Talk:The Amazing Race 31

start line

I know Phil says "I'm at the start..." in that instragram thing, but you'll note the camera does a full 360 pan and there's clearly no racers/start line visible (maybe this was before they are brought in by some means, such as boat? Regardless, I do think the pier is clearly identifable from that pan -we can name the starting city from that, but whether that's actually the "start line" is unclear. --Masem (t) 14:11, 18 June 2018 (UTC)

But he never identifies the name of the pier nor where it is located, and it's not like there's a shortage of piers in the US. Sinjoh2015 (talk) 12:28, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bj22RrxAsDL/ & https://www.google.com/maps/@33.8612683,-118.405245,3a,75y,269.61h,87.43t/data=!3m8!1e1!3m6!1sAF1QipPExl82atLhS9LdRcuE54WxaWQbJ6zsXCdrKLIf!2e10!3e11!6shttps:%2F%2Flh5.googleusercontent.com%2Fp%2FAF1QipPExl82atLhS9LdRcuE54WxaWQbJ6zsXCdrKLIf%3Dw203-h100-k-no-pi0-ya269.19238-ro0-fo100!7i8000!8i4000 Xoruz (talk) 12:48, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

Without Google Maps, what in the post is identifies that it's Hermosa's Beach's pier. Yes they look similar, but what I'm not understanding is how you know that this is the correct location.Sinjoh2015 (talk) 17:29, 20 June 2018 (UTC)

Actually, this is fair. If we could see, for example, the indistiguisable skyline of the San Monica amusement pier in the BG, then yes, we could 100% identify this pier. There's nothing in this to give that clarity, not even if its east vs west coast (though odds are 100% favorable of a CA coast setting). I know TAR trackers have likely identified it, but we can't use those sources. And again, we can't be clear that's the start line itself. We'll have to wait until airing or more details are given. --Masem (t) 17:47, 20 June 2018 (UTC)

Potential details on finish line

CBS had permits for Belle Isle in Detroit for July 3 but have had to do reworking. This may not have to do with the current race, but if it ends up there, we can include this in the article. --Masem (t) 14:21, 29 June 2018 (UTC)

Results table commented out

Due to the constant edits to change relationships that we do not know until the first episode actually airs, I've commented out the results table. We have the cast list in the casting section that works for now. --Masem (t) 00:59, 9 April 2019 (UTC)

I am going to stress again that until the first episode airs, we're guessing how the show's chevrons will name these groups. CBS's new press releases are relating post-race relationships, but the show is going to be exact for how the pairs raced. 99.999% sure that the show will list the now-engaged couple as "Dating". --Masem (t) 21:15, 11 April 2019 (UTC)

No people aren't. They're literally listed on the cast section for The Amazing Race on CBS's website. https://www.cbs.com/shows/amazing_race/cast/ Sinjoh2015 (talk) 11:14, 12 April 2019 (UTC)

The website is made by different people that produce the show. We have always gone by the names given in the on-screen chevrons, which have usually matched the website, but because of the huge delay between the race's run and broadcast, those relationships have changed. --Masem (t) 14:34, 12 April 2019 (UTC)

Even though they have to get information from the show's production anyway for information on the teams in order to post it on the site? Sinjoh2015 (talk) 19:06, 12 April 2019 (UTC)

Leg 1 Cut Task

I was browsing through the press released pictures and noticed that there seemed to be a task involving the jellyfish kites on Hermosa Beach. Link to an album with the associated images: https://imgur.com/a/3TpxYsU. (Proof that the images are from the press release: https://cbspressexpress.com/cbs-entertainment/shows/the-amazing-race/photos) Sinjoh2015 (talk) 23:03, 18 April 2019 (UTC)

         It was to find the "extreme roadblock" power. Apparently, it wasn't shown because it never got used. jr0929 22:57, 19 April 2019 (UTC)

On Nicole and Victor's status

Unfortunately, the show itself is not identifying teams by their status with the chevrons (focusing more on their original show), so the question of whether to present Nicole & Victor as "dating" or "engaged" remains up in the air. However, last night's episode, Victor definitely called Nicole his girlfriend, and this article [1] about how they fell in love and that the engagement came on BB20 after they ran the race, I really think we should be listing this as "dating" as that is 100% what they were when they ran the race, with the footnote to establish the engagement. --Masem (t) 14:31, 2 May 2019 (UTC)

Consistent with how we list the Big Brother houseguests' ages at the time they entered the house, I agree with this proposal. 9March2019 (talk) 14:58, 2 May 2019 (UTC)

I disagree, since, again, from the official site (https://www.cbs.com/shows/amazing_race/cast/), they are listed as "Engaged", not "Dating". I don't get why this is not allowed to be a source. If we start going by the teams' actual relationship if it's different from the show, then Peter & Sarah from TAR10 then should be listed as "Friends", since Sarah came out and stated they weren't even actually dating, only pretended to be (https://www.ocregister.com/2010/02/12/san-juan-amputee-tells-real-story-behind-amazing-race/) and that Joel & Ashley from TARCan4 should be listed as "Stepfather/Stepdaughter", since their own bio admits to that being their actual relationship. Also, if we agree to this, can we agree to Art & JJ's relationship being "Best Friends" and Becca & Floyd being "Friends" rather than "Border Patrol Agents" and "Best Friends" respectively? I don't know who keeps changing it, but it gets really annoying. Sinjoh2015 (talk) 03:45, 9 May 2019 (UTC)

Its not that the site isn't bad, but this is a wholly unique situation due to the massive delay between when it was run and when it was broadcast. The only other example we have to go on is TAR17, Chad's engagement to Steph which actually had the chevron change on screen. But even looking at the old CBS pages [2] they were listed BF/GF as they were at the start of the race. Now, because N/V's engagement was rather public and on a CBS show even. I can totally see how it would be silly to name them as "dating" when the site went live when "everyone" knew differently that they were well and engaged. For your other cases, its all that it was clear that those relationship held for how they ran the race - even considering Peter and Sarah, they went along with the Dating element.

It sucks they are not using the relationship chevrons to remove this question. --Masem (t) 00:33, 10 May 2019 (UTC)

I'm reviving this, since clearly a consensus wasn't reached. Can we at least agree if the show doesn't label the teams' relationships, then the bios released on CBS, that are written by the teams are fair game to use? Sinjoh2015 (talk) 17:50, 7 June 2019 (UTC)

U-Turn Symbols for Leg 8

Last night's episode had a U-Turn vote, where each team voted for another team to receive a U-Turn. I don't think it's necessary to include established U-Turn symbols, except for the two teams who received it as there is a table for more details. 9March2019 (talk) 20:45, 6 June 2019 (UTC)

Amazing Race Vietnam

A few editors have included the trivia of The Amazing Race Vietnam being the first edition of The Amazing Race to visit Laos prior to this season's visit, yet user Sportsfan 1234 keeps insisting that this information doesn't matter but provides no reason as to why it doesn't matter. Saying, "no need to mention other" is just a statement and is neither a reason nor an explanation for removal of the information. I have explained why I feel this information is important as The Amazing Race Vietnam is an Amazing Race franchise, which lists Bertram Van Munster, Elise Doganieri, and Jerry Bruckheimer in its credits meaning that it has an affiliation with CBS's The Amazing Race, so "[i]t is not reasonable to disallow all information that some editors feel is unimportant, because that information could be important to some readers" under the guidelines of Wikipedia:Handling trivia. I have provided sources as required under the policy and mentioned by user Masem, yet Sportsfan 1234 did not follow the Wikipedia:Disruptive editing policy of "[i]f sourced information appears this time around, do nothing" and has not done the step of ensuring "that a clear explanation for the difference in opinion is posted...at the article talkpage." Sportsfan 1234 said that I violated the disruptive editing policy and instructed me to be "familiar with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines, and please do not continue to make edits that appear disruptive", yet isn't following said policy to resolve a dispute. Xoruz (talk) 05:03, 1 January 2020 (UTC)

First, you need to review WP:BRD. As your edits have been reverted multiple times, it *is* edit warring to continue to add them until you get consensus that they are fine.

As for the edits, you're engaging in WP:SYNTH. Yes, this season went to Laos, and yet TAR:V went to Laos previously. However, unless some third-party source specifically notes this, then this is synthesis of information. I note on past TAR articles we've not identified how other versions have gone to different countries. --Masem (t) 06:27, 1 January 2020 (UTC)

"The Race traveled over 25,000 miles across four continent and ten countries, including first time visits to Laos and Uganda." This is a false statement, however. This statement simply says "Race", implying "The Amazing Race", and thus implying the franchise as a whole. This is NOT the first time Laos has been visited by The Amazing Race, and thus this statement is supplying false information. Furthermore, your reasoning for removing the mention of international versions is contradicted by the very next paragraph, which notes that the Must-Vote U-Turn has been featured in international versions previously. We also explicitly and extensively mention previous international versions when introducing the Head-to-Head on The Amazing Race 30's page. 96.48.239.44 (talk) 10:14, 12 February 2020 (UTC)

@Bgsu98 As per usual on Wikipedia, somebody brought this up and nobody cared to answer or acknowledge the problem, instead choosing to just continually go "I'm right, everyone else is wrong." TheNewLayoutReallySucks (talk) 02:10, 1 June 2023 (UTC)

I'll just copy/paste the response provided above which addresses this issue: As for the edits, you're engaging in WP:SYNTH. Yes, this season went to Laos, and yet TAR:V went to Laos previously. However, unless some third-party source specifically notes this, then this is synthesis of information. I note on past TAR articles we've not identified how other versions have gone to different countries. --Masem (t) 06:27, 1 January 2020 (UTC) Bgsu98 (Talk) 02:15, 1 June 2023 (UTC)

except that doesn't address the issue at all, which is probably why others keep bringing it up. 2605:8D80:443:6C51:26F4:FCC4:BB08:BED8 (talk) 22:05, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

I was actually fine with your addition even though I tweaked the wording slightly. Someone else deleted it. Bgsu98 (Talk) 02:04, 3 June 2023 (UTC)

@Sportsfan 1234 Over the course of my multiple edits that attempt to correct the false information on this page, I have explained succinctly my reasoning for why it needs to be changed and why it can't stay the way it is. You, however, continue to revert without offering any kind of rebuttal. USE YOUR FUCKING WORDS. The statement on this page about Laos is provably false. There are multiple different ways the statement could be altered so that it is no longer false, whether we mention TAR Vietnam or don't, but you have rejected all of them all with reverts that lack any edit summary. I refuse to let a false statement remain on this page, so please use your fucking words and decide on a way the statement can be altered so that it is no longer false. How do you respond? TheNewLayoutReallySucks (talk) 04:50, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

I left you two sources which say they are first time visits [3]. You just don't want to 'fucking' hear it. Sportsfan 1234 (talk) 04:54, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

Can you provide a reference that the information in question is false? PiGuy3 (talk) 04:54, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

Please read Masem's first comment. Sportsfan 1234 (talk) 04:58, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for drawing my attention to that, I understand the situation now so I'll leave your revert. PiGuy3 (talk) 05:17, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

The Amazing Race 31 is not the first time Laos was visited. It was visited in 2015 on The Amazing Race Vietnam. Just because random sources on the internet said something doesn't make it true. Should I link the official Youtube upload of the TAR Vietnam episode that visited Laos? TheNewLayoutReallySucks (talk) 05:06, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

@User:PiGuy3 response? TheNewLayoutReallySucks (talk) 05:23, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

I pretty much concur with Masem, if the usual approach is to treat editions separately that should continue for style reasons. However, the additional information doesn't add a lot to the article and it could be misleading to a reader so I'm a little on the fence. PiGuy3 (talk) 06:14, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

My entire point about this is that it's misleading to the reader as it is now, because it's false. If we're not allowed to mention TAR Vietnam due to synth (That still makes no sense to me), my second idea was to specify in the sentence that we're only talking about the original American edition of the show. Because this IS the first time that the American version of the show visited Laos. However, just like before, this was reverted without edit summary or rebuttal. I'm willing to work out a compromise here, but nobody has thus far given me a proper answer to anything I bring up beyond saying "Synth, synth, no, no" and blindly reverting things. TheNewLayoutReallySucks (talk) 07:16, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

Maybe we can add a parenthetical clarification to the sentence to disambiguate that we mean the base series and not spinoffs? Thoughts on the wording? PiGuy3 (talk) 07:23, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

I'm fine with anything as long as Sportsfan doesn't blindly revert it again. Apparently I'm not allowed to touch it, so you can go ahead and try something. TheNewLayoutReallySucks (talk) 08:53, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

Does that look good to you? PiGuy3 (talk) 08:58, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

All he ever does is blindly hit the revert button while contributing nothing else at all to the Amazing Race project. For what it’s worth, I agree with you and have re-inserted the edit I thought handled this situation back in June before it was - wait for it… - reverted by you-know-who. Bgsu98 (Talk) 09:29, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

At least I am not the one who ruined all the TAR and Survivor articles! I have been here way longer than you have contributed way more edits than you have. So to blindly label my contributions as "nothing else", please check the mirror! Sportsfan 1234 (talk) Seriously don't address me or talk about me ever again. Sportsfan 1234 (talk) 13:02, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

Sportsfan should probably re-read Help:Edit Summary. Page even specifies that the summary box should be used especially in reverts. If this behaviour continues, administrative action should take place. TheNewLayoutReallySucks (talk) 10:57, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

I have reworded the line to say first time visit for the AMERICAN version of the show. Sportsfan 1234 (talk) 13:16, 9 November 2023 (UTC)