Talk:The Oregon Trail (1985 video game)/Archive 1

Archive 1

Some proposed changes to the intro of the article

Information to be added or removed: Rewriting of the intro to more clearly explain the role of the 1985 product within the broader history of The Oregon Trail game.

Explanation of issue: I propose to refocus the intro on what are probably the two main reasons for the article: 1) To clearly identify how this second-generation version is different from the first generation. 2) To provide a brief history of how and why this new generation was created.

References supporting change: There are two very helpful references (although please note that I wrote both of them). One of these is already listed in the References -- my Medium article from June 29, 2017 (“How I Managed to Design...”). The other reference is “A Brief History of the Oregon Trail Game” (http://www.died-of-dysentery.com/stories/brief-history.html).

Suggested text: Perhaps something like the following two paragraphs --

The Oregon Trail is a computer game for the Apple II developed by the Minnesota Educational Computing Consortium (MECC) and first released in 1985. It was designed to teach students about the realities of 19th-century pioneer life on the Oregon Trail. In the game, the player assumes the role of a wagon leader guiding a party of settlers from Independence, Missouri, to Oregon's Willamette Valley via a covered wagon in 1848. The software was designed and created by an internal team at MECC, led by R. Philip Bouchard, who also served as the principal designer of the product. Although the 1985 product was originally created for the Apple II computer only, an essentially identical version was later released for DOS. Augmented versions for Windows and Mac (using a mouse-based interface) were released in the early 1990s.

The 1985 product is the second major incarnation of the game known as The Oregon Trail, loosely based on the 1971 text-only game and its direct descendants. The 1985 version was the first in the Oregon Trail series to include such features as crossing rivers, stopping at landmarks, naming your party members, contracting dysentery and other diseases, carrying meat back to the wagon, choosing a profession, carrying spare parts, seeing daily weather updates, talking to people along the way, having members of your party die, erecting tombstones, and earning points based on your performance. This was also the version that introduced the iconic animation of an ox pulling a wagon across the landscape, as well as the first version to be sold as a stand-alone product under the title The Oregon Trail.

Further explanation: Notice that the first three sentences above are taken from the existing intro (with only tiny changes). After that the text is new. The three existing sentences include tags that could be retained.

Final comments: I am pleased to see that this article exists, and that it contains some very good content. Because of my history with The Oregon Trail, I am in a position to shed a great deal of light on the subject. However, because of my obvious conflict-of-interest, I want to tread lightly in making my suggestions. I hope to make additional suggestions quite soon, but first I want to see how this first one is received.

Filbo (talk) 22:38, 7 August 2019 (UTC)

Pinging @PresN, Bumm13, and Izno: for their input on this request. To paraphrase the request above, I believe that the main issue is the lead paragraph, which currently lists the names of the developers of the 1971 game. The requestor is asking if it could instead list the developers of the 1985 video game in the lead section, as this article is ostensibly about that version. Many thanks for any input you can offer, and my apologies for the ping if any of you are already watchlisted for this page. Regards,  Spintendo  23:52, 7 August 2019 (UTC)

Ah, yeah, at one point this article (as The Oregon Trail) covered both the 1985 and 1971 versions, mixing them poorly. I split out the 1971 version to The Oregon Trail (1971 video game) a year ago and rewrote it top to bottom (@Filbo:, if you didn't see it), but never did a full cleanup pass on this article, though it's still on my backlog to rewrite. I agree with Filbo's general thrust, for sure, and I certainly agree that the lead would be much better if it focused a bit more on the details of the 1985 game, including the developers specific to this version. I'll give it a poke. --PresN 04:24, 8 August 2019 (UTC)

Ok, I didn't use Filbo's text directly, but took some of it as a base to rewrite the lead so that it now focuses on the 1985 version, gives credit to the designer, and references the 1971 version mainly in terms of how things were changed or added to. The rest of the article is still a bit of a mess, but if I do get around to rewriting it I'll definitely pull from Filbo's Medium article again! --PresN 04:43, 8 August 2019 (UTC)

Notes

Some proposed changes to the Development section

Many thanks to the editors for considering and acting on my suggestions regarding the intro. Now I would like to recommend certain changes to the subsections currently named “Graphical version” and “GUI versions”.

Additional Source to Cite

I believe that the editors may find the follow source to be quite useful: “A Brief History of the Oregon Trail Game” (http://www.died-of-dysentery.com/stories/brief-history.html)

Full disclosure: I wrote the article. The value of the article is that it approaches the history of The Oregon Trail game in the form of a timeline, dividing the history into three principal generations.

Comments on the Section “Graphical version”

I suggest renaming this section “1985 Apple II version”. In the first sentence, the phrase “to make a graphical version” does not accurately reflect the team’s mandate. The actual mandate was to re-imagine the game as a much more elaborate product than the original, suitable for sale in the home market. This was the first version ever to be sold as a stand-alone product, and the first to be sold under the name “The Oregon Trail”. (See the “Brief History” article for details.) The upshot is that most of the features that people associate with the “original” version of the game were actually first introduced in 1985.

I suggest adding a brief new paragraph at the end of this section, mentioning the first DOS version, which was released in 1990. This version was essentially a clone of the Apple II version – but because of differences in how the Apple II and early DOS products displayed graphics, the images in the two products look slightly different.

Comments on the Section “GUI versions”

I suggest renaming this section “Mouse-based versions”. It would be helpful to specifically identify the three principal mouse-based versions – for B&W Mac (1991), for DOS (“Oregon Trail Deluxe” in 1992), and Windows (1993).

Correct Categorization of Products into First vs. Second Generation

The first generation of The Oregon Trail game – that is, the products derived from the original 1971 version – lasted for a full 14 years. This generation included not only the first Apple II version (included as OREGON in “Elementary Volume 6”), but also the Atari, Radio Shack, and Commodore versions (included as OREGON in “Expeditions”). MECC never ported the 1985 Apple II design to these 3 machines. In fact, the only direct port that MECC ever did was the DOS version of 1990. (Note: I once thought that MECC had also ported the design to Commodore, but this turned out to be untrue.)

Filbo (talk) 16:49, 8 August 2019 (UTC)

Reply 8-AUG-2019

  Clarification requested  

• To expedite your request, please provide the desired claims in the form of verbatim statements which can then be added to the article (if approved) by the reviewer. Exact, verbatim descriptions of any text to be removed should also be described. Finally, the exact location where the desired claims are to be placed should be mentioned, as shown in the example below.

Edit request example

Please remove the third sentence from the second paragraph of the Sun section: "The Sun's diameter is estimated to be approximately 25 miles in length." Please add the following claim as the third sentence of the second paragraph of the Sun section: "The Sun's diameter is estimated to be approximately 864,337 miles in length." Using as the reference: Paramjit Harinath (2019). The Sun. Academic Press. p. 1.

• Kindly open a new edit request at your earliest convenience when ready to proceed with the verbatim text and the placement locations.

Regards,  Spintendo  19:07, 8 August 2019 (UTC)

References

Thanks for clarifying the proper procedure!

I had been worried that as a person with an obvious conflict of interest, perhaps I should only offer general suggestions rather than specific text. This clarification from @Spintendo on the correct protocol was quite helpful. I will follow up soon with more specific suggestions. Thanks! Also many thanks to @PresN for his past and ongoing work on this article and the related articles. Filbo (talk) 21:18, 9 August 2019 (UTC)

Suggested edits for clarification, and to correct certain details

I suggest the following edits in order to clarify certain points, and to correct certain details. NOTE: On 8/14/2019 I revised this request to provide better information on sources, and to provide clarification regarding the specific claims.

Original edit request

1. Revised sentence (2nd paragraph, 2nd sentence): Old sentence: It was loosely based on an earlier text-based game also titled The Oregon Trail, originally developed by Don Rawitsch, Bill Heinemann, and Paul Dillenberger in 1971 and released in several successive versions by MECC beginning in 1974. Revised sentence: It was loosely based on an earlier text-based game named OREGON, originally developed by Don Rawitsch, Bill Heinemann, and Paul Dillenberger in 1971 and released on the MECC timeshare system in 1975, followed by similar versions for Apple, Atari, Commodore, and Radio Shack computers (from 1978 to 1984). Claims: This edit is based on 3 claims: 1) By 1984 (thus prior to 1985 version of The Oregon Trail) MECC was distributing versions of OREGON that had been ported to Apple, Atari, Commodore, and Radio Shack. 2) All MECC versions from 1975 to 1984 were officially entitled OREGON or “Oregon”, rather than The Oregon Trail. 3) Although Don Rawitsch typed the OREGON program into the MECC timeshare system in November 1974, he did not make it available to users until 1975, after he had finished making adjustments to the details of the random events. Source 1: “A Brief History of the Oregon Trail Game” (http://www.died-of-dysentery.com/stories/brief-history.html) – addition to the References; supports all 3 claims Source 2: MECC Educational Computing Catalog 1984-85 (published July 1984) (http://www.mecc.co/catalogs/mecc_school_catalog_1984-85.pdf) – addition to the References; supports claims #1 and #2; see pages 41, 63, 69, and 72 Source 3: “Oregon Trail (computer game)”, MNopedia (http://www.mnopedia.org/thing/oregon-trail-computer-game) – addition to References; supports claim #3 Source 4: “How You Wound Up Playing The Oregon Trail in Computer Class”, Smithsonian.com, July 22, 2016 (https://www.smithsonianmag.com/innovation/how-you-wound-playing-em-oregon-trailem-computer-class-180959851/) – addition to References; supports claim #3 2. Revised sentence (2nd paragraph, 3rd sentence): Old sentence: The 1985 version added numerous features to the original game beyond graphics, such as landmarks and river crossings, named party members who could contract dysentery and other diseases as well as die, conversations with characters along the way, and scoring based on the player's performance. Revised text: The 1985 version was the first to abandon the original 1971 game structure, replacing it with a much more elaborate structure, thereby launching the second generation of the game. The numerous new features included landmarks and river crossings, named party members who could contract dysentery and other diseases as well as die, conversations with characters along the way, and scoring based on the player's performance. Source: Bouchard, R. Philip (June 29, 2017). "How I Managed to Design the Most Successful Educational Computer Game of All Time" - (already in the References) 3. Revised sentence (3rd paragraph, 1st sentence): Old sentence: The 1985 The Oregon Trail is the first graphical entry and the most well known entry in the Oregon Trail series, and was released in multiple editions between 1985 and 1993 for several platforms, including DOS and Atari 8-Bit computers. Revised text: The 1985 The Oregon Trail is the most well-known entry in the Oregon Trail series. It was the first to include large amounts of graphics, and the first to be sold under the title “The Oregon Trail”. For several years it was only available as an Apple II product, but an identical version for DOS was released in 1990. Between 1991 and 1993 versions that supported a mouse-based interface were released for Macintosh, DOS, and Windows. Claims: This edit is based on 3 claims or corrections: 1) The 1985 design was never ported to Atari. The only Atari version came out in 1983, ported from the 1980 Apple design. Therefore it is better just to mention the DOS, Mac, and Windows versions, which are explained in more detail in the body of the article. 2) The 1985 product was not the first in the series to contain graphics, because the earlier Apple, Atari, Commodore, and Radio Shack versions all had a graphical hunting game and a graphical map. Calling the 1985 product “the first graphical entry” is doubly misleading, because a substantial number of screens in the 1985 product are 100% text, without any graphics. Therefore it is more accurate to say that the 1985 version was the first to contain large amounts of graphics. 3) The 1985 product was the first to be sold under the name “The Oregon Trail” (and also the first to be sold as a standalone product). This is related to the earlier claim that the earlier versions were simply named OREGON or “Oregon”. Source 1: “A Brief History of the Oregon Trail Game” – reference already mentioned above; supports all 3 claims Source 2: MECC Educational Computing Catalog 1984-85 – reference already mentioned above; indirectly supports claim #3; see pages 41, 63, 69, and 72 Source 3: Elementary Volume 6, MECC (https://archive.org/details/MECC-A725_Elementary_Vol._6_v1.2) – addition to the References; supports claim #2 Source 4: Lucas boy plays Expeditions by MECC on Commodore 64 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJWX3tOj2do) – possible addition to the References (although probably not); supports claim #2 4. Revised section title: Change “Original version” to “Predecessor versions”. Rationale: There were 14 years of versions prior to the 1985 design, including several versions for early personal computers. 5. Delete the final sentence in this section and replace with a new paragraph: Old sentence (to delete): MECC released several successive versions of the game for computer systems over the following decade. New paragraph: After Rawitsch published the BASIC language program code for the game in Creative Computing magazine in 1978, volunteers adapted the source code to run on various timeshare computers and newly invented personal computers. In 1980, MECC included one of the Apple II versions of OREGON in a product called Elementary Volume 6, a collection of five social studies simulation games. Although the game structure and random events in this game were identical to the timeshare version, the text-based hunting game was replaced with a graphical version of the game. In 1983 and 1984, this early Apple II version was ported to the Atari, Commodore, and Radio Shack computers, published by MECC in a product called Expeditions, a collection of three of the activities from Elementary Volume 6. There are 5 claims in the new paragraph proposed above: Claim 1: Rawitsch published the BASIC source code of OREGON in 1978, which allowed other people to adapt the game to other computers. Source: “Oregon Trail”, Don Rawitsch, Creative Computing, May/June 1978, pp. 132-139 (https://archive.org/details/creativecomputing-1978-05) – addition to the References; note that the magazine misspelled Don’s first name as “Dan”. Claim 2: Based on the source code that Don published, volunteers created versions of OREGON for various platforms, including the Apple II. (Note: The main Oregon Trail article specifically names the authors of two of these versions, but without providing a source. I would love to see that source!) Source: “A Brief History of the Oregon Trail Game” – reference already mentioned above Claim 3: MECC published “Elementary Volume 6” in 1980, containing five activities, one of which is OREGON. Source 1: MECC Educational Computing Catalog 1984-85 – reference already mentioned above; see page 41 Source 2: Elementary Volume 6, MECC (on archive.org) – reference already mentioned above; note the 1980 copyright date as the product boots Claim 4: The 1980 Apple II version of OREGON contains a graphical hunting game. Source 1: Bouchard, R. Philip (August 16, 2016). “Designing the Hunting Game for the Oregon Trail”, The Philipendium, Medium. (https://medium.com/the-philipendium/designing-the-hunting-game-for-the-oregon-trail-257924bdc6ae) – addition to References Source 2: Elementary Volume 6, MECC (on archive.org) – reference already mentioned above Claim 5: Three of activities in Elementary Volume 6 (including OREGON) were later ported to Atari, Commodore, and Radio Shack and sold under the name Expeditions. Source 1: “A Brief History of the Oregon Trail Game” – reference already mentioned above Source 2: MECC Educational Computing Catalog 1984-85 – reference already mentioned above; see pages 63, 69, and 72. 6. Revised section title: Change “Graphical version” to “1985 Redesign”. Rationale: The term “graphical version” is not only misleading (as explained in edit #3), but it also misses the main reason for designing a new version (as explained in edit #7). 7. Change a phrase in the first paragraph of this section: Old phrase: “to make a graphical version” New text: “to create a new version” Claim: This is a correction to a small but important error. The mandate of the 1985 team was not to create a graphical version (as currently stated), but to create an expanded and re-imagined version suitable for sale to the home market. Source: Bouchard, “How I managed…” (already in the References) 8. Expand the final sentence of this section: Old sentence: The game was released in autumn 1985. New text: The game was released in autumn 1985, the first product in the series to be sold under the name “The Oregon Trail”. Claim: This is a reiteration of the claim listed in edit #3 above, that the 1985 version was the first to be sold under the name “The Oregon Trail”. Again, the same two sources back it up. Source 1: “A Brief History of the Oregon Trail Game” – reference already mentioned above Source 2: MECC Educational Computing Catalog 1984-85 – reference already mentioned above 9. Revised section title: Change “GUI version” to “Mouse-based versions”. Rationale: While “GUI version” is technically correct, it is jargon that is understood by only a limited audience (and that audience is shrinking as the term goes out of fashion). A more widely understood phrase, communicating the same essential point, is “Mouse-based versions”. 10. Revised 1st sentence in this section: Old sentence: The GUI-based version includes redesigned interfaces, improved graphics featuring 256-color elements. New text: In 1991 through 1993, MECC released an updated version of the game for three different platforms – Macintosh (in monochrome, 1991), DOS (with “Deluxe” added to the title, 1992), and Windows (1993). The key new feature of these editions was a mouse-based interface, along with highly detailed graphics. Although these versions were based on the same game structure as the 1985 product, enhancements were made to some of the details in the game. Note: The proposed new text contains very little in the way of new claims. Instead, it clarifies information that is already present in the article but scattered. The three mouse-based versions (Mac, DOS, and Windows) are already mentioned in a sidebar in the article, along with release dates. The article already treats these three versions as variations of the 1985 design. New claim: The Macintosh version actually came out in 1991, and it was monochrome. Source 1: The Oregon Trail (for Macintosh), MECC, 1991 (https://jamesfriend.com.au/pce-js/mecc/oregon-trail.html) Source 2: (if you are willing to use the DoD article again) “A Brief History of the Oregon Trail Game” – reference already mentioned above

Thank you for considering my recommended changes!

Filbo (talk) 19:51, 12 August 2019 (UTC)

13-AUG-2019 reply from Spintendo

The only issue with these requests is that we need references appended for each claim that is to be added to the article. You've supplied one reference here, the Died of Dysentry website (DoD), but it's unknown if this reference is meant to apply to all of the insertions you've proposed here. If it is, then there is an additional problem — because we dont want this article to become merely an extension of the information that is published at that source. That source may be more correct than the Wikipedia article currently is, but in those instances it would be better to correct only the major claim elements according to the DoD source while leaving any additional claims to be accessed by the reader in the External links section by diplaying a link to the DoD site. Meanwhile, all of the information that is incorrect in the current version of the article should be proposed to be deleted (with URL's of the currently referenced information pointing out that those sources are incorrect in the information that they are ascribing to in the article.) In light of this, please do the following: Signify by marking which claims are attributable to the DoD source. Provide new sources for any claims that are being proposed which aren't verified by the DoD source. If all the claims are referenced by the DoD source, limit those claims to three or four sentences (with each sentence containing multiple claims if you wish). This will require creating a hierarchy of claims, whereby only the most important claims should be added minimally to the article (in order to prevent the Wikipedia article from becoming a mirror of the DoD source). Minimal informational items such as the changing of dates would not count towards the 4 sentence limit, and may be included in the request. Any other claims in the current version of the article which are not correct and can be proven as incorrect should either be proposed to be deleted (if shown as wrong by the DoD source + lack of verification in whichever source is currently being used) or corrected (if shown as incorrect by a new, reliable source). If you have any questions about this, please leave them here on the talk page. To signify that you have a new question, or are ready to proceed with the requested source attributions, please make sure to alter the {{request edit}} template's answer parameter to read from |ans=yes to |ans=no. Thank you! Regards,  Spintendo  22:13, 13 August 2019 (UTC)

Reply 15-AUG-2019

  Unable to review  

• In my first edit request response to the COI editor I suggested using a simple request format where the verbatim text would be shown alongside each reference. If the requests made in this fashion were approved, I would have then performed the necessary end-stage formatting myself for the text to be placed into the article. At that time there were less than 5 major edits requested, and completing this type of request is easily done when the formatting needs are minimal.
• However, with this latest revision, the request has grown in complexity. The formatting needs have now become substantial. As Wikipedia is a volunteer project, edit requests such yours are generally expected to have this formatting done before the request is submitted for review. As your request has grown in complexity, I am now requesting that the COI editor supply the correct formatting for the request using Citation Style 1 along with ref tags.

1. The edit request is not currently formatted in any style. The citation style predominantly used by the Oregon Trail article is Citation Style 1. This means that the requested edits of yours which may be implemented will need to resemble the current style already in use in the article – in this case, CS1.
2. Citation ref tags have not been placed within the requested text indicating which portions of the text the source is referencing. These need to be added.

In the collapsed section below titled Request edit examples, I have illustrated two. The first example shows how I initially suggested you propose the edit request, based on the minimal number of changes you requested at that time. The second example shows how the request is now being asked to be submitted.

Request edit examples

Originally-Suggested Request Format Please add the following claim to the third sentence of the first paragraph of the article's "Sun and Moon" section: "The Sun's diameter is 864,337.3 miles." Tristan Sjöblad. The Sun. Academic Press, 2018, p. 1 In the example above there is one citation provided with one claim statement. The citation has not been placed using Citation Style 1, which is the style predominantly used by the Oregon Trail article. Additionally, ref tags have not been placed within the text at the exact position where the information they reference resides. This would have been the formatting which I was prepared to perform at that time when the requested changes were minimal. As the request has grown in complexity, I'm now asking that the correct citation style and the correct positioning of the ref tags be placed, as shown below: Currently-Suggested Request Format Please add the following sentences to the first paragraph of the article's "Sun and Moon" section: "The Sun's diameter is 864,337.3 miles,<ref>{{cite book|last1=Sjöblad|first1=Tristan|title=The Sun|url=http://www.booksource.com|publisher=Academic Press|date=2018|page=1}}</ref> while the Moon's diameter is 2,159 miles.<ref>{{cite journal|last1=Harinath|first1=Paramjit|title=Size of the Moon|journal=Science|issue=78|volume=51|url=http://www.journalsource.com|date=2018|page=46}}</ref> The Sun's temperature is 5,778 degrees Kelvin."<ref>{{cite book|last1=Uemura|first1=Shu|title=The Sun's Heat|url=http://www.websource.com|publisher=Academic Press|date=2018|page=2}}</ref> (which displays as) Please add the following sentences to the first paragraph of the article's "Sun and Moon" section: "The Sun's diameter is 864,337.3 miles, while the Moon's diameter is 2,159 miles. The Sun's temperature is 5,778 degrees Kelvin." References In the example above the references have been formatted according to Citation Style 1, and are placed in the text using ref tags (shown in green font).

• Kindly rewrite your edit request so that it aligns with the second example shown in the collapsed section above, and feel free to re-submit that edit request at your earliest convenience below.
• Also note that according to WP:REDACTED, when a post which you've made on the talk page has been responded to, any further changes made to that post need to indicate the added and removed text by using strikeout font for anything removed and underlined font for anything added. The recent changes you've made to your edit request do not reflect those guidances under WP:REDACTED.
• If you have any questions about this formatting please don't hesitate to ask myself or another editor. Regards,  Spintendo  08:24, 15 August 2019 (UTC)

Notes

Spintendo, thank you for the additional clarification regarding the expected procedure for submitting edit requests. I certainly want to comply with the rules, and I genuinely appreciate the idea that the submission should not put an unnecessary burden on the editors. I also appreciate your patience with my learning curve. If all goes well, then my next submission will indeed be formatted and presented in an appropriate manner. Thanks!

Filbo (talk) 19:15, 15 August 2019 (UTC)

Thank you for your understanding, it's much appreciated. I (and others) stand ready to review any and all revised requests at your earliest convenience. Thank you! Regards,  Spintendo  03:08, 16 August 2019 (UTC)

Ten suggested edits, with sources and markup

This is my third attempt to recommend the following 10 edits, and this time (fingers crossed) I think my submission might finally be in an appropriate format – with adequate sourcing and full markup. Many thanks to Spintendo for nudging me along the learning curve!

Extended content

1. Revised sentence (intro, 2nd paragraph, 2nd sentence): Old sentence: It was loosely based on an earlier text-based game also titled The Oregon Trail, originally developed by Don Rawitsch, Bill Heinemann, and Paul Dillenberger in 1971 and released in several successive versions by MECC beginning in 1974. New sentence: It was loosely based on an earlier text-based game named OREGON, originally developed by Don Rawitsch, Bill Heinemann, and Paul Dillenberger in 1971 and released on the MECC timeshare system in 1975, followed by similar versions for Apple, Atari, Commodore, and Radio Shack computers (from 1978 to 1984). 2. Revised sentence (intro, 2nd paragraph, 3rd sentence): Old sentence: The 1985 version added numerous features to the original game beyond graphics, such as landmarks and river crossings, named party members who could contract dysentery and other diseases as well as die, conversations with characters along the way, and scoring based on the player's performance. New text: The 1985 version was the first to abandon the original 1971 game structure, replacing it with a much more elaborate structure, thereby launching the second generation of the game. The numerous new features included landmarks and river crossings, named party members who could contract dysentery and other diseases as well as die, conversations with characters along the way, and scoring based on the player's performance. 3. Revised sentence (intro, 3rd paragraph, 1st sentence): Old sentence: The 1985 The Oregon Trail is the first graphical entry and the most well known entry in the Oregon Trail series, and was released in multiple editions between 1985 and 1993 for several platforms, including DOS and Atari 8-Bit computers. New text: The 1985 The Oregon Trail is the most well-known entry in the Oregon Trail series. It was the first to include large amounts of graphics, and the first to be sold under the title “The Oregon Trail”. For several years it was only available as an Apple II product, but an identical version for DOS was released in 1990. Between 1991 and 1993 versions that supported a mouse-based interface were released for Macintosh, DOS, and Windows. 4. Revised section title: Change “Original version” to “Predecessor versions”. Rationale: There were 14 years of versions prior to the 1985 design, including several versions for early personal computers. 5. Delete the final sentence in the “Original version” section and replace with a new paragraph: Old sentence (to delete): MECC released several successive versions of the game for computer systems over the following decade. New paragraph: After Rawitsch published the BASIC language program code for the game in Creative Computing magazine in 1978, volunteers adapted the source code to run on various timeshare computers and newly invented personal computers. In 1980, MECC included one of the Apple II versions of OREGON in a product called Elementary Volume 6, a collection of five social studies simulation games. Although the game structure and random events in OREGON were identical to the timeshare version, the text-based hunting feature was replaced with a graphical version of the activity. In 1983 and 1984, this early Apple II version was ported to the Atari, Commodore, and Radio Shack computers, published by MECC in a product called Expeditions, a collection of three of the activities from Elementary Volume 6. 6. Revised section title: Change “Graphical version” to “1985 Redesign”. 7. Revised phrase (in “Graphical version”, 1st paragraph, 1st sentence): Old phrase: “to make a graphical version” New phrase: “to create a new, expanded version” 8. Expand the final sentence of this section: Old sentence: The game was released in autumn 1985. New text: The game was released in autumn 1985, the first product in the series to be sold under the name “The Oregon Trail”. 9. Revised section title: Change “GUI version” to “Mouse-based versions”. Rationale: While “GUI version” is technically correct jargon, a significant number of people are unfamiliar with the term. 10. Replace sentence with expanded text (in “GUI version”, 1st paragraph, 1st sentence): Old sentence: The GUI-based version includes redesigned interfaces, improved graphics featuring 256-color elements. New text: In 1991 through 1993, MECC released an updated version of the game for three different platforms – Macintosh (in monochrome, 1991), DOS (with “Deluxe” added to the title, 1992), and Windows (1993). The key new feature of these editions was a mouse-based interface, along with highly detailed graphics. Although these versions were based on the same game structure as the 1985 product, enhancements were made to some of the details in the game. References

Thank you for considering my recommended edits!

Filbo (talk) 16:38, 16 August 2019 (UTC)

Reply 17-AUG-2019

Below you will see where proposals from your request have been quoted with reviewer decisions and feedback inserted underneath, either accepting, declining or otherwise commenting upon your proposal(s). Please read the enclosed notes within the proposal review section below for information on each request.  Spintendo  13:38, 17 August 2019 (UTC)

Proposal review 17-AUG-2019

It was loosely based on an earlier text-based game named OREGON, originally developed by Don Rawitsch, Bill Heinemann, and Paul Dillenberger in 1971 and released on the MECC timeshare system in 1975  Approved. followed by similar versions for Apple, Atari, Commodore, and Radio Shack computers (from 1978 to 1984). Clarification needed. The 1985 version was the first to abandon the original 1971 game structure, replacing it with a much more elaborate structure, thereby launching the second generation of the game.  Declined. The numerous new features included landmarks and river crossings, named party members who could contract dysentery and other diseases as well as die, conversations with characters along the way, and scoring based on the player's performance. The 1985 The Oregon Trail is the most well-known entry in the Oregon Trail series.  Already done. It was the first to include large amounts of graphics, and the first to be sold under the title “The Oregon Trail”.  Declined. For several years it was only available as an Apple II product Clarification needed. but an identical version for DOS was released in 1990. Clarification needed. Between 1991 and 1993 versions that supported a mouse-based interface were released for Macintosh, DOS, and Windows. Clarification needed. After Rawitsch published the BASIC language program code for the game in Creative Computing magazine in 1978, volunteers adapted the source code to run on various timeshare computers and newly invented personal computers. In 1980, MECC included one of the Apple II versions of OREGON in a product called Elementary Volume 6, a collection of five social studies simulation games. Although the game structure and random events in OREGON were identical to the timeshare version, the text-based hunting feature was replaced with a graphical version of the activity. In 1983 and 1984, this early Apple II version was ported to the Atari, Commodore, and Radio Shack computers, published by MECC in a product called Expeditions, a collection of three of the activities from Elementary Volume 6.  Approved. Change "Graphical version" to "1985 Redesign"  Declined. to create a new, expanded version  Declined. The game was released in autumn 1985, the first product in the series to be sold under the name "The Oregon Trail"  Declined. Change "GUI version" to "Mouse-based versions"  Declined. In 1991 through 1993, MECC released an updated version of the game for three different platforms – Macintosh (in monochrome, 1991), DOS (with “Deluxe” added to the title, 1992), and Windows (1993).  Approved. The key new feature of these editions was a mouse-based interface, along with highly detailed graphics. Although these versions were based on the same game structure as the 1985 product, enhancements were made to some of the details in the game.  Declined. ___________

Response 18-Aug-2019 to Requests for Clarification

Thank you for considering all of the edits that I suggested, and thank you for accepting several of them. The 17-Aug-2019 proposal review included four requests for clarification, which I provide below.

Clarification 1

1. Text needing clarification: followed by similar versions for Apple, Atari, Commodore, and Radio Shack computers (from 1978 to 1984).

Reviewer comment: The provided reference covers the timespan from 1984 to 1985, which does not cover a portion of the timespan in the claim from 1978 to 1983.

Clarification: I see your point. The source I provided is a MECC catalog published in July 1984, showing the products available at that time (and thus available for purchase during the 1984-85 school year). While this citation supports the claim that these four versions of OREGON (Apple, Atari, Commodore, and Radio Shack) all existed by 1984, it does not provide the original date of publication for each version. To remedy this issue, I suggest adding a second reference, the Brief History article from DoD.

Reply 20-AUG-2019

 Unable to implement
This clarification (which was approved nonetheless) does not provide the verbatim proposed text along with the formatted reference which was to accompany it. Instead, the formatted reference has been added to the text of the clarification. When mentioning which references to use, please include the formatted reference along with the proposed verbatim text — even if these have already been provided elsewhere.

 Spintendo  03:32, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Clarification 2

2. Text needing clarification: For several years it was only available as an Apple II product

Reviewer comment: "For several years" is not descriptive. The years should be given instead.

Revised text: For five years it was only available as an Apple II product

Reply 20-AUG-2019

 Unable to implement
This clarification (which was approved nonetheless) ultimately could not be added because it belongs with text from clarification #3 below, which was not implemented.

 Spintendo  03:32, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Clarification 3

3. Text needing clarification: but an identical version for DOS was released in 1990.

Reviewer comment: A proposed claim later in this edit request states "In 1991 through 1993, MECC released an updated version of the game for three different platforms – Macintosh (in monochrome, 1991), DOS (with “Deluxe” added to the title, 1992), and Windows (1993)." The date for the DOS version is not stated as 1990 — only that a "deluxe" version was made in 1992.

Clarification: MECC published two different DOS versions derived from the 1985 Apple II design. The 1990 DOS version and the 1992 DOS version had completely different UIs, even though both versions featured the same game structure and events. The 1990 version was intended to be an exact clone of the 1985 Apple II product, and therefore the UI is an extremely close match to the Apple product, with all user input occurring via the keyboard. The 1992 version had a GUI-like interface inspired by the Mac version of 1991 (except that the DOS version was in color). The 1992 version also included a few enhancements to the details of the game. To distinguish between the two DOS versions, MECC included the word “Deluxe” in the title of the 1992 product. The upshot is that I suggest simply inserting these two additional references -- the 1990 citation here, and the 1992 citation in the sentence where the 1992 DOS version is mentioned. However, if the editors feel that additional text is called for, I would be happy to provide it.

Reply 20-AUG-2019

Not done
This clarification does appear to offer the verbatim text along with the formatted references. However, the area of text under Clarification contains additional explanatory text where it is unclear if this additional text is to be added to the article. If it is to be added, this text is unreferenced.

 Spintendo  03:32, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Clarification 4

4. Text needing clarification: Between 1991 and 1993 versions that supported a mouse-based interface were released for Macintosh, DOS, and Windows.

Reviewer comment: It is not known what is meant by "mouse-based interface".

Revised text: Between 1991 and 1993, MECC released three GUI versions of the game (for Macintosh, DOS, and Windows respectively), thereby allowing people to play the game using a mouse.

NOTE: I am submitting my response to the requested clarifications as a separate edit request. If there if an alternate method that would have been better, please let me know, and I'll do it differently next time.

Filbo (talk) 23:24, 18 August 2019 (UTC)

Reply 20-AUG-2019

 Unable to implement
This clarification (which was approved nonetheless) ultimately could not be added because it belongs with text from clarification #3 above, which was not implemented.

 Spintendo  03:32, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

References