Talk:TorqueFlite/Archive 1

Archive 1

• Moved strewn developments to their own chronologically-organized section. Added filter, fluid, linkage, shifter and valve body changes.

• Corrected pushbutton sequence and description of park mechanism added for 1960/1962.

• Deleted lengthy lists of individual vehicle models that used TorqueFlite transmissions (lists were superfluous given existence of more tractible links to Dodge, Plymouth, Chrysler, DeSoto, etc.; lists were also incomplete and inaccurate years were shown).

• Corrected A518 info (it was not a strengthened A500, it was a development of the A727 into a 4-speed transmission, done in rough parallel with the development of the A904 into the A500 4-speed).

• Added A618

• Added A404, A413, A470, A670 (these, not only according to all Chrysler sales, parts and service literature but also based on design and engineering) are TorqueFlites, too!

• Added "LoadFlite" name used by Dodge Truck division

Still needed: Specific years for:

    *introduction of A998, A999, A518 and A618 
    *Replacement of hydraulic controls with electronic 
    *Change to SAE transmission designations.

Scheinwerfermann 20:56, 9 March 2006 (EST)

Designation formatting

Chrysler service and identification literature does not hyphenate old-form transmission model designations (e.g., A904, not A-904). Scheinwerfermann 03:05, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the clarification, I was wondering why the hyphens were removed. --ApolloBoy 03:10, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

Dropping pushbuttons, adopting levers

I've reverted the text stating that pushbutton control was abandoned due to "consumer resistance and safety regulations requiring a standard shift pattern". We should indeed discuss why the buttons were dropped, but this is not such a simple matter as it seems on first blush. For one thing, there were no "safety regulations requiring a standard shift pattern" until the National Highway and Traffic Safety Act of 1967, which established NHTSA, who promulgated the US' first-ever Federal motor vehicle safety standards for the 1968 model year. One of those standards dealt with vehicle controls and displays, and that should probably be mentioned, but it did not explicitly prohibit a pushbutton shifter arrangement such as was used through MY64 in most Torqueflite applications. Indeed, Neoplan and Flxbl municipal buses, which are subject to the same control/display regulations as passenger cars, used an almost identical pushbutton shifter in buses for many years _starting_ in the 1970s. So, that theory's a nonstarter.

What, then, was the problem with pushbuttons? Various theories have been advanced, most of which centre around a theme of consumer distaste for the buttons. One of the variants on the theme is that Chrysler wanted to make a special effort to have their cars chosen by driver's education programs, to try and attract brand-new drivers to Chrysler products. But, driver's education programs tended not to buy pushbutton-drive cars because they were considered unconventional. This certainly sounds as though it could be plausible, but there is a great deal of research that would have to be done to validate it. I've got several driver's-ed textbooks from that era, and they're all quite matter-of-fact about the different kinds of gear selectors, including buttons and levers. And buttons were regarded by some fairly influential and highly noted auto-safety commentators of the day as much safer than shift levers for multiple reasons: No shift stick upon which for unbelted occupants to be impaled in a crash, shift selector out of reach of children riding in the front seat or waiting in the parked car, etc.

So...probably what we'll have to have is a paragraph discussing the various reasons that have been advanced, and leaving it as a question without a definitively "correct" answer. Scheinwerfermann 23:28, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

Pushbutton labelling

I have reverted 201.8.7.21's edit, because it was not correct. The buttons were most frequently labelled R, N, D, 2, and 1. On some models, for example the 1962-'63 Plymouth, the buttons were labelled Reverse, Neutral, Drive, Second, and First. They were never lablled R, N, D, S, and F. --Scheinwerfermann 01:21, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

A413 (31TH) vs. ATX

Conceptually, the A413/31TH is broadly similar to the ATX the same way the A904 is comparable to the C4 or TH350: all three of those are light-to-medium-duty RWD 3-speed torque converter automatics, just as ATX and A413 are both light-duty FWD 3-speed torque converter automatics. But, the design and operational details of ATX and A413 are sufficiently different that we do not call them the same, and "very similar" is also overstating the case.--Scheinwerfermann 05:21, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

Archive 1