Talk:Thrasyllus

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Untitled

I've gone ahead and put this article here, but I'm open to the possibility that this might become a disambig page for the two Thrasylli. --Robth^Talk 05:33, 6 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Rewrite revert

Hey there,

I disagree with your decision to revert the changes I made to the article. While I appeared to have introduced a number of factual inaccuracies, these should be addressed individually. I think that the previous version of this article assumed too much of the average reader. Reading about this general for the first time, I found myself stopping often (hoplite? Miletus? the fleet? What fleet? What's going on?). It wasn't until hours later that the background of Thrasyllus' life started to become clear, as I explored the unintroduced assumptions this article makes about the reader's knowledge of this subject. We cannot just write these articles for Histiophiles.

Moreover, I feel that Orwell would begin to cry at the number of cliche phrases in this article.

I will do my best to remove the inaccuracies, even if lesser truths can occasionally be more useful for painting a picture.Yeago 19:31, 1 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for working on the language and the accessibility; I think I've nipped all the inaccuracies introduced now, although I need to check on whether Thrasyllus held the office of strategos continually till his death as the article now implies (I think so, but I'm not quite sure). For this article, I assume that a reader will have some degree of background knowledge (otherwise they'd want to go look at Peloponnesian War first), so I don't know that making some assumptions is entirely inappropriate, but it usually doesn't hurt to make things as clear as possible. Just be careful, if you're going to be making further major changes, to preserve the sense of the content. --Robth^Talk 19:59, 1 March 2007 (UTC:

Sure buddy. This whole subject has recently become very fascinating to me. =) I see you've been into it a while.

I think that perhaps making Peloponnesian War pre-required reading is a bit much =). I haven't read it yet, although reading this article certainly made me want to read it, and now I see how Thrasyllus' story fits into the larger part. Now, if the reader wants to be explained what Athens was, or what a Navy is, I certainly can't accomodate them here. =). Nonetheless, Hoplite, Mindarus, and the coup now have proper introductions.

Thanks a bunch, I'm eager to see what you dig up. This whole branch of articles is really well researched.Yeago 20:08, 1 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Glad to hear you've liked it, and the Peloponnesian war articles in general; there's much to do yet, but a lot of folks have done great work to get to where we are; if you're interested in editing more in this area, there's no lack of things to do (much of what's listed here, for example, probably shares some of the problems you identified with this article...). --Robth^Talk 20:25, 1 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Mindarus

Battle_of_Cyzicus gives no indication that Thrasyllus was involved.

He was not; I assumed you'd included the battle here in order to to contextualize this story in terms of the larger narrative of this part of the war. --Robth^Talk 20:25, 1 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

No mention of Socrates?

So, I'm not an expert in this area. I was just today trying to figure out why Socrates was sentenced to death. There was an article in the Atlantic about the two concepts of free speech in ancient Greece and the death of Socrates:

If isegoria was fundamentally about equality, then, parrhesia was about liberty in the sense of license—not a right, but rather an unstable privilege enjoyed at the pleasure of the powerful. In Athenian democracy, that usually meant the majority of one’s fellow citizens, who were known to shout down or even drag speakers they disliked (including Plato’s brother, Glaucon) off the bema. This ancient version of “no-platforming” speakers who offended popular sensibilities could have deadly consequences—as the trial and death of Socrates, Plato’s friend and teacher, attests.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/12/two-concepts-of-freedom-of-speech/546791/

So, I was trying to find out why Socrates was sentenced to death. I came across the following quote, supposedly from Xenophon's Memorabilia:

"At one time Socrates was a member of the Council [boule], he had taken the senatorial oath, and sworn 'as a member of that house to act in conformity with the laws.' It was thus he chanced to be President of the Popular Assembly [ekklesia], when that body was seized with a desire to put the nine generals, Thrasyllus, Erasinides, and the rest, to death by a single inclusive vote. Whereupon, in spite of the bitter resentment of the people, and the menaces of several influential citizens, he refused to put the question, esteeming it of greater importance faithfully to abide by the oath which he had taken, than to gratify the people wrongfully, or to screen himself from the menaces of the mighty."

https://www.thoughtco.com/what-was-the-charge-against-socrates-121060

So, it was because of this and other generals that Socrates was killed. Shouldn't this be mentioned?

On a slightly unrelated note, there seems to be some uncertainty about the number of generals who were tried. This wikipedia article says:

"the generals were deposed from their offices and recalled to Athens. Two fled, but Thrasyllus and five others returned to the city. ... In a vicious and emotional meeting of the assembly the next day, the assembly, following the lead of the aggressive Callixeinus, tried the generals en masse and condemned them all to die."

This would indicate there were 8 generals. Whereas the Xenophon quote indicates there were 9. Also, I can't find any other names besides Thrasyllus & Erasinides. Does anyone know the others? Ileanadu (talk) 21:09, 5 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]