Talk:Thompson (band)/Archive 2

Archive 1

Archive 2

Statements

Before someone starts removing that section be aware that the quotes are properly sourced by reliable mainstream newspapers (Jutarnji list, Globus, Večernji list, and Feral Tribune). Removing sourced info is vandalism. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 01:07, 20 April 2008 (UTC) Feral tribune is far-left tabloid and certainly not mainstream!Añtó| Àntó (talk) 13:43, 24 October 2009 (UTC)

Also mine are but the "democratic and antifascist" ones keep on erasing it. Marcellogo

The nonsense you just wrote has been removed. Be advised that you will be reported for vandalism should you continue. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 14:47, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Why is nonsense what i 've written? it is circumstantiated by references, articles, text of songs, also other articles of wikipedia,,, or may be YOU can decide what is a true source or not??? or you posses some sort of exclusive about thruth, so where is a song of thompson that talk about race or against democracy? Ljubo Jurcic is not the candidate of social democratic party for prime minister of Croatia? Clerical fascism is not an article of wikipedia? Why so there is a lot different sub sections in wiki about fascism, nazism, socialism, if they are all the same shit, we can also put the blame for Stalin's Gulag also to Racan, Milanovic or Gerhard Shroeder? Jumping from 50000 to 100000 person (and you can found a lot of proof of it) is not the result of an outrage reaction?

So in this case, you can context what i write, change it if you find something not correct, not erase it Completelyas it has it was not written.

I don't have erased nothing of the multiple unsourced statements present in that article... I've not insulted no one, saying someone is fascist , communist and like so,and if a made any change i put on a summary, the same instead was done several time on my writings and if you look on history section you can easily see it, so where is vandalism??????

I don't want to make fuss, I try always to make circumstantiated statements and you treat me like so?

Please understand that your edit is so politically charged it cannot stand. It is in violation of Wikipedia policy WP:NPOV. I suggest you leave ONLY the bare facts, no political nonsense and propaganda. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 17:39, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Ok, better, a little better, not so rude anyway... have you written it like so before it 'ld been much more better, agreed? ;)

Still, I don't not get that nonsense, if i say that he is (or better i say that after an examination his ideology it seems to be a Clerical fascist one and not a racial supremacist or a neo- pagan , and circumstantiate it with citations of his own songbook, it seems me not to be a violation of WP:NPOV or propaganda: hey, someone here still try to convince the word he is a angel send from above (or at the contrary that he is Hitler BIG brother). Where is Tilde on my keyboard, Arrrgh! Marcellogo

P.S:Found it. Marcellogo (talk) 20:34, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

The controversy is whether or not he is an Ustaše supporter. The Ustaše undoubtedly were racial supremacists, and "Hitler BIG brother"s. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 20:40, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Big brothers? Do you say that they are in command and Hitler obeyed them? and what is the problem with me saying Croatia is a country of less of five millions inabithants, it is a fact. , not a point of wiew. The Ustasha in 1941-45 definitively implement a racist politics and also an extermination one, agreed , so the fascist in Italy from 1938 to 1943, the first of the two and collaborated with Nazi german extermination one, but also United States democratic party, was a staunch supporter of the Jim Crow laws that lasted decades, we have to blame it to Barack Obama? Yes , it is a provocation, not take it too seriously. Seriously instead, being a supporter is one thing (involves the fact he is a member of same neo-ustascia organizationsor financing it, if you or anithing other have proof , publish it) being a simpathizer another, showing some exterior resemblance another again,i'm a right wing Italian, but it not means i adhere to everything fascist have done, only that i think to have it in my political heritage, and so i'm very interested to definite ideological differences between them and nazist or usthasha and also between fascism, neo fascism and the actual rightwing party which i today adhere. Marcellogo (talk) 22:31, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Its a controversy, and a well founded one. It does not mean its necessarily true, however. Look, the point I'm making is not to keep posting stuff about how "incredible" the turnout is, just post the turnout numbers (and the source). Be neutral in your wording. Do not simply state facts in a context that supports your opinion, just state them. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 22:57, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Both of you calm down! I'm not here to take sides (even though I do have an obvious preference). Your turning this talk page into a steaming argument like a forum rather than a beneficial discussion on the article! We all know the wording is bad on this article, even though most of the statements are facts. I have requested that it be copyedited because it is in a desperate need of a cleanup etc. A contacted user will be active on this page shortly as I have requested that he give it a thorough copyedit as there are numerous grammar and spelling mistakes. Furthermore, the quotes are too long to be just put into quotations. You need quote boxes! I have put some in now but it still needs work.

To contribute to this kind of argument, be careful in your wording (both of you again!). While many people may think or immediately conclude that Perkovic is a pro-nazi or pro-ustasa, they would be merely victims of more propaganda. Its all just a bunch of rubbish made up by Jewish organizations. None of his songs clearly state this, but instead just recall how the war was fought and Serbs got defeated. That should be obvious within the translated lyrics. Perkovic himself was in the war (I think this deserves to be mentioned as it makes the article so much easier to understand!) He's not just some random singer proclaiming defence against Serbs, he's an actual victim of the devastation of war. Thats where the songs "Bojna CAvoglave" comes from. Consider THESE facts! Domiy (talk) 23:29, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Calm down? I'm perfectly calm, and while I have no desire to start a general discussion on Perković, I must say the "Jewish conspiracy" rhetoric is kind of old. I would hardly say he's a victim with the amount of money he's earned. The war was probably the best thing that ever happened to him. If anything, he's a war profiteer capitalizing on people's sentimentality concerning the recent conflicts, while hiding his massive profits in a mask of "patriotism". In fact, you'll probably call me "unpatriotic" or something just for saying this.

Anyway, all I am saying is that we must state facts in an unbiased context. The reader must conclude that the turnout was "incredible", not be presented with that conclusion. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 23:44, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

hi Domiy, welcome, ok, let's conclude it at least from what i'm concerned: DIREKTOR; If you put this a question of style, ok, agreed, i'll will try to put it in a very neutral wording, obviously I expect that the same standard will be applied to EVERYONE around here, and also, please, if it will happen that you find something in my writings that seems you not well written,don't run deleting everything like crazy, rearrange it if is possible without erasing information or references, ask me to change it if is possible in a brief time or if it is not explain in a summary why you find it not accettable before modifing it. Let's call it Wikitiquette? and maybe is an old retoric, but SwC is an Jewish organization, (fact) and seems to me that in this case we can also talk about "olocaust profittering", only also in this case we need to find reliable sourcesMarcellogo (talk) 23:53, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Very well, I apologize if I was perceived as rood, that was not my intention. We can work this through, edit-away and I'm sure we'll be able to compromise. Though I imagine it is not so down under, its getting pretty late in Split so we may have to conclude this tomorrow.

Concerning Perković, I'm not the one to idealize the Jewish people, but I hardly think they're making vast profits from denouncing him. And even if they were, by some chance, does it make him less of a profiteer? Furthermore I did not deny that the SWC is a Jewish organization, I merely meant that I do not see the motive for an "evil conspiracy" to condemn Perković (except maybe World Domination ;). Maybe they're just doing their job? --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 00:05, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

Oh no no no, I'm not going to call you unpatriotic for what you just said. Of course not. I'm going to call you a lunatic, in the kindest of manners I guess. In simple words, what the hell are you on about? I hope you do realize that what you say on the talk page can really effect how legitimate contributions are interpreted. From what you just said, it seems that your clearly a anti-Perkovic in a very extreme manner. While you may be good at hiding it, I dont trust your strength of it completely. I will say right now that Thompson earned profits because of his music. Just like all the other Croatian singers have earned profit because of their music. You may not know of other bands or artists, but there are other extremely popular ones in Croatia who have earned huge profits singing nothing to do with the war. While Perkovic may have benefited from the fact that his songs proclaim what 90% of Croatia supports, its not something that he deliberately took advantage of. Like any artist, he sings about his pride and views. Its not his fault that the majority of the nation agrees with him. And its not the reason he has earned profits either. Just to let you know, he does have numerous other songs with nothing to do about the war. And in fact, these others are becoming more and more popular. He focuses around mainly God and love for Croatia in other songs which have earned much recognition. His war songs were only created and performed during and shortly after the war. Right now he is still banned from performing them in most places, meaning he has to rely on his other songs to deliver a concert. And thats exactly what he has done, and he's still earned huge profits! And as unbiased as I'm trying to sound here, these are all facts (forget Wikipedia references right now. I'm not going to include this in the article but I'm just telling you this as true facts that most Croatians will be able to tell you). His concerts in Cavoglave are freely organised. Again, anyone can tell you that. He spends his own money to set up such a festival just so he can sing to his fans. I doubt he's anything near the benefiting rich man that your making him out to be. Anyone who thinks that the war has benefited any person has quite clearly never even seen a live weapon, or further more the destruction it causes it a country!

And about the Jewish organisations, I dont think there really in for a profit either. Its clear that they simply just have ill feelings towards him and Croatia's views. Everytime he has a concert, they have to go further and further to protest against it. Seriously, get over it. Its clear they have ill feelings. Domiy (talk) 00:10, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

Predictable. I'm a traitor to my country and a lunatic, the Jews have it in for Croatia and are trying to control the world, ok. 90% of Croatia supports Perković? LOL Do you have a poll, or is that just you and your buddies all comfy-wumfy far far away? According to actual polls, the most popular person in Croatia is its president, Stipe Mesić, a very strong opponent of Perković and the like as you probably know, while the second strongest political party in Croatia (7 seats behind the strongest) is even more opposed to him. I've noticed quite often that right-aligned users from the "diaspora", particularly Australia, assume Croatia is a right-wing hotbed, I assure you, that is far, faar from the facts.

Look: you are pro-Perković, I am anti-Perković (I DO NOT "hide" it at all), and we are both entitled to our beliefs and that's fine (or is that too "left-wing" an idea for you?). If we simply use reliable sources and follow Wiki policy, this diversity in ideas will end up benefiting the article and will keep it balanced. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 00:26, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

Oh, it is an interesting discussion , but please let do it ni a talk page of someone of us, Domiy was correct about this part of the deal. Fact is this I reply. how it comes, Direktor you are so strict about my statements and not of others? it can been easily interpreted as a fact of partiality or personal antiphaty, or maybe that you find my statements particolarly dangerous... maybe is that, Domiy, or maybe that declaring oneself "democratic or antifascist" allows someone to vandalize, undo,and otherwise spoil referenced contribution from others. Marcellogo (talk) 00:35, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

I do not intend to redo the whole article, it's a HUGE piece of work. The article was already thoroughly ruined by guys who just watch the news, get angry about the public outrage against Perković among urban communities and just get the idea to make a few wild edits to express their "patriotic feelings" (in bad English and with little understanding of the Manual of style). All I'm trying to do is reduce the damage. If I'm strict with you, you be strict with me. That's the best way to improve an article: follow the rules strictly.

Oh yes, and Croatia does indeed have many other successful singers and bands, I, of course, do not question the "legitimacy" of their profit. A few make songs about the war, the vast majority do not. But noone made as much money off singing about the war than Perković, noone is even close. The undeniable fact is, he makes money by capitalizing on people's feelings about the war. That is disturbingly close to making money off the suffering of the people. Think about it, Domily. It is legal, but is it admirable that someone degrades the memory and legacy of the war effort by using it to amass a small fortune? --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 00:41, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

Good to see you know how it works in Australia as you said. Let me tell you that I also know how it works in Croatia. I'm no stranger to it. I didnt say Croatia was a right movement hotbed either. I just mentioned that there are a lot of people who are pro-patriotism and what not. Just because you support Croatia very deeply, it doesnt mean your a nazi or ustasa. A lot of people still judge the country on the war, but there's absolutely nothing wrong with defence of a nation (just like Perkovic sometimes mentions). I dont know where this poll of most popular person in Croatia comes from, but I would doubt that the majority of Croatians support Mesic. He's hardly even Croatian from his family origin etc, and he's yet to impress a lot of people by actually showing care for Croatian pride. Of course, some people do support him. Some people also support the devil. Everybody has followers. But are you excluding all the people that represent Croatia at lets say (for a good example, soccer matches?). By the way they act, I wouldnt say that our national football team supports Mesic. And need I even begin on our fans? The crazy 'hooligans' who light up flares in every match and turn out singing songs all night. Furthermore, where are all the people who supported Tudjman? He's well the complete opposite of Mesic. So where are all these people? No doubt the majority of this "poll" came from Zagreb. And its understandable that the capital city is like this. Its similar in every country. Let me tell you, the real people who represent Croatia are the basic patriotic people who love the nation, not the careless president who's in there for a completely different reason. And you call Perkovic a bad profiteer. Wow.

I understand where you are coming from. Even though its legal to have songs like his, there may be an 'ethical' side to it. Is it right to sing such songs? Let me tell you, people are not easily brainwashed. Thompson earns money because he has good songs. He may have reached slight boost in his popularity due to early war songs, but he has maintained his popularity (and even grown in it) with his other songs about Love, Peace, Unity, God etc. Thats what a lot of people respect him for. He was in the war himself, nobody who has truly been through such an ordeal would have the nerve to sing about it solely to earn a profit. He sings about it because he cares. Because he wants to express himself. And most of all, because its his job to make songs! I'm dead sure that the majority of Croatians are NOT hypnotized in his evilness of making a profit by reminding them of the war. People pay to see him because he has great songs. People respect him because of his love for his country. And yes, again, it has a lot to do with the war. But as I said before, he didnt make the songs solely to trick people into profit. Some of his war songs were not even songs before he became a singer. Bojna Cavoglave was a tune he and his friends used to sing during the war. He only turned it into a song when he became a full singer to express himself. And again please note that he is banned from performing such songs at his concerts in most places (even Croatia!). So he has to sing all his other 'innocent' songs to deliver a concert. Yet people still pay time and time again to see and hear him. And again, a point you seem to have missed out, he holds concerts for free entry in many cases. His massive turnout at the independence day concert in Cavoglave is noted every year. 50-60 thousand people show up to see him. And at the festival, he organizes a stage and other facilities to be set up on his own property so people can come and enjoy. Ohhh yes, thats clear evidence that he's capitalizing on peoples feelings of the war merely to make a profit which he keeps to himself. Domiy (talk) 03:41, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

Concerning Mesić, this is not just one poll I am talking about, there were many. Every so often the news publish the results of the various agencies that researched this phenomenon. These polls do not, repeat, do not center on the capital. They are highly professional and reliable, and in each one, Mesić was voted the most popular. Need I also mention the ultimate poll of all? the presidential elections? two of them in fact, both of which he won as an independent candidate and did not rely on the support of any party. Furthermore, I find the idea that football hooligans represent the Croatian people highly offensive, as opposed to, for example, university students. I also do not know where you get the idea that the entire Croatian national football team is extreme right-wing, that is not the case.

I imagine you must have come into contact only with certain circles of Croatian society. Perković generally draws his support from the rather rural parts of Croatia, and from people that hail from such war-stricken and... undeveloped areas. Modern, pro-western central urban areas, far from supporting the Great Patriot Perković, are the source of the many recent protests against him. I've not known him on a personal level for years so I cannot say whether or not he really cares about the Croatian people. I do know that professing eternal love for the "holy soil of Croatia" is absolutely essential for his cash flow, though. Quite frankly, I do not care about whether he really "loves Croatia", all I know is that he is the public focal point of a backward nationalist mentality that has claimed far too many victims and destroyed far too many economies around here. I dare say it is a little too easy to support such a mentality from a distance where its primitivistic repercussions cannot be felt. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 11:45, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

Stop, the both of you and Myself also, back to work this is a discussion about an article, the personal one discussion however interesting, and well argumented,compliment to everyone of us for reverting back to a more civilised form of expression, can continue on the personal talk page of anyone of us. Now, DIrektor you say you don't want to redo the whole article because it's Huge ,ok , let's do like in the small rural village of Osijek, let's try to work togheter ;), look , I am writing the italian version of tht one , so I will translate some part here, ask your opinion that of Domiy and of all the other person, present in that bosrd, both shitty seliackini , fucking fascist, freckled flag.burning liberals, and how you call they, traitors of their own country and lunatic at least ( thats for me, every opinion count the same, i'm not an urban supremacist, :p) and after that try publish it:

Marko Perković Thompson born in(Ĉavoglave, 27 oct 1966) is a croatian singer and auctor, solo voice and leader of the group Thompson Extremely popular in his own country, it is also know in there as a former fighter in War for the homeland, for organizing and partecipate in several humanitarian initiatives, but on the other hand also as an active militants (althought without any precise political affiliation), that has often lead him and his group into heated controversy about his allegedly sympaty for the former Ustascia movement, controversy that ultimely seems to get also international relevance.

Ok, this a rought translation of intro, i'll have to turn it in a form that follow the different ertry of article: maybe , by far the most prominent member of the group is...

Gentlemen, madames, it seems you a good intro respectful of the infamed WP:NPOV? 81.208.91.239 (talk) 19:52, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

First of all, let me say that I really meant no offense towards anyone with my above comment. Secondly, I did not mean that the whole article needs to be rewritten, just certain sections. Finally, the above version is of lesser quality and less neutral than the current intro ("Extremely popular"? hardly NPOV). I doubt the solution to this matter is a simple translation from another Wiki. Like I said, it really is a lot of work, which explains why nobody wants to do it. (P.S. When I say "a lot of work", I mean a lot of discussion with various sides of the argument, grammar improvement (not deterioration), and a lot of work to integrate existing info into the new version.) --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 21:49, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

Concerning the article, I repeat that I have contacted a few outside authors t copyedit it. The lead really does need a lot of work and hopefully this will be fixed up ASAP.

And about Mesic, its common for the president to be amongst the most well known people in a country. I dont doubt his ability, it seems like he's doing a lot for Croatia in terms of rising in economy and entering the EU. But overall, he is disliked in most passionate parts of Croatia for his lack of passion himself. He's too 'big city'. It seems that he doesnt think much of other 'lower people' as well. When you compare him to that of Tudjman, he's almost nothing. Again, with the greatest respect to him and his contribution. I would probably vote for him as well because he's already an established president with the eligible qualities. As popular as they may be, not many people would vote for Gotovina or Perkovic as president for obvious quality reasons. Oh and about football hooligans, let me ask you something. What do university students have as opposed to passionate supporters when it comes to showing your colours of a country? Nothing. Yet we have our supporters traveling across the world just to support our national team (in whatever sport). They are true Croatians. Those who took the challenge and risked their life to defend Croatia are true heroes of Croatia. As much as I'm a fan of the Croatian team, I didnt say they are all right wing either. I just said that clearly by the way they act and represent Croatia in such a passionate matter, it is clear that if they are in support of anything, it would be the right wing style rather than the 'protesting' style of others like you say. Just as well obvious as they sing Perkovic's songs after they win a game. I think that counts as something. Basically what I'm saying is that the larger people who are against Perkovic seem to be against him because he is extremely 'pro-Croatia'. There's absolutely NOTHING wrong with supporting your country. Its pretty clear that he loves Croatia and his people, but if you cant see that then you are free to keep living based on crazy conspiracies that he is brainwashing people into earning a profit. Also note that Perkovic is not in support of Croatia and 'right wing' etc because of the 'sick' acts they committed. Every country has a bad history of war criminals, it keeps going. But has the fact that those 'sick people' defended Croatia and gave their life for freedon every occured to you or any of these other 'anti's'? As much as he may be neglected by some people, Perkovic and people like Gotovina are the very reason that those people are able to step outside and live in a free country rather than a Serbian controled Yugoslavia. Domiy (talk) 00:35, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

Anyone with any deeper knowledge of the history of the Yugoslav Wars attributes the success of Operation Storm to the massive strategic and logistical support it received from NATO, i.e. the USA. Not to any particular courageous acts of the ground infantry. That's the cold hard facts. As for the start of the war, I do not see how volunteering along with thousands of others gives Perković the right to exploit that fact. He's not exactly a "war hero". During Tuđman's reign as de facto dictator of an oligarchy, Croatia's relatively enviable pre-war economy, already weakened by the separation from its markets in Serbia, was ruined by criminal activity widely thought to be endorsed by the government. Mesić "does less" than Tuđman because Croatia no longer has a presidential system, but a parliamentary system. Mesić is incapable of "doing more", as presidential powers were drastically reduced. Gotovina is a poor incompetent Foreign Legion sergeant that's been singled out as a "fault guy" to make sure the USA is not seen as supporting anything even resembling ethnic cleansing (Storm). I personally feel sorry for the guy, he's a victim of international politics.

As for Perković, love for one's country is completely irrelevant if one wants to take it down a path of nationalistic primitivism and economic isolation. If we get a PM who absolutely hates Croatia but makes it more prosperous than it was 18 years ago (for some reason), I'd vote for him without a second thought. Hitler must have really loved Germany, for example.

There is nothing wrong with supporting your country? Of course not, but that's a play on words. People are not attacking Perković because he's "pro-Croatia" and they are "anti-Croatia", we are ALL pro-Croatia. Some simply have the willpower and the mentality to look beyond the primitive nationalistic sentiments (that are so easy to exploit), to what their country really needs: integration, tolerance, and a mentality centered on the future. None of these values are supported by Perković and the youth that "follow" him. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 01:21, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

Direktor, now I am REALLY convinced you are writing from another, parallel dimention, Marko Perkovic Thompson is not popular in Croatia!!!! A men that put a cd on sale in december, and reach position two ? That take his support from small villages like Trgbanajelacica or PuniMaksimir? Sooorry, but, in your dimension what is the capital of Croatia? Briuni? So, no particular corageous act of ground infantry, like in Vukovar, maybe? So YOU really have nostalgy of Jugoslavia? Then go dress back like a pionieer and go singing for the birthday of the dear leader Tito (obviously , with a zastava and using the dear roads of the good old time, and not the 1200km of new motorways built in these dark times of primitivism and economic isolation), but don't come making lecture to others. And please above all don't bother us with the story of integration and tolerance, when all of your writings show only supremacism , disgust of your own contry and blindness of any reason that can put in danger your so well endowned sense of moral superiority: You have not given any concrete contribution to this article , you have only found every way to insult memory of persons better than you will ever be, twart fact, erase and censure contribution from others. Look back at what have you written and die of shame, for GOD' sake, men. And you dare you call yourself a democrat , a man that care for Croatia future? So begin to respect your countrymen, that have fought for givin' you the freedom you so largely abuse of. Good you wrote it anyway so everyone around there will appreciate the real amount of your tolerance , respect of others and democratic behaviour.81.208.91.239 (talk) 02:42, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

All right, all right, lets get back to the article, I refuse even to comment on the utter nonsense above. You're putting words into my mouth all over the place, as everyone here I merely presented my, not-so-naive, view of the wider context of this matter. What I meant was that saying Thompson was "extremely popular" is not NPOV. State facts, do not draw conclusions for the reader. The problem here is I'm obviously dealing with fans logically trying to depict him in as best a light as possible. We need professionalism, not emotions. Have a look at The Doors article: they are nowhere described as a "popular" or "extremely popular" band as that is unencyclopedic wording. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 11:26, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

Direktor, i'm sorry that you see my intervention as an utter nonsense. I'm not talking about that thing of the "extremely popular" one, I was referring to the general tone you have used in the all whole discussion, you complained that i put words in your mouth all over the place, the same seems to me you have done with me (the stories of the jewish cospiration, as for an istance) and much, much more with the maybe naive, but always polite mister Domyi. Maybe i'm not so gentle as he his, but you have to pardon me: Althought I came from Italy, I'm perfectly urbanized and I have , not "any deeper knowledge" , but a degree in History (that allow me to professionallytell you that you are saying a lot of B...T about what is written about Oluja operations and the role of Ante Gotovina) , I have relatives that come from a small village that was razed by jugoslav troops and cetniks, I have been in the town of Dubrovnik( that seems to me a place that in fact of culture, past and present can easily overmathch all the urbanized places you talk about) immediately after the siege( and what I have seen in it, is something i'll NEVER forget! ) and have meet persons that was killed for defending the country and the people you so easily talk in so derogatory terms, and maybe because this i have grown a little too sensitive about some topics... Yes, this is Sarcasm,, like in the utter nonsense above, but after having tryed to use some irony before of it, after i have asked you and Domyi to transfer that pointless discussion on a talk page, maybe i can be pardoned ,if I had losed my temper, In every case, DIREKTOR, seriously, I think you have done a good work before we get involved in that i hope we all can agre to consider "an utter nonsense",only please, gave a retrospective look at what you have written in it and i'm sure that you can get from yourself what i tried to say you above . And see you also Domyi, thank you for coming! See you after the holidays.

P.s. I'm going back to the village i've talked you about, like every year after the war, now finally we had almost done with the recostruction works, and can finally host the man himself! WOW!

P.p.s There is not the entry Sarcasm, in english wiki, we need to fix it! After holidays. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.208.91.239 (talk) 18:12, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

NOONE is trying to deny the atrocities of the Serb rebels! How did this turn into a discussion about war atrocities!? However, while I do not have a degree in History, I did not for my opinions by sitting on a park bench and thinking. I read many books and explored all points of view in this matter, though I mostly kept to the non-Yugoslav (British, American,...) authors for neutrality. You have a degree in history? Assuming I believe you, would you be as noble as to accept that you are not 100% neutral and objective in these matters? ("and what I have seen in it, is something I'll NEVER forget!") Please remember that I am not trying to diminish the atrocities of the war, rather I'm pointing out that their memory is being exploited in modern Croatia for financial profit. Oh an as for the term "utter nonsense", I have no other words for things like this: "go dress back like a pionieer and go singing for the birthday of the dear leader Tito obviously , with a zastava and using the dear roads of the good old time, and not the 1200km of new motorways built in these dark times of primitivism and economic isolation" Obviously you do not know that the Zagreb-Split motorway was scheduled for completion by 1996 during Yugoslavia, and that it would have been completely free for public use. Now its too expensive for many people to use. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 11:23, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

Here's a quote from the Stjepan Mesić article about his popularity: "relaxed and charming, Mesić has many times been voted as the most popular politician in Croatia." Nacional: Stjepan Mesić i dalje najpopularniji političar, Vjesnik: Najpopularniji Mesić i HDZ, Vladi prosječno trojka, Vjesnik: HDZ najpopularnija stranka, Mesić najpozitivniji političar, [http://www.slobodnadalmacija.hr/20061106/novosti02.asp Slobodna Dalmacija: Dalmacija vjeruje HDZ-u i

Mesiću]

Direktor, you clearly have taken the wrong idea from some sources. First of all, consider their reliability. The larger portion of things you hear on the media (especially the Croatian reports!) are untrue or speculative stories. Notice the biased view sometimes? The fact that anyone would refere to Mesic as "charming" is a clear indication that they are working him up and portraying him as a popular person. Also, the quote says he is the most popular politician in Croatia. Thats what I bought up before, whether some people like it or not he's a good president but not good in the eyes of our country's views. Domiy (talk) 03:48, 30 August 2008 (UTC)

Direktor, stop it please, I have tried to explaine you the meaning of the world Irony and Sarcasm, and you still don't have get it already????

And why you keep on accusing persons about thing they have not written, who are accusing you to deny Serbian atrocities? I'm accusing you , or better i am hoping you turn on yourself with a little of criticism, about your own statements. How it comes you take this fancy of always talking of your own country and countrymen in such derogatory manner? I'm that come from abroad i'm very proud of what your people, your nation (all togheter) have done, the same every person i've taken with me in the last ten years, all togheter i repeat, not the countrymen or how you call them "perfectly urbanized people", so please don't discriminate, also because in that absurd discussion YOU are the one that is supposed to be the democratic, tolerant, open-minded one...

Reply to Domiy: These are just the sources mentioned on Wiki, there are many more submitted by the highly professional Puls poll agency. These are frequently on TV. On the other hand what you are offering is your own personal view, probably formed under the influence of nationalism. What I would like to see is a poll listing Thompson as the "most popular person in Croatia", a laughable thought. Or maybe a poll listing some other politician besides Mesić as "the most popular"? Do you realize that now you're claiming "propaganda"? I assure you the Croatian television is not so biased or unprofessional (in the recent decade at least). I've gotten the impression that you're a reasonable guy, I just hope you may perhaps reevaluate your ideas on what is best for Croatia. When I first began giving this some thought, I realized that the question I need to concern myself with is "How may my contry be as prosperous as it can be?" and not "What pleases my sense of national pride the most?".

Reply to IP User: You must think I "hate" my country or countrymen. I assure you, that is most certainly not the case(!) Quite the opposite, I do indeed love my country, but not so much that it clouds my reason or sense of objecitve logic. Call me crazy but for me, screaming at the top of one's voice about one's love of his country does not really prove anything. I am anything but "against Croats from the country". What I am against, however, is irrationality and primitivism. If critiscizing these plagues of our region is "intolerance", then I'm guilty as charged.

Also, thank you for "explaining words" to me. Considering my vocabulary appears to be somewhat wider than yours, I may perhaps return the favor. Though I'd hate to turn out "sarcastic"... --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 00:14, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

Ok, as we are there discussing about our own petty controversy, it seem the whole article has passed thought the much expected revision.May i say that it seems me a (very)good one? It is well written, (and on this, I agree with you ,Direktor, you definitively have, if not a vocabulary, a deeper knowledge of English language than me, sorry about that and believe me, i appreciate also a little sarcasm. Let's hope that maybe in the future you will also try to use some irony, expecially about yourself : take it easy men! It is still a wiki page not the world future at stake... "Plagues of our region", a little magniloquent expression, is'nt it?), finally achieving that (infamous) neutral point of wiew and, above all, it achieved these results by putting on MORE complete informations, not by erasing them (that was the ORIGINAL criticism i expessed to you, Direktor when, ages ago I started that Ill-fated discussion). Sorry (really) about that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Marcellogo (talk • contribs) 00:17, 3 September 2008 (UTC)

Domiy, you have done it!!!! I have had a look to the History section and it turned out that you have made it the most part! Thank you, from my part , I'm very pleased about it. And I'm sure also DIREKTOR is, in its own way: what he hoped for has happened. Maybe also this ill-fated discussion (and my precedent contribution, althought, not well written) , was worth a lot if they spurred you to act so excellently. Hvala ti Puno! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Marcellogo (talk • contribs) 00:57, 3 September 2008 (UTC)

Thinking of putting in something from 2008 Australian concert

Reading the article, I think it contains a far amount of Marko's actions and quotes which help get the point across to a reader. Therefore, to contribute to such, I was highly thinking of including something which happened to ME in his 2007/08 New Years concert in Sydney, Australia. This is my proposed contribution:

"At the 2007/08 New Years concert in Sydney, Australia, a young man expressed his respect for the band by running up on stage and praising Perkovic. As he was attemptedly ushered off stage by officials, he was pulled back by Perkovic and given a kiss of respect, taken literally by the fans as a promotion of Love and Care between Croatians during the war. He was thus highly praised by the large crowd for his actions."

Anyone can add/edit to it as they wish, I really just wanted to include it. It is a true story, it happened to me myself in January at the concert. Can I get some feedback/replies to this please? Thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Domiy (talk • contribs) 07:10, 29 April 2008 (UTC)

(Yep.) Personal experiences and anecdotes? On an encyclopaedia? You won't mind if I remove it, would you? (its not sourced, anyway) --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 08:24, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

Everyone who is trying water down thompson needs to stop=

From a guy that has met the guy numerous times, been to many concerts before half the people here (even the ones defending him)even heard of him, I think I might have a clue. "Za Dom - Spremni!" Does not trace back to Ban Jelacic or any other Croatian viceroy, or symphony etc. In the opera "U Boj u Boj" no where does it say Spremni. "Za Dom Za Dom" can be traced back to Jelacic and "Spremni" can be traced back to King Kresimir, however "Za Dom Spremni" is strictly an Ustasa creation. The reason I am saying this is to open up the eyes of the Croatian people which defend such idiocy as being misinterpreted, instead of arguing that our WW2 history is very misinterpreted (easy way out)- we try to cut corners. This does not help. Every Croatian who reads this, start defending NDH and stop defending tid-bits about Thompson. Thompson is a great performer, great guy - all of the above, but don't try to white wash him so that we can enjoy his concerts, because it is not doing us any good in the history department. I can show anyone here that more than half of thompsons songs have a direct message about Ustase which is completely blind to nonCroats, yugo-Croats, or Croats who don't know much about Croatian history such as the ones defending him here. AP1929 (talk) 06:31, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

You could be his brother, AntePavelić1929, and you would still need corroboration. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 07:22, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

Edits

Za dom spremni! Indeed the salute does date back to Ban Jelačić, but the fact remains that during WW2 (and later in SFR Yugoslavia) it's primary meaning would be as a fascist salute. This is unfortunate, but this is simply how things are. I am not denying the long heritage of the salute, but anyone who believes people will think of Ban Jelačić when they hear it, and not the NDH, is deceiving himself.

Račan. The actions of Ivica Račan were indeed instrumental to Croatia's independence, i.e. the collapse of the unified League of Communists of Yugoslavia, and, by extension, Yugoslavia itself. The Slovenian Party leadership would have been in a lot of trouble after their walkout without Račan's support. With his actions and as Croatia's "leader" during the first period of the dissolution, Račan certainly deserves the name "prominent leader in Croatia's push for independence". (I didn't add this, though, I just fixed the sentence structure)

Yugoslav wars. The Croatian war of independence is only one of what is known on Wikipedia as the "Yugoslav Wars". Propose a rename or something if you do not like the term. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 07:19, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

Out of context

I again urge the editors to remove this part ,'cause it's untrue.

" Their song Anica - Kninska Kraljica from 1993 includes the lyrics:

Zbog Anice i bokala vina, zapalit ću Krajinu do Knina Zapalit ću dva, tri srpska štaba, da ja nisam dolazio džaba Which roughly means:

Because of Anica and a jug of wine, I'll set fire to Krajina all the way up to Knin I'll set fire to two or three Serb headquarters, for my trip not to be in vain. This is seen by Serbs a blatant call for violence against Serb civilians."

First of all,there is no refference on that being any kind of call for violence against Serb civilians. Second look at the meaning of the text... He said Serb headquaters,so what does that has to do with civilians??? If the text stayes like that,then at the end of the paragraph it should also be mentioned that Serbs have the lowest IQ in Europe.An average of 89. Here is my refference that can confirm that and you can google it yourself.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=381057&in_page_id=1770&ico=Homepage&icl=TabModule&icc=Talking%20point&ct=5

--(GriffinSB) (talk) 11:45, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

Um, he said he would "burn the Krajina", so yes, it can be interpreted as a call for violence. Note: noone is saying it necessarily is, but merely that it is interpreted in such a way. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 00:50, 21 July 2008 (UTC)

He said I'll burn Krajina 'till Knin.He didn't call for violence. Let's say an American soldier singing about him burning nazi Germany to Berlin and burn nazi headquaters.Is that a call for violence against civilians?!?! I said i'll include the IQ refference next to it.--(GriffinSB) (talk) 13:20, 3 September 2008 (UTC)

Firstly, forget "American soldiers", we're talking about something completely different. Second, the "burn Serb headquarters" verse obviously does not call for violence against civilians and is not the issue here. The issue is that calling on the burning of the Krajina is most certainly a call for violence, as it calls for the destruction, or incineration, of the entire (mostly) Serb populated area. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 14:32, 3 September 2008 (UTC)

Krajina was a genocidal separatist region with borders created by ethnic cleansing,murders,deportations,executions and other warcrimes.Non-Serbs were targeted,mostly Croats.Srpska Krajina never existed before and was illegal.It was never an entity,autonomus provice or whatsoever.It was a part of Croatia.So if he says he'll burn it till Knin,it has a different meaning then saying he'll burn some sovereign country.Second ,he said I'll burn Krajina,he didn't call anyone to aid thim with violenece. It would be the same is I would say I burn Republika Srpska in Bosnia.A entity that was made on genocide,murders,concentration camps etc.It's an opinion of one individual,not a call for violence.--(GriffinSB) (talk) 17:06, 3 September 2008 (UTC)

Thank you for your wonderful lesson in Croatian history, but I do not need your opinions to help me make sense of all the professional works I've read on the subject. Your first comment is racist, pure and simple. Hatred towards Serbs hidden behind a very transparent mask. I do indeed know the details of the murderous "Krajina" regime, perhaps even better than you. According to your strange logic, the civilians to be killed in the burning of the "Krajina" are not equal to the civilians from the rest of Croatia, and burning the "Krajina" may be justified because its not a sovereign state? Are you joking? I hope you are...

As for your second "point", it is even more nonsensical than the first. You are discussing the case of his sentence. You are claiming that if the text does not explicitly state "I call on all of you here go and burn the Krajina, at some point in the near future" that it cannot be interpreted as a call for violence. Very few songs, many of the Chetnik ones, would not meet your standards as a "call to violence". (Example: If someone sings about a certain kilometer-long pit that "awaits" Croats, he does not really call for them to be actually murdered does he?) --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 19:02, 3 September 2008 (UTC)

I don't hate anyone.It's just that i get pissed off by nationalist Serbs who take words and facts out of context for political pourposes.Burning of Krajina can have several meanings.But in Krajina Croatian villages have already been burnt by then.500.000 Croats were on the run and around 10.000 killed.So you can't blame the victim of wanting to burn a criminal regime or a criminal entity.It's illogical.The only people who would get offended by the burning of Krajina would be Krajina symphatizers,right?Isn't that kind of fascist?Isn't that supporting a criminal regime responsible for numerous crimes and thousands of deaths?I don't need to see a fascist opinion expressed in an encyclopedia.That's my point and thats why i compared this situation with Nazi Germany and WW2. Second point is that nationalist Serbs somehow want to connect this phrase with some crimes that happened during the Operation Storm which happened 2 years AFTER the song/album realese.I don't know if Thompson can look in to the future,but i don't care 'cause i think Thompson is an idiot(for some other things he said) but I just want to make this article more accurate and balanced.--(GriffinSB) (talk) 09:15, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

What is illogical is claiming that "you can't blame the victim of wanting to burn a criminal regime or a criminal entity". What's that? Justifiable genocide? Or are you claiming that "burn the Krajina" is really a metaphore? "Zapalit ću Krajinu do Knina" does not seem to have much allegorical meaning. It actually means he's going to burn that part of "Krajina" that's between him and Knin. The actual territory: villages, people, towns... Whether those towns were part of "Krajina", Serbia, Yugoslavia or China is completely irrelevant. I also don't know why you're even mentioning Storm. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 17:12, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

Of course it's a metaphore.The distance between his hometown and Knin is about 30km,while the so-called Krajina was few hunderd km's long.I repeat the only people who would get offended by this phrase are Krajina symphatizers themselfs and I don't care about their opinion.I don't care if skinheads get offended 'cause someone wants to burn Nazi Germany to Berlin,or maybe just to Münich.--(GriffinSB) (talk) 18:40, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

You’re incorrect when you say that the only people that would get offended by this are "Krajina sympathizers", whatever that means. I am not and never will be a sympathizer of the regime in charge of the unlawfully constituted and unilaterally unrecognized self-proclaimed entity Krajina that was established within the sovereign, independent and internationally recognized state of Croatia. But I most certainly am a sympathizer of innocent civilians caught between battle lines of any war that has ever existed. In a more specific context, these civilians that I speak of include the hundreds of thousands of murdered and displaced innocent Croats, Bosniaks and Albanians by Serb forces as well as any innocent Serbian civilians living in the so-called Krajina that might have been living in fear (whether the fear was founded or unfounded is irrelevant, they still might have been living in fear) for their well-being at the hands of armed forces. None of these civilians deserve any retribution or reprisals for the misdeeds of their political or military leaders just as no German civilians in the southern Bavaria deserve to be afraid for their well-being for the fear of allied soldiers burning Nazi Germany to Münich. If, by your definition, that makes me a "Krajina sympathizer" or a "Nazi sympathizer" then so be it because I don’t care to put too much effort in explaining to you the fallacies of your definitions. But please try to avoid being so crass as to so boldly and assuredly state that Serbian civilians in Krajina are comparable to Nazi sympathizers if they take offense to lyrics that suggest burning an area of 30 km between Thompson and Knin, an area which might just happen to contain a small village in which they live. In other words, try to be serene enough to accept that others might take offense to something that you don’t and that taking offense to such a thing does not warrant those people to be labeled as "[insert belittling and offensive term] – sympathizers". By the way, Reductio ad Hitlerum arguments on which you keep insisting are not helping you get the validity of your point across - on the contrary. SWik78 (talk • contribs) 19:48, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

If he said I'll burn Lika,Dalmatia,Istria,Slavonia or any other existing region of Croatia or a existing region of any other counrty I would completly agree with both of you.But Krajina is not a region,but a name given to a region which consisted of parts of Lika,Dalmatia and Slavonia by a criminal regime notorious for it's warcrimes and prosecution of civilians on racial,religious and ethnic basis.If someone wants to burn Cambodia under Red Khmer rule,is that a call for violence against civilians?!?!?But most of all Thompson said I'll burn 2-3 Serb headquaters,so that about says it all.Reductio ad Hitlerum is usualy used by Serb nationalits (SRS sympathizers) to slander Croatian people in order to justify crimes Serb forces committed in the 90's.Let me make my self clear I'm not defending Thompson in any way.He an narrow-minded peasant who was probably rased as a sheperd.That's my personal opinion. Every sane person is a symphatizer of innocent people,but my point is he didn't say anything about civilians.--(GriffinSB) (talk) 21:13, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

You are saying that it is understandable for someone to burn, i.e. destroy, an area of Croatia just because a rogue rebel statelet had been formed there and is governed by a murderous regime. You are saying that atrocities committed by the Krajina rebels justify the destruction (a "call for the destruction") of the area the "SAO Krajina" encompassed, or at least that the call for the burning of that area are justified because of this. Are you aware that you are promoting the idea of justifiable genocide? I'm just glad you "don't hate anybody", I can only imagine what ideas we'd be getting if that were the case...

For future reference: the nature of the Krajina regime and its (numerous) atrocities are completely irrelevant to this discussion. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 21:50, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

I an NOT justifying retaliation or justifiable genocide as you call it.I'm not talking about civilians,army or anything that comes down to people/persons/individuals.I said that he metaphoricly ment he'll burn Krajina to Knin(Knin meaning the center of that which he presumes is evil).He thinks of Krajina as a thing and not a region/entity/country in which people live.--(GriffinSB) (talk) 22:50, 4 September 2008 (UTC) He speaks of Krajina as some thing,not about people who lived in it.

The area encompassed by the Krajina was/is inhabited. "Burning" an inhabited area quite clearly and obviously suggests the use of violence against civilians that inhabit it. Furthermore, the civilians that inhabited that area were Serbs, a people Perković considers his quote: "eternal sworn enemies". All this leaves little room for speculation as to the meaning of the verse. The sentence is hardly "metaphorical": "Burn the Krajina" cannot be said to have any real hidden meaning. I get the feeling you are grasping for straws here.

The Krajina indeed was a "thing", so he was right in considering it such. Any "region/entity/country" is also a "thing", so I'm afraid I do not understand your point. I also do not pretend to read minds. I do not know how Perković thinks (if at all ;), and I don't think I'm about to take your word for it.

Finally: you stated that "Perković does not think of Krajina as a region/entity/country". The only conceivable (yet far-fetched) way this verse does not "call on violence", is if he actually DID think of it as an "entity" and not a populated area. Even so, you'd need a good source confirming this highly improbable interpretation, an interpretation you just denied yourself. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 00:02, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

Leaving all other arguments behind, can you in all honesty and utmost sincerity say that there are absolutely no people out there who see this verse as offensive? Other than various "sympathizers" and "nationalists" as you call them, do you really and truly believe that no innocent people see this verse as a call to violence against Serbs? None??? SWik78 (talk • contribs) 01:39, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

Off course the people who would find burning of Srpska Krajina offensive are sympathizers of Srpska Krajina.Srpska Krajina never existed troughout history nor is it a regional term of any kind.Krajina(military fronteer) existed but it consisted of parts of Croatia,Bosnia and Serbia but it was never Serbian.Let's say someone in Myanmar who suffered under junta is fighting against the criminal regime there and doesn't recognize the name Myanmar,but calles it Burma by it's old name before the dictatorial junta.If he said I'll burn Myanmar he means he'll crush the regime there and not it's civlilians.Civilians have nothing to do with it if someone wants to destroy an artificial and criminal entity made by a dictatorial regime.I think that because of the lack of arguments some Serb nationaists just enjoy taking things out of context to serve a certain aganda.--(GriffinSB) (talk) 15:47, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

Yes or no: Is it possible for people who are not sympathizers of an evil regime to be offended by those lyrics. Just yes or no, please. SWik78 (talk • contribs) 16:01, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

No. And the text says it is seen by Serbs a a call for violence against civilians.Serbs were not the only inhabitants there.There were also a lot of Croats living there before they were moved by force or fled the area.In some parts of Srpska Krajina Croats were in majority before the war.So by that logic Thompson also means that he'll burn Croatian civilians???WFT? The point is that he explicitly said Serb headquaters right after that and as far as I know,people don't live in headquaters.--(GriffinSB) (talk) 16:15, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

Well, let's end this fruitless agrument at this: we cannot convince you that your views are tragically skewed by your blind hatred of all things Serbian and you can't possibly convince the general readership base of this encyclopedia that Thompson's lyrics are impossible to interpret as calling on violence against Serbs. We're at an impasse, I suggest you go grind one of the other many axes you like grinding so much. SWik78 (talk • contribs) 17:02, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

In a lack of an argument it's always easy to accuse someone of hating...--(GriffinSB) (talk) 10:16, 6 September 2008 (UTC)

Um, no, no it isn't. --DIREKTOR ^(TALK) 11:41, 6 September 2008 (UTC)

I have to eliminate some vandalism...

Saying that Bojna cavoglave call for etnic cleansing of serbs is not a vandalism , is an Utter LIE!

So let's publish the exact text ,the Icty indictments against krajna para-state leader Milan Martic and the true significance of the word Chetnicks as a retaliation .

But.. there is another inexact statements, M.P. Th. don't call the Croatian army, he calls the Serbian volunteers themselves and tell to THEM that the God's Justice will reach them also in Serbia (OOh, this is A direct citation of Serbian ANTHEM :D!!!!) [[1]] —Preceding unsigned comment added by Marcellogo (talk • contribs) 19:58, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Have to agree with this, and I vouch for it. THere is no such mention of ethnic cleansing in Bojna Cavoglave. It is merely a song expressing his love and protection of his homeland, and what he is saying is that he will take action if and when the Serbs did try to take over. That in no way provokes a call for ethnic cleansing at all! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Domiy (talk • contribs) 23:03, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

It seems that declarying oneself "democratic and anfifascist" allows someone to vandalize, undo,and otherwise spoil referenced contribution from others, like miss Rjecina keep on doing...like on my last 6/08/08 contribution. Ok so i'll put more reference, and modify from antifascist to neo-comunist as their feats has clearly showed who they really are... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Marcellogo (talk • contribs) 11:36, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

NDH

The article mentions "NDH" twice, without bothering to explain what it means. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.77.6.1 (talk) 08:26, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

ROCK BAND??? ROCK?? WTF?! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.139.40.180 (talk) 13:53, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

Thompson is rock band. On new album "Bilo jednom u Hrvatskoj" there is few heavy metal songs (Kletva Kralja Zvonimira, Neka niko ne dira u moj mali dio svemira") Other songs are rock, Christian rock, hard rock or heavy metal and some folk rock —Preceding unsigned comment added by Flota bez Pilota (talk • contribs) 12:48, 1 September 2008 (UTC) NDH means Nezavisna Država Hrvatska. —Preceding unsigned comment added by The Great Duck (talk • contribs) 08:32, 7 September 2008 (UTC)

LOL how can Serbs and Croats be "sworn enemies" when historically there have been over 2 million mixed marriages there? There must have been alot of loving there. Thompson je kompletni kreten i trebamo da se smatramo kao braca kad i jesmo! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.70.128.176 (talk) 07:49, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

If we and the Serbs are brothers,why did they then oppress us in various ways since 1918,and have claimed Croatian lands to be their?The Great Duck (talk) 18:37, 23 January 2009 (UTC)