Talk:The Dancing Years

Stub needs improvement

Article needs a lot of work to bring up to standard. I fixed a few typos, but will need much more research to provide substantive improvements. -- Larry Jay 22:04, 4 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Nazi coda

The history of the Nazi section/s of this show is complicated (and has indeed been discussed at academic conferences). There were several revisions and excisions. The current synopsis has a sentence which does not reflect the most easily accessible public source (ie NOR) for the ending:

>> After more than another decade passes, in 1938 Rudi is sentenced to death by the Nazis for helping Jews to escape Austria, but Maria uses her husband's connections to get a reprieve for him.

In the complete ITV recording from 1979 (easily accessible on YouTube) Rudi is threatened by the Nazis but there is no mention of his being sentenced to death. As a result a more neutral summary would seem sensible, such as:

>>In 1938 Rudi comes under threat from the Nazis for helping Jews to escape Austria, but Maria uses her husband's connections to help him. 31.124.106.63 (talk) 06:28, 11 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I made the change. What do you mean by NOR? Also, I have seen sources that say Rudi was in jail when he meets Otto. Why do you disagree? -- Ssilvers (talk) 06:48, 11 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you. Apologies, I was typing in a hurry and used NOR as an abbreviation for WP:NOR (just in any case there are editors looking at this page who might want to rely on private manuscripts or whatever rather than published scripts and who might therefore need reminding). I would be most interested in these sources for the jail. As Rudi is introduced to Otto in 1926, any such jail scene could not relate to Nazis so what is this scene about? As to any disagreement, I encourage people to look at the long ITV version from 1979 (on YouTube at over two hours running time, not the shortened dvd version which is on YouTube in sections). No version of this show can be definitive (for reasons of its complex history) but this production is as recent and as complete as can easily be cited. Hope this helps. 31.124.106.63 (talk) 12:20, 11 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

It says so here, for example: "Many years later they meet again when Rudi is in prison." -- Ssilvers (talk) 17:23, 11 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Yes I know. This is a puzzle as the passage does not make clear if this relies on an unperformed draft (ie pre Lord Chamberlain), or the Adelphi version, or some kind of garble. You will have noticed that later in that interview a number of documents are referred to in very general terms so I think the “established” running order of the show (as referenced here and the 1979 ITV production discussed above) is safer pending more complete and detailed sources. 31.124.106.63 (talk) 18:02, 11 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

This "revised" version totally leaves out the Nazi stuff, but it may supply some plot points. Also, if this is the ITV version, then I don't think the ITV version is a good guide for what was presented at the Adelphi, which is the production we should be focusing on. Check this out. And this. And this. Also, would you mind, please, keeping the discussion compact on the Talk page, without the extra spaces? All the best, -- Ssilvers (talk) 18:44, 11 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

This is very helpful, thank you. Taking your points in order:

This "revised" version totally leaves out the Nazi stuff

That is a misreading. The SS were Nazis and SS headquarters are listed as a setting. I think this summary is poorly written.

if this is the ITV version

It isn’t (as I have now suggested more than once, the ITV version can easily be consulted on YouTube - here - but one needs to take care not to confused by the dvd transfer of the same performance, also on YouTube, as it has been shortened) Incidentally Wikipedia makes clear that works of art are their own sources so the recording is a legitimate source.

then I don't think the ITV version is a good guide for what was presented at the Adelphi

Indeed. It is however a more complete version of the text described in The Complete Book of Light Opera (which I see you like as a source, as you helpfully linked to an Internet Archive copy). As this volume predates ITV by many years and is therefore closer to Adelphi, and is also clearly more carefully researched than the other summaries (it has no "jail" nor a muddle about the Anschluss being "war") perhaps one can use this one for Wikipedia. To quote from your link:

The last scene takes place in a room in a former royal palace in Vienna. The year is 1938. The anschluss (sic) has taken place and Vienna is under Nazi domination (which is not the same thing as being "at war"). Rudi Kleber has been arrested (which is not the same as being "in jail") for bribing German officials to allow Austrian suspects to leave the country. As he is being interrogated by a Nazi officer Maria arrives and demands to see Rudi. As Princess Metterling she has sufficient influence to effect his release. Before they part he asks her: "Our son, Carl, does he think as they do?" and she assures him: "Oh, no, he thinks as we do." "Oh, thank God," he tells her, "now I shall never feel my life has been completely wasted." Tenderly she asks: "Wasted? How could it be wasted? You know what they'll say of you — they'll say — he made the whole world dance."

Incidentally that wonderful closing line explains the otherwise rather obscure title of the show. The "dancing years" are the years before the arrival of the Nazis and (by implication) the suppression of Rudi's music. 31.124.106.63 (talk) 05:01, 12 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Just to be clear, I don't very much like any of these sources. What I would really like is the script of, or a good summary of, the Adelphi version. -- Ssilvers (talk) 06:17, 12 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]