Talk:The Sound of Silence (Grey's Anatomy)/GA1

GA Review

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Reviewer: Aoba47 (talk · contribs) 02:52, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Hello, I am Aoba47. As a huge fan of the show, I would love to review this article. (I know you just put this up for review, but I really wanted to see the work put into this page). I will have my comments up as soon as possible. Aoba47 (talk) 02:52, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Infobox

While it is not absolutely necessary, I would include the “feature music” as done for this article Going,_Going,_Gone_(Grey's_Anatomy). I am referring this article as it is a highly ranked article on one of the show’s episodes. This is just a suggestion and not a requirement since the show is so known for its music. (The episode features two songs: “My Girl” by The Temptations (sung by James Pickens Jr.) and “I Surrender” by Aron Wright”) It would not need citation since it is in the infobox.

For the caption of the photo, use Richard and Meredith’s full names and cut the actors’ names as you link them twice in the actual text (It’s best to avoid overlinking).

Done Both fixed NumerounovedantTalk 12:24, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Perfect! Aoba47 (talk) 15:13, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Lead

Just a brief note for the entire article, the period at the end of a sentence (or comma) only goes inside the quote mark if you're quoting an entire sentence. Make sure to correct that where necessary.
I would include a brief description of the show as a whole somewhere in the lead for any reader that stumbles across the page. I would suggest using this one (Grey's Anatomy centers around a group of physicians struggling to balance their professional lives with their personal lives.) from the article for Going,_Going,_Gone_(Grey's_Anatomy). I would put it directly before the discussion of the episode as the introduction for the second paragraph.
Premier should be premiere
Comma after release
Change “major aspects” to simply “television critics praising Washington’s directing, Ellen Pompeo’s performance, and Stacy McKee’s writing" to keep it more concise and more objective. You mention McKee’s writing as being phrased later in the article so I included it in the lead as well.
Reword the first sentence of the second paragraph. I would remove the comma after patient and remove the mention of Penelope Blake. The original wording is somewhat ambiguous as it can be read that the injuries were somehow caused by Penny finding Meredith, which is obviously wrong. Also, the mention of Penny just doesn't seem relevant.
I would replace “other arcs” with “further storylines” just as it sounds more formal to me, but this is just a suggestion and not a requirement.
Remove “the” before Jackson Avery

Done All fixed NumerounovedantTalk 12:31, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Awesome, great work. It looks really good! Aoba47 (talk) 15:13, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Plot

Specify what class Meredith is teaching (anatomy).
The first sentence reads somewhat awkwardly; I think a better transition between the class and scar would help.
Say “they are” instead of “they’re” as all language should be formal even in the plot
Revise the following sentence as it reads awkwardly (“The episode jumps back to Meredith, Maggie, and Alex as they're carpooling to work, stuck in a traffic jam that turns out to be the result of a terrible accident.”) “Terrible accident” sounds vague and sensational so clarify the meaning.
Clarify “the injured” are those injured from the “terrible accident”.
Specify that the reason why Amelia choose to assist Owen over Meredith as it matters to the story.
Replace “who’s” with “who is”
I would consolidate the last two sentences of the first paragraph as there is some empty language. Phrases like “seems perfectly harmful” seem unnecessary and can be cut. I would change it to “Meanwhile, Meredith is left alone with the patient. The patient becomes violent as the result of post-seizure hyperaggression and assaults Meredith, leaving her battered and barely conscious on the floor.” Link the post-seizure hyperagression part to postical state. It is better to replace vague language with more concise and concrete information.
Remove “in the face of her injuries”. Sounds way too melodramatic.
Correct the mistake with Alex Karev. I am assuming you meant to put the actor’s name.
I would cut the “can sense the seriousness of her situation” as it sounds somewhat melodramatic and instead say "realizes she is unable to speak". Again avoid contractions. I will not make a note about the other contractions, but this applies to the entire article.
Restructure the last sentence of the second paragraph. Great content, but awkward phrasing. Could be separated into two sentences to improve it.
Remove comma after recovery.
Change the second sentence to “Alex realizes Meredith’s hearing has returned after she laughs at one of his jokes”. Your phrasing seems a little too wordy for my liking.
Is there a reason why you do not use the patient’s name (Lou)? It seems awkward to keep referring to him as “the patient who attacked her”
Change “he’s” to “he has”
Change “so he can apologize” to “to apologize” to be more concise.
I would use “prepare” instead of “prep” to use more appropriate language (more formal).
I would break apart the sentence involving the children’s visit in two to make it more clean and concise. Right now, it reads somewhat awkwardly. You use the space to bring up that the children were scared by the wires in Meredith’s mouth specifically and how Arizona preps Meredith. Your phrasing is somewhat vague. Be concise, but informative.
Last sentence reads awkwardly especially with the following lacking a transition to connect the two ideas (removing the wires holding her jaw shut overstepping Jackson to help Meredith.). I would separate it into two sentences. Put a period after jaw and then say “Jackson reprimands Penny for overstepping her authority to help Meredith”.

You're suggestion doesn't seem to fit as it nearly "antagonises Jackson"?

That's why I am merely providing suggestions. The first sentence was poorly constructed and needed to be revised and I was simply drawing attention to that fact. Your wording now is much better (than the original and my own version) Aoba47 (talk) 15:13, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Change “comes to visit” to just “visits”. The original phrasing is unnecessarily wordy.
I would phrase the first two sentences as follows to make it stronger: “Amelia visits Meredith to apologize for her prior behavior and discuss her sobriety. Amelia confides in Meredith that she is scared to lose her, but Meredith responds that she is not ready to forgive her.” The original phrase “leaves with things still unresolved” is vague and again a little too melodramatic for my liking.
Remove the dash. I understand what you were intending with it, but remove it.
”Bailey escorts her to meet him” seems like an unnecessary detail and should be cut.
Put a space between Meredith and still.
The phrase “is finally healed” sounds awkward and should be revised. I would change the sentence to “After Meredith finally heals from her injuries and is discharged from the hospital, Alex helps her get settled back at home” I tried to preserve your original phrasing as much as possible.
Replace “for being there for her” with “for his support” and add a transition like so “but points out that” to make the sentence flow better.
Use Jo’s full name (Dr. Jo Wilson)

Doesn't using "Dr." make it awkward?

That's part of her full name like Dr. Meredith Grey and Dr. Amelia Shepherd. You have to stay consistent with naming for everyone and identify her as a doctor.

Restructure the final sentence as it reads very awkwardly.

Going to need some help here

Looks great now, so it should no longer be an issue. Aoba47 (talk) 15:13, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Done Fixed most of the queires. NumerounovedantTalk 13:01, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I have answered all of your queries above. Aoba47 (talk) 15:13, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Done NumerounovedantTalk 18:15, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Production

Add an alt for the image and make upright\

Is it vital for the article?

Upright is not vital, but the alt is. Aoba47 (talk) 15:22, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I would use a similar start to this section as Going,_Going,_Gone_(Grey's_Anatomy) to have a better transition into this section.
Change “first go” to “first time”
The sentence “It was reported that long-time Grey’s writer/producer Stacy McKee will write the episode.” should be removed and McKee should be credited as the writer for the episode. Saying she was reported to be the writer is somewhat odd
Change writer/producer to writer and producer and say Grey’s Anatomy. Do not shorten it for any reason.
Comma after episode
Revise the sentence about the leaked video to why it is relevant. It should focus on it being proof of Washington’s involvement with the show and Meredith’s injuries. Be clear on why this matters.
Who is announcing the return date? Again, be specific.
Change the second sentence of the second paragraph to “Lesley Goldberg of The Hollywood Reporter confirmed Giacomo Gianniotti’s promotion to series regular over the winter hiatus." The date doesn't matter.
Not sure why the sentence about the character becoming a love interest for Maggie matter as it does not start with this episode. I would say remove it as it is not connected to the topic.
Spell out what TGIT stands for.

Removed

Change “lead in” to “lead-in”

Removed

Restructure the sentence about the preview as it does not make grammatically sense and reads very awkwardly. I am thinking this sentence and the sentence following it can be combined as it is pretty much repeated the same information.
Restructure the following sentence (The viewers got a glimpse at the scene in the sneak-peek clip from the episode, but it wasn't disclosed why the patient went after the Grey Sloan surgeon) as it reads awkwardly and the final part about the patient is unnecessary.
When citing any article, say the writer. The newspaper/source is not the one talking, the writer is the one talking. Do this for the entire article (The Daily Beast, etc.)
I would integrate the quote from The Daily Beast in a better sentence as it is just floating there without any real context. When revising the two sentences preceding it, think of it all fits together under the paragraph’s focus for the show’s hype for the episode.
Remove “she told EW” as it is repetitive.
Better integrate Pompeo’s quote. Again, the quote is just kind of floating there without any real context. I am always against just putting a straight quote in there instead of integrating into a couple sentences.
For the final sentence, change it to (In an interview with Entertainment Weekly, executive producer Shonda Rhimes called the episode “extraordinary and very, very powerful,” noting the hour “puts us on a path for the beginning of the second half of the season when it comes to Meredith’s evolution.")

Done NumerounovedantTalk 13:25, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Great job! The only suggestion I would make is to put a coma between "episode" and "a patient". Otherwise, everything in there looks great. Aoba47 (talk) 15:22, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Done NumerounovedantTalk 18:13, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Reception

Add an alt for the image and make upright
The phrasing “her due for an Emmy Award” is somewhat awkward. I would phrase it as Critics highlight Ellen Pompeo’s performance in the episode as worthy of an Emmy Award”

The idea is to highlight her repeated failure to get the nomination. Rephrase?

I see your point. I just thought "her due" sounded a little awkward, but it is fine as it currently stands since it does connect to the point you identify. Aoba47 (talk) 15:22, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Change “Reviews” to “Critical reviews” or “Critical reception”

Necessary?

I would believe so. "Critical reviews” or “Critical reception” implies the information is coming from credible critics, but if you would prefer to keep it to just reviews that is also okay. This is more of a suggestion (I should have phrased it as such so I apologize for that) Aoba47 (talk) 15:22, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Link Ellen Pompeo only in the lead and first time you use her in the body. Do not link her every time you refer to her.

As done WP:FA, Give Peace a Chance (Grey's Anatomy) actors have been linked in every section. Still, if you think it's necessary the link can be removed.

Thank you for bringing this to my attention. I was uncertain about it, but since you brought up an example, it makes sense for the link to be there.

For the second sentence of the first paragraph, include the author of the article and say praised Pompeo’s performance and wrote:…”
I have noticed while reading the article, you use a lot of quotes in full. Only use parts of the quotes that matter and use them in a sentence, contextualizing them in the larger scope of the episode. Reevaluate each long quote you use with this in mind. For instance, the last sentence of the first paragraph could be made stronger by doing the following: (Maggie Fremont of Vulture described Pompeo as giving the same kind of "powerhouse performance" seen in all the time times "Shonda continues to throw horrible situations at Meredith".) The full quote is nice, but again it is not necessarily and the quotes often become unwieldy.
To be perfectly honest, the “Reviews” section needs the most work. While the rest of the sections are mostly put together with minor issues, the section just throws a lot of long quotes without contextualizing them into a proper sentence. Look at the “Critical review” section of Going,_Going,_Gone_(Grey's_Anatomy) as an example of how to use quotes from critics.
Again, the article/website is not the one giving the review, the author is doing the work so say the author/writing for each review or just put a review from X when the author is unknown.
Citation need for Ariana Bacle’s review.

Workin on it NumerounovedantTalk 13:45, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Great job on all the other revisions. I understand the "Reviews" part may take some time, but you have all the raw materials already there to make it great so take all the time you need. I would suggest looking at other Grey's episode articles to see how they construct the review section. Aoba47 (talk) 15:22, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I think I am terrible at this XD, but have a look at what I have to offer and share your thoughts! NumerounovedantTalk 18:16, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

References

While not required for GAN, I would highly encourage you to archive all your sources when you can to avoid dead/broken links in the future. I have seen a lot of links become dead/broken for television episode articles so this is very important to this one.

Final comments

@Numerounovedant: As a fan of the show, I greatly appreciate the work put into the episode articles. I feel that this article was prematurely put up for GAN as the “Reviews” section is very unorganized and seems newly added and constructed. However, I think this article has a strong chance of being passed if my comments are addressed. There are just some awkward phrasing throughout the article that needs to be addressed and stylistic elements (contractions, quotes, etc.) that need to be addressed. Again, great work, especially for such a recent episode, but I have to admit it needs work. Let me know if you have any questions/comments to my comments. Aoba47 (talk) 04:32, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for picking up the review! I admit that I might have rushed a little, I tend to create article of episodes of the show (I am a huge fan as well!) as soon as they release, have been doing it for quite some time now! With time it gets harder to find all the required sources, so I agree that the article needs clean-up. I will get to work on the article ASAP, taking all the comments into consideration! NumerounovedantTalk 08:22, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I am happy to hear it! And there is nothing wrong with it being a little rushed as I admire your initiative and drive when creating the article. I agree that it is best to get the sources now so I completely understand. Let me know if you have any questions about the comments. Aoba47 (talk) 08:51, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

@Aoba47: I have worked on all the sections except for reviews which I am currently working on, left some comments and queries in certain sections. NumerounovedantTalk 13:33, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

@Numerounovedant: I have answered all of your questions to my comments. I agree with a majority of your concerns and I think you should do what you feel is best for the article as a whole. The only thing that I would really advise you to do is to refer to Jo as Dr. Jo Wilson as it is a little strange how she is the only "doctor" character not identified as a doctor and a reader unfamiliar with the show might not know she is a doctor and think she is someone unconnected from the hospital if that makes any sense. Otherwise, really great work so far. I hope you have found my suggestions to be helpful. I am looking forward to the rest of the work you do for this article. Aoba47 (talk) 15:22, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

@Aoba47: Thank you for all your suggestions, they were all really helpful and you have been a pleasure to work with! I have addressed all the comments and will wait for you to get back to me! NumerounovedantTalk 18:19, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

@Numerounovedant: Thank you for your kind words; it has been a pleasure working with you too and I am glad that I could help in any way possible. I respect all the work that you put into this article (it makes more motivated to do work in articles about episodes myself) ✓ Pass

@Aoba47: Thank you for all your help! NumerounovedantTalk 19:05, 10 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)

It is reasonably well written.
a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):
It is factually accurate and verifiable.
a (reference section): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism):
It is broad in its coverage.
a (major aspects): b (focused):
It follows the neutral point of view policy.
Fair representation without bias:
It is stable.
No edit wars, etc.:
It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.
a (images are tagged and non-free content have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
Overall:
Pass/Fail: