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Archive 1Archive 2

Punk?

I don't see how Tom Petty could be considered punk. So a discussion is needed. FMAFan1990 19:28, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

    • As a member of WikiProject Punk music, I removed the punk tag for this new wave/rock music artist. Anyone who claims this is punk probably needs to educate themselves about the genre. Disharge is punk, Sex Pistols are punk... Tom Petty is NOT. He sprung from punk's idea of simple rock & roll music though, with a mainstream songwriting sensibility and pop/rock approach. Tim010987 12:59 AM, 19 May 2008 (UTC)
      • While it may seem strange to think of Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers in contemporary terms as a punk rock group, when they first emerged in 1977 they were considered by some to be part of the punk/new wave movement and were often described as such in the media. Petty and the Heartbreakers were booked into punk venues such as CBGB and the Whisky a Go-Go, and shared bills with punk rockers Blondie, the Runaways, the Boomtown Rats, Elvis Costello, David Johansen, Patti Smith and Mink DeVille. Like other so-called punk groups such as Television and Mink DeVille, Petty shunned the punk label as it was a commercial liability and sometimes associated with amateurish musicianship. Although one could argue that Petty was never truly punk to begin with, it was partly how he was defined by others early in his career and the punk designation is important in a historical context to any examination of the group's history. Piriczki (talk) 22:29, 21 May 2008 (UTC)
  • I don't really care if the tag is kept or not. It is pretty trivial. But aside from the article I already posted above (did any of you read it? Doesn't seem so.) Tom Petty HIMSELF in his "Conversations with Tom Petty" book said that in the very beginning he was classified as punk -- because they weren't quite sure what to call him. If you listen/watch early stuff by him he really exudes (sp?) the entire punk attitude. Of course over the years his sound got very refined. I don't see what is so threatening to the "punk" historians. It's a tag. It represents a small blip in the history of TPATH. While the tag could stay I would just assume remove it to keep all these so-called punk experts from every few months coming through this page raising a fuss. --Mudcrutch (talk) 02:54, 22 May 2008 (UTC)
  • Something needs to be done to stop the is punk and isn't punk edits in the article or we will be in a on going loop which isn't really helpful and it's not improving the article. Bidgee (talk) 14:02, 22 May 2008 (UTC)
  • Maybe some would consider this revisionist history, but to put Tom Petty in the Punk movement is plain wrong. Just because his star rose on the same stage as real Punks and New Wavers doesn't make his music part of the Punk genre. I was in clubs back then and there was a lot of different stuff going on. You need to recall that in the late 70's crappy pop music was taking over the charts in the mainstream and stadium rockers were becoming big hair, makeup clown shows. The thing that set Petty apart and probably why the A&R people liked him so much was he was unafraid to play basic R&R with pop hooks. As far as how they looked or the on-stage attitude they were much more stylistically like the Stones than the Sex Pistols. The big difference is that they successfully played clubs and smaller venues rather than exclusively stadium & amphitheater gigs. They were (and are) a bar band, as were many of the real Punk and New Wave bands they shared the stage with. Using the same logic you might as well call him Glam since he looked a lot like David Bowie did then. Remove the Punk tag for accuracy sake. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.119.70.252 (talk) 14:24, 22 May 2008 (UTC) and leann walker loves him.
  • From here: http://www.mtv.com/music/artist/petty_tom/artist.jhtml#bio - "Upon the release of their first album in the late '70s, Tom Petty & the Heartbreakers were shoehorned into the punk/new wave movement by some observers who picked up on the tough, vibrant energy of the group's blend of Byrds riffs and Stonesy swagger."

From here: http://www.rockhall.com/inductee/tom-petty-and-the-heartbreakers - "Their self-titled debut album appeared in 1976. It boasted the tunefulness of Sixties pop, the sinewy crunch of Seventies rock and the bristling energy of the nascent punk movement."

This site: http://www.superseventies.com/pettytom.html quotes a Rolling Stone article - "When punk rock arrived as a combative answer to the bloating and fatigue of 1970s rock, an odd thing happened: Bands that were interested only in plugging in and channeling Chuck Berry were cast in with Britain's latest rabble. It meant that the likes of Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers found themselves the unsuspecting, amused ambassadors of a "new" music that, from their vantage point, hardly seemed new."

These excerpts (and Mudcrutch's, above) seem to show that Petty was lumped in with the punk rock movement when it happened, but wasn't entirely pleased with it. Whether this means he should be categorised as such now remains to be seen, but it gives some explanation as to why the tag is there. Phileas (talk) 17:39, 22 May 2008 (UTC)

OK, let's put it another way. Name one Petty song that a listerner would hear and say, "Wow, now there's a Punk Rock song". I could name dozens of songs by the Ramones, the Clash, or even the Pretenders. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.119.70.252 (talk) 20:57, 22 May 2008 (UTC)

I don't believe this approach is helpful, as it's too subjective. I think we should instead focus on what reliable sources say. Sarcasticidealist (talk) 20:15, 23 May 2008 (UTC)
I agree. There are people who say that Blink-182 are punk and others who think that's crap. Also, does the punk label merely refer to the musical content itself, or whether the artist is involved with/associated with the genre? (That's a genuine question; if we can determine criteria for attributing a genre to an artist, I think determining whether or not Tom Petty warrants the 'punk' catergory or not will be easier). Phileas (talk) 21:17, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

When a musician is asked about his/her genre (not influences), they are asking about their music. The references talked about about above refer not to his music, but his presence on the music scene. These are two different things. There is nothing Punk about Tom Petty's music. To have him Punk listed as one of his genre is misleading, inaccurate. I don't know what is meant by "reliable sources". The question is whether Tom Petty is musically classified as Punk. I have seen absolutely nothing offered as evidence that his music genre is Punk, only that he was playing during the strong point of the Punk movement in the late 70's. If the Punk Rock genre tag stays, then defend it with a strong reference. If it the catagorization is not strongly referenced and supposition is being used (as I believe is the case), remove the tag. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.119.70.252 (talk) 21:45, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

I can write some A&R people that I know and get their opinions. Is that reliable? I hate to make a big deal over a small issue, I just get annoyed when I see things that stand out like a sore thumb on a wiki site. That and I am a big fan of Petty's music and what he has done and continues to do for real music. I also liked Punk. It just doens't sit well with me. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.119.70.252 (talk) 21:56, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

  • How about removing the tag, but reference how they were labeled punk/new wave in the 70s within the article. Problem solved. (It may already be there I just need to re-read it.) --Mudcrutch (talk) 22:00, 23 May 2008 (UTC)
I can see it now; "It was the Sex Pistols in the UK, and in the US it was...Tom Petty alongside the Ramones!" LOL, I guess the Ramones only beat Tom Petty by a few months or HE would have been the first punk rocker amirite?! First paragraph it lists his 50 'chart-topping adult contemporary hits' and 'classic rock radio staples'...zOMG PUNK AS F***! ...You can't rebel against '70s radio pop/rock if you ARE '70s radio pop/rock. --User:Tim010987 (talk) 3:47 AM, 25 May 2008 (UTC)
The Ramones have all mostly died. Actually, just [[Rock music|Rock]] is fine. He;s done a number of styles; its important not to let the infobox get over-crowded. indopug (talk) 02:05, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
Further, its clearly not a major genre in his career so why have as a main genre highlighted out in the infobox? THe mentions of punk rock in his early career in the prose of his career will suffice. indopug (talk) 02:08, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
I agree with this. Only have the most important categories in the infobox but mention his perceived affiliation with the punk scene in the main text. Phileas (talk) 14:24, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
I also agree. Except for the broad Rock music category, all of the other genres that have been listed come with caveats or require explanation that is best left for the body of the article. Piriczki (talk) 23:02, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Given how the genre is being changed back and forth, back and forth, again and again by many different users, I've added a short advisory on the page to read this discussion before making any changes to that section. Don't know if it'll do any good, but I thought I'd try. Phileas (talk) 02:47, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Back in the early Nineteen-Eighties, I used to refer to Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers as 'country,' and people would always correct me. Eligius (talk) 05:28, 28 September 2009 (UTC)

Birth year

I went to Howard Bishop Jr. High and Gainesville High school with Tom(my) and my wife's family grew up next door to him. He was our age, and we both were born in 1950. mccislcm.

Was Tom Petty born 1950 or 1953? Google doesn't help, giving many sources for each version. Dbenbenn 01:47, 25 Dec 2004 (UTC)

I did some checking, and there are a lot of sources saying that he was born in 1953, as well as in 1950. However, there are more than a few sources which agree with the below that he graduated from high school in 1968, but I couldn't find any suggesting that he graduated 1970-1972. This seems like pretty good evidence that 1950 is right, unless we find something that says he graduated three years early. - Nat Krause 19:33, 13 August 2005 (UTC)

Tom Petty was born in 1950. Tom graduated in 1968 one year ahead of my sister Carolyn and me from Gainesville High School. My sister was born in 1951 and I was born in 1952. My sister and I were in the same grade because I skipped third grade. My mother and I did a radio talk show in Gainesville, Florida for ten years on 97X radio station called "Down The Street". We had the pleasure of interviewing Tom's father Earl Petty several times. We also went to school with Tom's two cousins Sadie and Norma Darnell.

Tom is a wonderful person and an incredible muscian and songwriter. Always has been, always will be.

Bonnie Mountain ==

movie left out?

he also starred in the postman.. didnt see that mentioned anywhere. not sure if its significant tho.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0119925

Principal authors need to address these topics

I was impressed with the article overall- I went through it and made some minor corrections -- spelling, syntax, a minor fact here and there.

Topics that are conspicuously absent from the article:

  • The departure of Stan Lynch from the Heartbreakers in 1994.
  • Didn't Tom do the soundtrack for a movie - the songs Zero from Outer Space and (She makes me feel like an) Asshole- are on there. I can't think of the name of the movie, but that seems significant and should be mentioned in the article.
  • A sentence or two on the death of Howie Epstein.

Hokeman 05:33, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

For the second point, Tom did the soundtrack to She's the One. To be honest, this article seems to omit a lot of his late 90s-2000s musical work (awards and TV appearances notwithstanding). I'll try and add some stuff. Phileas 01:19, 29 March 2006 (UTC)
I've added what I know, but if anyone has any more details on these more recent albums it would make the end more beefy. Reading it back, the article seems to lack a decent structure, though. Maybe the 'Biography' section needs to be split up further, into a section on Tom's history, the progression of the band and Tom's TV appearances. What do other people think? Phileas 01:43, 29 March 2006 (UTC)

Plagiarism

Shouldn't we include something about Red Hot Chilli Peppers stealing from him? I think there's quite a bit of infomation on the internet. Thunder Cat 09:21, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

  • I found the quote I was looking for -- Petty tells PageSix.com, "I seriously doubt that there is any negative intent there. And a lot of rock 'n' roll songs sound alike. Ask CHUCK BERRY. THE STROKES took AMERICAN GIRL (for their song LAST NITE), and I saw an interview with them where they actually admitted it. That made me laugh out loud. I was like, 'OK, good for you'.

"If someone took my song note for note and stole it maliciously, then maybe (I'd sue). But I don't believe in lawsuits much. I think there are enough frivolous law suits in this country without people fighting over pop songs." -- Mudcrutch

  • Why is the bit in there about Roger McGuinn's wondering at first if "American Girl" was one of his? I know it might be a comparison of another instance of plagiarism, but, well, if Tom doesn't believe the RHCP ripped him off, why should that be in there? Indeed, one (apparently unwarranted) suspicion of plagiarism certainly doesn't justify another anyway. -Wikitoddia 06:39, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

ROGER: "When did I record this?" MANAGER: "You didn't." ROGER: "I know I didn't. (Chuckle) Who is it?"

Their styles and influences are similar. I don' think that plagarism was ever implied. Tom and Roger are great friends, as a matter of fact. Roger appears on Runnin' Down a Dream (film) and talks about his friendship with Tom. Tom, at one point, helped Roger fight an A & R rep. who told Roger to record a song that he felt was "too commercial" and "unlike him."


  • (With huge respect towards Roger I would like to say...) Roger McGuinn has written TONS of material, and was even paid by a record company to sit and make songs that emulate "popular" songs of the times. (You can hear him discuss this on his own album "LIVE from Mars.") The fact he mentioned American Girl is a testament of how Petty does sound similar to McGuinn himself in many songs. I feel that line should be removed. -- Mudcrutch

Shouldn't Tom Petty and Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers be different articles?

While looking through the article, it seems it's an amalgamation of Tom Petty info as well as Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers. Shouldn't the band, Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers, be split out into its own article? I mean, Dave Matthews Band and Dave Matthews are different articles, is that really much different? Joltman 14:39, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

  • I definitely agree. I think the general fan may see them as being the "same" but I think as more and more information gets added, we may need to divide up the two. (Basically if not now already, then very soon.) -- Mudcrutch
I think the whole article needs a cleanup. Right now the 'biography' section contains everything. I think it should be separated into a biography, music career, filmography, that sort of thing. Phileas 00:31, 7 July 2006 (UTC)



I AGREE T P & TP HEARTBREAKERS SHOULD BE 2 ARTICLES

THERR ARE A LOT OF BAND ARTICLES JUST LIKE THIS ONE

I tried to make them two separate pages once, but it got reverted and I refuse to go through all that trouble again

Dave Grohl as a Heartbreaker

  • I have removed him under the list of former Heartbreakers. If everybody that played with the band was considered a "Heartbreaker" then that would be a long list. Yes, he did play with the band a number of times (notably on SNL around the release of "Wildflowers") but I see no basis to consider him a Heartbreaker. -- Mudcrutch
  • How about considering him a Heartbreaker because he was asked to join the band. That's why he appeared on SNL. It was after that that he decided to leave and form the Foo Fighters. While he never recorded with the band, he was a Heartbreaker (just very breifly) KitHutch 02:00, 8 August 2006 (UTC)
  • He was asked to join. He declined. He was never a Heartbeaker. There is no reason for him to be on the list. If there is an interest is starting a "musicians who played with the band" then by all means start one. In recent memory: Jacob Dylan and the rest of the Wallflowers, Eddie Vedder, Stevie Nix, Bob Dylan, etc. etc... Mudcrutch

Nascar Drivers?

The lead included a disclaimer that Tom Petty is not related to NASCAR drivers Richard Petty or Kyle Petty. Ridiculous and amateurish in the lead, irrelevant anywhere else. I removed it. If someone chooses to revert, edit the sentence for grammar. "Not related to both" is incorrect. Iconoclastodon 06:48, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

For reference: "He has the same last name as fellow NASCAR Drivers Richard Petty and Kyle Petty, but he is not related to both of them." If for some bizarre reason someone feels this needs to stay, it should be lower in the article, and written correctly. "Fellow nascar drivers"? I didn't realize Tom Petty was a NASCAR driver. Otherwise, it answers an uninteresting question that no one has asked. Iconoclastodon 06:53, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

Cdeighan12, in your last edit, in which you replaced this passage, you noted "Note: if anyone takes off this sentence one more time i am going to keep putting the same sentence on there." Why? This is trivia and does not belong on Tom Petty's entry. If you have a compelling argument otherwise you could do the courtesy of presenting it on the already existing discussion item. Iconoclastodon 04:28, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

It doesn't need to be anywhere in the article. Petty is a common last name. Such trivial information such as Tom not being related to a couple NASCAR drivers is pointless. Dismas|(talk) 05:13, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Roger Waters likes Tom Petty.

At least in Argentina in March 17th 2007, in the prologue of The Dark Side of the Moon concert by Roger Waters where he denote that he doesn´t like ABBA cutting their songs, Refugee by Tom Petty sounds all over the River Plate stadium. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Luis de Ranchos (talk • contribs) 11:31, 8 April 2007 (UTC).

Fallout Shelter

Is the part about Tom practising in his family fall-out shelter true? It's never mentioned in Conversations with Tom Petty. Can anyone verify it? Phileas 13:42, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Reference [1] is invalid.

I don't know if it was ever correct, but right now it links to a news story about something totally unrelated. I guess some other citation is required? Unmake 05:55, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

French Lick, Indiana

The page mentions Tom was born and raised in Gainesville, but in the bar on the side it states French Lick, Indiana. These seem to contradict each other. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.53.203.124 (talk) 02:49, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

Drug use

Anyone have info about Petty's history with drugs? Is it a lot or very little? Is it marijuana or more than that? Is it often or seldom? Is it in his past or continual? Did he have the last dance with Mary Jane or is that yet to come? 65.91.102.204 (talk) —Preceding comment was added at 16:39, 10 December 2007 (UTC)

Petty vs. BF Goodrich

In Views on artistic control, it says:

"In 1987, Petty sued tire company B.F. Goodrich for using a song very similar to his 'Mary's New Car' in a TV commercial. The ad agency that produced the commercial had previously sought permission to use Petty's song but was refused."

So what was the result? Did his lawsuit succeed? Was it settled? Enquiring Minds…--HughGRex (talk) 00:49, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

I can't find the information anywhere on the web. If I had to hazard a guess, I'd say that it was settled out of court with an agreement that neither side would disclose the nature of the settlement; that's how these things usually turn out. Sarcasticidealist (talk) 00:57, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

Super Bowl

I thought it would be good if we made the tense of him playing the super bowl correct. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.215.11.118 (talk) 01:20, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

  • I'm sorry, but isn't this the sort of thing that should be included in the "summary of edits" field? Or better yet, since it is such a minor edit just check the box. I'm not quite sure that an edit to this talk page was required. Dcs315 (talk) 01:36, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

Someone forgot to put in that Petty also played Runnin' Down a Dream at the Halftime show.

Mary Jane's / Waiting For the Sun

Both are great songs, but I don't see this supposed strong similarity between the two songs. Is this perhaps an overzealous Jayhawks fan injecting some POV here? Lambertman (talk) 01:54, 4 February 2008 (UTC)


Tom Petty's "College Quote"

Is there any truth to whether or not Tom petty was the one who coined the quote about college..."You have four years to be irresponsible here. Relax. Work is for people with jobs. You'll never remember class time, but you'll remember the time you spent hanging out with your friends. So stay up late, go out on Tuesday when you have a paper due Wednesday. Spend money you don't have. Drink 'til sunrise. The work never ends, but college does."...please let me know because i doubt it's validity. i dont even know if tom went to college. - Futbaldc2 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Futbaldc2 (talk • contribs) 07:01, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Guitar should be mentioned

Petty's signature white teardrop-shaped guitar should be mentioned in the article (who is the maker, etc.). Badagnani (talk) 06:03, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

New Album?

I've heard that Petty's releasing a new album, but iDunno anything else - anyone know anything? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.30.52.10 (talk) 01:16, 12 September 2008 (UTC) Where did you hear that? - Feeling free —Preceding unsigned comment added by Feeling free (talk • contribs) 16:29, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

Maybe with his former band Mudcrutch? 68.252.29.46 (talk) 17:27, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

Sound clips

Anyone think we need some for the article? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Craigboy (talk • contribs) 05:34, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

I'd like one of "Depot Street," the Mudcrutch single. Eligius (talk) 05:35, 28 September 2009 (UTC)

Full Moon Fever

The implication that Full Moon Fever is to any extent a sort of Traveling Wilburys effort is nonsense. Roy Orbison and George Harrison's contributions are 100% invisible -- limited to one song each and in no way discernible. Petty and Lynne are the only Wilburys who participate in any meaningful way. The same goes for the Heartbreakers: Campbell and Petty are the only ones who make any meaningful contribution. Howie's background vocals are indiscernible and Benmont's contribution on piano to one of the lesser-known songs on the album is, by his own acknowledgement, no distinctive contribution at all. Also, this album was started before the Traveling Wilburys were even formed. Tom started it in early 1988 before the Wilburys album was recorded, then finished it after the Wilburys first album. It was in no way a second Wilburys album, or a Heartbreakers album. If the liner notes did not indicate their participation, one could never discern the presence of Orbison, Harrison, or Epstein.

I think the article should be changed to reflect reality, not the nicest story.Cbben (talk) 10:41, 25 June 2011 (UTC)

Paternity

I realize that 'paternity' refers to a relationship between a child and a parent, but this isn't what is being referred to in this article. Maybe the Section Heading could be reworded. Mikenlesley (talk) 12:35, 19 January 2014 (UTC)

Reference 28 Re: Red Hot Chili Peppers and Plagiarism is a Dead Link. 184.76.56.97 (talk)JSJR 01232015 — Preceding undated comment added 10:36, 23 January 2015 (UTC)

Shelter?

The second paragraph says: "Shortly after its release the band was dragged into a legal dispute when ABC Records, Shelter's mother company, was sold to MCA Records."

My question is, what's Shelter?? The article doesn't say. Is Shelter Petty's record company? This needs some explanation in the article. Dismas|(talk) 19:31, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

Unfortunately, the information above is not exactly accurate; inquiring minds should read the Special Collector's Edition of Tom Petty published by Rolling Stone. There is a reprinting of Mikal Gilmore's article from the February 21, 1980 issue of Rolling Stone wherein she states on page 23 Danny Bramson (26) an MCA-Universal exec who was 'heading' a subsidiary label for MCA; {i.e. Backstreet Records} and it was Bramson who approached Tom Petty's managers and eventually signed TP & the HBs to the label which, BTW, was already an existing label. Shelter was a record label owned by Denny Cordell and Leon Russell and distributed by MCA. Besides Leon, Freddie King was also on the label. 184.76.56.97 (talk) JSJR 01232015 — Preceding undated comment added 11:01, 23 January 2015 (UTC)

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Petty biography by Warren Zanes

In August through November 2015 there were articles about the upcoming Petty: The Biography by Warren Zanes who plays for The Del Fuegos.[1][2][3] This article is dated "6 months ago" (roughly mid-September 2015) and says the book was to be released "next month" or October 2015.

Some articles about this book say it's by Warren Haynes. That's incorrect.

http://us.macmillan.com/petty/warrenzanes is the publisher's page about the book:

  • Hardcover ISBN 9780805099683 (November 2015) - On Amazon at http://www.amazon.com/dp/0805099689
  • eBook ISBN 9780805099690 (November 2015)
  • Trade Paperback ISBN 9781250105196 (forthcoming in October 2016) - On Amazon at http://www.amazon.com/dp/1250105196

I can't see a good way to add mention of the book. Maybe it could go in the "Personal life" section but I don't know how much Petty himself worked with Zanes on the book. --Marc Kupper|talk 07:19, 23 March 2016 (UTC)

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Tom Petty/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

Thank you for protecting this page. Wikipedia users seem to be slow sometimes to recognize vandals and people seeking attention.

Last edited at 01:23, 4 February 2008 (UTC). Substituted at 09:00, 30 April 2016 (UTC)

YEARS ACTIVE

Tom was musically active (at least) by 1970 with Mudcrutch. Are we saying he became musically active in 1976 just to satisfy the standards of a "band" wiki page? Just to keep it separate from Mudcrutch? If so, the problem is that this also serves as a biographical entry. Really, it seems the guy was born musically active, but I think we should probably change it to when he began playing music, not when he started releasing music as "Tom Petty". Rob Shepard (talk) 05:27, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

It would be helpful if there was a more specific guideline for this field in the infobox. It seems to be left to the editors to define "active" and there are different interpretations in use. The Billy Joel article has a start date of 1964 based on when he joined his first high school band but it wasn't until 1967 that he was in a band that actually released any records (The Hassles), the Todd Rundgren article uses 1967 when he formed his first band of any note (Nazz) and released his first record although he had been in other bands previously, and the Bruce Springsteen article uses 1972 when he signed with Columbia Records even though he had been in working bands since 1965. So in the case of Tom Petty you could consider several dates: 1964 (when he joined his first high school band), 1970 (when Mudcrutch was formed), 1974 (when Mudcrutch signed a recording contract), 1975 (Mudcrutch released their first record) or 1976 when the Heartbreakers were formed and their first record was released. Take your pick I guess. Piriczki (talk) 18:29, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

I agree. I would think there are many people who could fill in the gap from 1970 - 1976. There's a seemingly inaccurate tag on a clip from "The Old Grey Whistle Test" which states he was making more money than his father playing music back then. I doubt it. Tom rode an old black bicycle around town, often wearing a white t-shirt and if Mudcrutch got paid playing (they played "everywhere"), it wasn't much. When they weren't throwing their oown $1 admission concerts at "Mudcrutch Farm" at the north end of town, they practiced incessantly; so much that when they moved to a house near Shands Medical Center,one of their neighbors would tape them during the night on his reel-to-reel, then point his amplifiers at them and play it back in the morning when the band was finally asleep, in retribution for keeping him up all night. They also did a great cover of the Yardbird's, "The Train Kept A Rollin'" which I would love to hear again. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.79.26.188 (talk) 12:59, 20 May 2016 (UTC)

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