Talk:United States v. Wilson

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Fate of Wilson?

This article concludes with an odd non-sequitur. Wilson was sentenced to be hanged. He refused the pardon. The Supreme Court ruled that the pardon was therefore not in effect. The logical conclusion would be that he was hanged. But "not released from prison early"? What exactly did happen to Wilson? Is there any documentation? Or did the non-acceptance of pardon nevertheless commute his sentence? More information please! Ptilinopus (talk) 00:58, 3 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Ptilinopus. This article has gone back and forth on whether Wilson was hanged many times over the years. It remains unclear and there's a newer discussion on this talk page if you've learned anything about this case since 2012. :-) --MZMcBride (talk) 03:45, 21 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Why?

Why did Wilson refuse the pardon? --Taejo|대조 14:41, 16 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Removed Overturned By

I make take a lot of heat/backlash from wikipedia editors as a anonymous editor but I really hope not.

I have removed the part that's states it was overturned in 1927 with the case Biddle v. Perovich.

I strongly disagree on two counts. First that case was about commuting powers of the president and NOT about Pardons. They differ because a commute can be for some sentence but not it's entire sentence. Also commutes can still appeal there cases if there where constitutional errors in there cases. I don't believe anybody who has accepted a pardon can do so as they have admitted committing the offense.

Second count that I disagree on is this: United States v. Wilson decided that a defendant can refuse a pardon. Biddle v. Perovich decided that A President can commute a death Penalty sentence. This however has no bearing to a non death penalty case and hence does not overturn any precedent of United States v. Wilson.

I don't know if after 1927 President's decided on there own that they can commute non death penalty sentences or if they had never been challenged. But what I do know is if another case had decided that issue, it would be more applicable to stating "Removed Overturned By" instead of the incorrect stating of Biddle v. Perovich.

Either way I conclude that A commute is not a Pardon. And A Pardon still can be accepted or denied but a commute probably can't — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.63.91.76 (talk) 06:33, 7 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

NOT Hanged - pardoned a second time

What is clear is that Wilson was never executed despite the court ruling that it couldn’t force him to take the pardon. He remained in prison doing hard labor until he completed a 10-year sentence for the charge of robbing the mail, according to a Jan. 14, 1841, story in The National Gazette in Philadelphia. The newspaper reported that Wilson was at that time released after being pardoned by President Martin Van Buren. President Jackson had pardoned Wilson from death for endangering the mailman’s life but had not pardoned him for other penalties related to that same charge. Van Buren’s pardon took an additional step and absolved Wilson of any remaining jail sentence.

He seemed to have learned his lesson: Wilson accepted the pardon the second time around.

https://www.columbianprogress.com/opinion-columns/historys-lone-refusal-presidential-pardon#sthash.uINsEYis.dpbs — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.150.38.110 (talk) 10:12, 20 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hi. Meanderingbartender re-added the hanged fact in this edit, citing <https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/brief-history-10-essential-presidential-pardons-arent-watergate-related-180964286/>. I get the feeling this is possibly a case of citogensis tho. --MZMcBride (talk) 03:44, 21 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@MZMcBride: after reading the above article, I think it might be too. I'm going to do some searching to see what comes up. It's a shame the author didn't directly link to the articles. Meanderingbartender (talk) 14:20, 22 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I edited the article to reflect the above article. Based on The Columbian Progress article and the original 1841 article, Wilson was most likely not hung. That being said, I think the Smithsonian article should be linked and mentioned. While, as MZMcBride suggests, it's probably a result of some type citogensis, I do think the magazine should be considered a reliable source and perhaps they have uncovered information to suggest that he was hung. Fact-checking during the 1840s wasn't and there's plenty of times the newspapers have gotten basic facts wrong. A common name of Wilson might have caused confusion. Meanderingbartender (talk) 12:44, 29 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Nice, thanks. I made some tweaks to the article as well. It's an interesting case for sure. --MZMcBride (talk) 23:25, 3 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]