Talk:Trinidadian and Tobagonian English

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This article is written in Trinidadian English, which has its own spelling conventions (colour, realise, analyse) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus.

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Merge with Trinidadian Creole English?

I wonder why these are separate articles. In my experience, most Trinidadians are consciously able to move up and down a "spectrum" ranging from standard English with a slight but definite Trinidadian accent, to a "pure" Creole. Men, in particular, will tend to adjust their speech to the specific situation they are in. Words thought of as "Creole" can be injected into a conventional English sentence for humorous effect. Feedback? Jpaulm (talk) 20:26, 3 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Isn't this parallel with other creole languages? We have Jamaican Patois but also Jamaican English, yet the two exist on a continuum. — Æµ§œš¹ _{[aɪm ˈfɹ̠ˤʷɛ̃ɾ̃ˡi]} 17:53, 14 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Exactly! That's why I am questioning if we need three articles describing points on a continuum. I could see having separate articles for the two ends, but having three seems like overkill. As you mention, the Jamaican articles seem better organized, with only two points on the continuum. Jpaulm (talk) 20:27, 17 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I totally agree with the above notes. There seems no reason to have two articles - how can one differentiate between "Trinidadian English" and "Trinidadian Creole English"? It seems to me, as the first writer pointed out that usage is more of a sliding scale of intensity often used by the same people rather than seperate dialects. I can't see any justification for having two articles. I vote strongly for a MERGE. Sincerely, John Hill (talk) 22:13, 17 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

No comments in a year, so I'm removing the tag. If we do merge, it's this article that should be a rd., since the creole is the distinct language. — kwami (talk) 09:35, 11 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Merger proposal

I propose that Trinidadian Creole be merged into Trinidadian English. I think that the content in the Trinidadian Creole article can easily be explained in the context of Trinidadian English, and the Trinidadian English article is of a reasonable size in which the merging of Trinidadian Creole will not cause any problems as far as article size or undue weight is concerned. Also, I think it may prevent confusion with Trinidadian French Creole which used to be simply called (Trinidadian) Creole. John Hill (talk) 22:35, 17 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

FWIW, the Creole and the English variety are separate languages. Beyond this one caveat, I'm somewhat neutral to this proposal, though I think that, if we are to merge these two articles, including Tobagonian Creole would also be in order. — Æµ§œš¹ _{[aɪm ˈfɹ̠ˤʷɛ̃ɾ̃ˡi]} 02:29, 18 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

As a matter of interest, I thought I should add here that Trinidadian French Creole was still commonly spoken in some Trinidadian villages (especially in the northern range) as a "first language" in the 1950s. My father, who grew up totally bilingual in Montreal learned how to speak it fluently which won him many friends and helped him in his work as a doctor. People were amazed to find a foreigner who could speak it so well. Cheers, John Hill (talk) 05:26, 18 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Adding to my earlier note above - I am against the merger. I believe Trinidad Creole should remain a separate article as it was based on French. Although, Trinidad English could be called a 'Creole language' in linguistic terms - referring to Trinidad English as 'Trinidad Creole' would cause much confusion. I also think the article on Trinidadian Creole should focus on the recently extinct French Creole (which deserves an article, I believe) and information now in that article about Trinidad English should be moved to this article. Any comments? John Hill (talk) 08:42, 22 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I oppose this merger as, even if there is continuum between the two, that does not mean we should merge the articles. Dutch and German dialects are also in a continuum for example but noone in their right mind would dream of merging the articlesan "Dutch language" and "German language". One possibility in order to make things clearer on the two creole languages could be to call one article "Trinidadian French creole" and the "Trinidadian English creole". Munci (talk) 13:10, 13 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I like your suggestion to have two articles: "Trinidadian French creole" and the "Trinidadian English creole". It makes good sense to me. Cheers, John Hill (talk) 11:24, 11 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

What happened to the proposal to merge the two articles? I am not sure about developing two articles entitled "Trinidadian French creole" and "Trinidadian English creole" because the latter incorporates remnants of the former. It makes more sense to have one article on Trinidadian Creole that includes its history and how it evolved from an Antillean Creole to a primarily English-based Creole that still possesses markers of its French past. Redwellie14 (talk) 20:56, 21 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Keep it as Trinidadian English

It not a form of Creole but if you are mergering you should megar it from Trinidadian Creole to Trinidadian English because creole is a old lagaunge of french and Today Trinidadian speak English.(Kylekieran (talk) 15:19, 21 May 2011 (UTC)).[reply]

Creole is also a term that refers to a type of language. See Creole language. — Æµ§œš¹ _{[aɪm ˈfɹ̠ˤʷɛ̃ɾ̃ˡi]} 15:39, 21 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Northern Trinidadian accent

In Trinidad there is part that has a particular accent that merges British with American.Trinidadian creole is mainly spoken in the southern areas. In the north the English is better. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.45.87.197 (talk) 02:05, 14 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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Page move

I undid the recent undiscussed page move to "Trinidad and Tobagonian English". There's no such term. There is a single collective term for Trinidadians and Tobagonians - Trinbagonians - but it's a colloquial term. Guettarda (talk) 04:04, 26 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]