things were traditionally closely guarded secrets which is why I'm astonished Davis was told so much. — Preceding unsigned comment added by CensoredScribe (talk • contribs) 04:24, 19 September 2013 (UTC)

No - any culture that believed in them endeavoured to prevent the recently departed turning....Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:51, 19 September 2013 (UTC)

Edit request / lede

The following part of the lede

"However, it is Bram Stoker's 1897 novel Dracula that is remembered as the quintessential vampire novel and which provided the basis of modern vampire fiction. Dracula drew on earlier mythologies of werewolves and similar legendary demons and "was to voice the anxieties of an age", and the "fears of late Victorian patriarchy".[13] The success of this book spawned a distinctive vampire genre, still popular in the 21st century, with books, films, video games, and television shows. The vampire is such a dominant figure in the horror and supernatural genres that literary historian Susan Sellers places the current vampire myth in the "comparative safety of nightmare fantasy".[13]"

would be better of as e.g

"However, it is Bram Stoker's 1897 novel Dracula that is remembered as the quintessential vampire novel and which provided the basis of modern vampire fiction. Dracula drew on earlier mythologies of werewolves and similar legendary demons and played on the fears of the time.[13] The success of this book spawned a distinctive vampire genre, still popular in the 21st century, with books, films, video games, and television shows."

I note that the cut or reduced parts are speculative, do not necessarily belong in the lede of an article on vampires (as opposed to the novel "Dracula" or a more specific article on "vampires in fiction") even were they non-speculative, and that the cited author, Susan Sellers, does not appear to be a notable specialist in the area. (Her focus, cf. her own entry, is on women's literature with some excursions into "Myth and Fairy Tale in Contemporary Women's Fiction". Stoker, however, is neither a woman nor a contemporary writer.)

If in doubt, it could be argued that even the revised version gives the novel "Dracula" too much space in the lede. A similar argument could be raised against the discussion of vampires and fiction in the lede as a whole.

In fact, on second thought, I might go as far as cutting the second and third paragraph down to

"While even folkloric vampires of the Balkans and Eastern Europe had a wide range of appearance from nearly human to bloated rotting corpses, it was interpretation of the vampire by the Christian Church and the success of vampire literature,[9][10] including John Polidori's 1819 novella The Vampyre and Bram Stoker's Dracula, that established the archetype of charismatic and sophisticated vampire. In the 20th century a further development followed in the popular genre, including books, films, video games, and television shows."

I have no objections against an expansion of the original lede within the main text. 80.226.24.7 (talk) 11:31, 2 November 2013 (UTC)

Yes I agree with some of this - not sure where that bit came from - ok for article but not lede. The last line is a bit of a throwaway by sellers that re-states the obvious. The lead can't be too brief either though. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 19:25, 2 November 2013 (UTC)

Actually I went back to a consensus version determined near the time it was judged to be a Featured Article - the prose was smoother and it was as much about the belief as about the creature. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 19:55, 2 November 2013 (UTC)

Problems with Christianity section

This section was added entirely after the featured article review and thus has not been properly scrutinized. It has several problems including:

1. Close paraphrasing of sources
2. Excessive quotation
3. Does not distinguish between "vampires" and vampire-like myths
4. The part about the church using an allegory about vampires to teach Christians about Jesus in the Middle Ages is completely absurd and not supported by the cited source.

Since there doesn't seem to be anything in this section that is not problematic, I'm going to delete it for now. Feel free to restore it with some original prose if desired. Kaldari (talk) 10:06, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

Agree - there was something wrong with the chronology of beliefs - it just doesn't gel with anything I've read (also most european states were christianised before they were widely literate...(damn, how long has that been there...?) .Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:29, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

April 2012. --Pi zero (talk) 18:25, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for that - I wonder how I missed it for so long. Anyway, gone now. I must look at the sources when I have time to see whether it was the sources that were odd or the interpretation.... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:25, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

Vampire as a definite mythological creature or a category of beings?

Right now, the Vampire category is used for a jumble of creatures from legend, mythology and folklore which have as their only unifying traits their hematophagy and the fact that they are not real - even leeches and mosquitoes would probably appear in the category, were they fictional. Many of the creatures in the category are not even undead, yet this article, which is the main article for the category, define the vampire as corporeal undead, according to the original legends from the Balkans. I advocate that the vampire category is cleared of all beings that do not match the vampire as defined in those legends. These beings should instead be classified under Category:Mythological hematophages, of which the Vampire category should be a subcategory. That way, we align the category with the article. Ciaraleone (talk) 18:23, 23 December 2013 (UTC)

Umm, hadn't given it much thought. Would be better to move this discussion to the category talk page then. Aah, I see that you have already. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:27, 24 December 2013 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 5 February 2014

The birth of Vampyres was originally depicted by a band called Wisborg from Bournemouth called 'Carpathian Crypt Lord'. Fright Night in Wisborg' follows on from this to depict the turning and the first vampyre rampage in Wisborg as described fictionally in the first Vampyre film ever made, Nosferatu. StephSnakebite (talk) 22:30, 5 February 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for taking time to post here..ummm, that doesn't gell with anything I've read anywhere.....have you got some references?Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 23:14, 5 February 2014 (UTC)

Not done: If you want to suggest a change, please request this in the form "Please replace XXX with YYY" or "Please add ZZZ between PPP and QQQ".
Please also cite reliable sources to back up your request, without which no information should be added to any article. - Arjayay (talk) 10:00, 7 February 2014 (UTC)

Witches replaced vampires

184.97.200.69 (talk) 00:59, 15 February 2014 (UTC)Greg Hansen, 2/14/14

I just want to bring up, for those who do real research and edit Wikipedia pages, that work has been done by Peter Kreuter at the University of Bonn, published in his book Der Vampirglaube in Südosteuropa (which I've only started to read) and described in Spiegel Online at

http://www.spiegel.de/spiegel/print/d-21411153.html

(I'm not aware of English-language sources.) As I understand the Spiegel article, among other things Kreuter argues that vampires in Southeast Europe had the same role as witches in Western Europe--they were blamed for illnesses, family problems, hailstorms, and any other bad things. There wasn't a witch craze in that area in the early modern period because the people had vampires to blame. This connection seems worth including somewhere.

Vampire bats as disease vectors

In the section on vampire bats it is stated that "Although the vampire bat's bite is usually not harmful to a person..." While essentially correct this could seem to be a little sweeping as it makes no distinction between the harm of the bite, as a bite, and the harm of disease transmission. The vampire bat is a known vector for rabies so I suggest that this be amended to clarify that while the bite itself may not be harmful to a person, the saliva is a disease vector for rabies although transmission is rare... or similar wording. For sources it is probably sufficient to ref the existing WikiP article on Rabies transmission or otherwise cite directly the refs to the work by Pawan made in that article. Hart Wud (talk) 13:21, 7 March 2014 (UTC)

Sigh - the article is huge, and many many animals carry rabies (which I think is quite rare, though hazardous). I am not aware if vampire bats carry rabies in excess of other animals (like, say, dogs, which bite more people in the region I suspect). If you have a source then it might be good to have as a footnote. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 19:54, 7 March 2014 (UTC)

I appreciate it is a peripheral point to the subject of this article, and I concede it may not be entirely necessary hence the inclusion here for discussion, but the article does mention vampire bats and implies a harmlessness of the bite. I suggest that the point is not about whether vampire bats carry rabies in excess of other animals, but that this article states that their bite is not usually harmful to people, which is not an entirely helpful statement when it can transmit such a dangerous disease. Vampire bats are a well-known rabies vector and not mentioning this, while implying the harmlessness of their bite also sets itself up as a contradiction to the WikiP article on Rabies transmission which clearly mentions vampire bats at the head the section of animal transmitters to humans. For academic references, the articles used as references within the one on rabies transmission itself would be sufficient to this point: Joseph Lennox Pawan (1936). "Transmission of the Paralytic Rabies in Trinidad of the Vampire Bat: Desmodus rotundus murinus Wagner, 1840." Annals of Tropical Medicine and Parasitology, 30, April 8, 1936:137-156 & Pawan, J.L. (1936b). "Rabies in the Vampire Bat of Trinidad with Special Reference to the Clinical Course and the Latency of Infection." Annals of Tropical Medicine and Parisitology Vol. 30, No. 4. December, 1936. Hart Wud (talk) 00:30, 9 March 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 26 October 2014

In the paragraph on "Medieval and later European folklore", please add after Voltaire's quotation:

Some theological disputes arose. The non-decay of vampires’ bodies could recall the incorruption of the bodies of the saints of the Catholic Church. A paragraph on vampires was included in the second edition (1749) of De servorum Dei beatificatione et sanctorum canonizatione, On the beatification of the servants of God and on canonization of the blessed, written by Prospero Lambertini, i.e. the Pope Benedict XIV. In his opinion, whilst the incorruption of the bodies of saints was the effect of a divine intervention, all the phenomena attributed to vampires were purely natural or the fruit of “imagination, terror and fear”. In other words, vampires did not exist.

79.49.72.34 (talk) 09:13, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

Nice find! Yes will be added. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 22:34, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

Done by Casliber. Stickee (talk) 01:17, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

Slavic what?

Slavic spiritualism? This belief in vampirism and stuff like that is deeply rooted in Balkanic culture and has 0 to do with "Slavic spiritualism". Also, before the Church Slavonic lithurgical language was introduced, in Serbia there didn't exist a Slavonic language, check out endless sources from an objective standpoint please before writing such political paragraphs. Also, please some Russian from Murmansk explain to me how much he has in common with a Serb from Novi Sad, folkloricwise/geneticwise. Have a nice fucking day. --79.246.42.83 (talk) 19:25, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

The section got added to a subpage many years ago and ended up here. Reading it now it is pretty speculative and over-detailed, as well as unreferenced. I think the article is no worse off for its removal. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 05:26, 20 February 2015 (UTC)

COUNTRY?

Country: Transylvania, England? this is ridiculous ..it's a shame.--151.46.177.51 (talk) 21:56, 28 April 2015 (UTC)

Grammar edit

The line "An even earlier example is found in the re-telling the famous case of Arnold Paole..." should be changed to "An even earlier example is found in the re-telling of the famous case of Arnold Paole..."

Arithmaldor (talk) 00:30, 11 June 2015 (UTC)

thanks - fixed. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 01:03, 11 June 2015 (UTC)

Werewold?

Please take a look at the 9th paragraph under the sub-heading "Creating vampires." Notice the word "werewold" in the sentence "In Albanian folklore, the dhampir is the hybrid child of the karkanxholl (a werewold-like creature with an iron mail shirt) or the lugat (a water-dwelling ghost or monster)." I was researching on Albanian vampire folklore when I caught this typo. Many thanks.CarmillaDhampir (talk) 13:36, 14 June 2015 (UTC)

thanks - typo fixed Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 21:05, 14 June 2015 (UTC)

Suspect

Vlad Tepes was and is often referred to as a vampire of sorts. People often forget this. I wonder if there is any reason behind this type of human behavior. It's not important yet is in fact a historical figure people have mistaken as a vampire for some reason. Point being, why? Wasn't this a real person? I find it intriguing. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 23.117.16.45 (talk) 04:56, 10 September 2015 (UTC)

It's the link with Dracula. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:36, 10 September 2015 (UTC)

Vampire Origination

Where was the word 'vampire' first originated from41.138.188.6 (talk) 14:19, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

From http://etymonline.com/index.php?allowed_in_frame=0&search=vampire

 vampire (n.) 
   spectral being in a human body who maintains semblance of life by leaving the grave at night to suck the warm blood of the living as they sleep, 1734, from French vampire (18c.) or German  Vampir (1732, in an account of Hungarian vampires), from Hungarian vampir, from Old Church Slavonic opiri (cognates: Serbian vampir, Bulgarian vapir, Ukrainian uper), said by Slavic linguist Franc Miklošič to be ultimtely from Kazan Tatar ubyr "witch," but Max Vasmer, an expert in this linguistic area, finds that phonetically doubtful. An Eastern European creature popularized in English by late 19c. gothic novels, however there are scattered English accounts of night-walking, blood-gorged, plague-spreading undead corpses from as far back as 1196. Figurative sense of "person who preys on others" is from 1741. Applied 1774 by French biologist Buffon to a species of South American blood-sucking bat. Related: Vampiric.184.145.94.21 (talk)`  —Preceding undated comment added 21:39, 26 December 2015 (UTC) 

Kitsune?

Vampire#Asia "There's also the Kitsune who are spiritual vampires that need life force to survive and use magic. As such, they acquire it from making love with humans." (3rd paragraph, final sentence) needs a tag ... Or a citation. I don't remember kitsune having sex for energy's sake being much in any vihivd ufhiuhf

mythos. 67.42.179.140 (talk) 09:29, 21 January 2016 (UTC)

IIRC Kitsune are more fox-people rather than vampires per se. I have removed the sentence Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:44, 21 January 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 6 June 2016

Can somebody remove the references to "monstrous" vampires and replace them with modern vampire associations. I'd like to see more references to youthful, and attractive vampires.

Seriously though.

I find Carmilla von Karnstein both youthful and attractive. The Yeti 12:43, 7 June 2016 (UTC)

76.21.27.7 (talk) 23:52, 6 June 2016 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. Cannolis (talk) 01:17, 7 June 2016 (UTC)

folklore

Vampire is more paranormal than folklore. Fantasy movies don't have Vampire. Modern horror movies have vampire. --Eden's Apple (talk) 17:21, 22 November 2015 (UTC)

Um... what? That's a bad argument. DreamGuy (talk) 20:36, 22 November 2015 (UTC)

There was a vampire in the Silmarillion IIRC, FWIW.... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 21:54, 22 November 2015 (UTC)

I would recommend using the following for future edits (bolded are already currently in the article):

• (1871) Appletons' journal of literature, science and art‎ Page 188
• Atwater, Cheryl (2008) "Living in Death: The Evolution of Modern Vampirism" Anthropology of Consciousness Volume 11 Issue 1-2, Pages 70 - 77
• Barber, Paul (1988) Vampires, Burial and Death (Yale University Press)
• Bell, Michael E. (2006) "Vampires and Death in New England, 1784 to 1892" Anthropology and Humanism Volume 31. Issue 2. December 2006, Pg 124-140
• Bunson, Matthew (1993) The Vampire Encyclopedia (Crown Publications)
• Giblin, James L. (2001) "Review: Vampires and History" African Studies Review, Vol. 44, No. 1 (Apr., 2001), pp. 83-87
• Holtzman, Jon D. (2001) "Speaking With Vampires: Rumor and History in Colonial Africa" American Ethnologist Volume 28. Issue 3. August 2001, Pg 734-735.
• Melton, J. Gordon (1994) The Vampire Book (Visible Ink Press)
• Oinas, FJ (1978) - "Heretics as Vampires and Demons in Russia" The Slavic and East European Journal Vol 22 No 4 443-441
• Summers, Montague (1928) The Vampire, His Kith and Kin (Routledge and Keegan Paul)
• Summers, Montague (1929) The Vampire in Europe (Routledge and Keegan Paul)
• Twitchell, James B, (1975) The Living Dead: The Vampire in Romantic Literature (Duke University Press)

On a slightly iffier stance:

• Konstantinos (2002) Vampires: The Occult Truth Llewellyn Publications (to separate what is movie and literature based from the actual myths and legends.)
• Maberry, Jonatha (2006) Vampire Universe Citadel
• Russo, Arlene (2008) Vampire Nation Llewellyn Publications
• Wright, Dudley (2006) The book of vampires Dover Publications

While not all by scholars these do help in sorting the actual vampire of myth and legend from what movies and literature have created.--BruceGrubb (talk) 12:34, 9 June 2016 (UTC)

I have read many of these, including the ones in the article - Barber's book is excellent. There is no sharp line and the fascinating thing is the gradual evolution of the modern fictional vampire from that of folklore. I can probably get fulltexts of some of the above Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 13:38, 9 June 2016 (UTC)