Talk:The 25th Annual Putnam County Spelling Bee

Merged article

We've got duplicate articles here folks. see 25th Annual Putnam County Spelling Bee. consult your playbills and talk amongst yourselves to decide whether you want the "the" in the title or not. J. Van Meter 00:17, 6 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

The official site has "The" in it, and this page existed prior to the other one, so I redirected the other article here. --Arcadian 00:51, 6 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Geographically Ambiguous?

The article refers to Putnam County as "geographically ambiguous". I haven't seen the show so I don't know if there's a reason for this description. I assumed that the title county was Putnam County New York.

AUTHOR'S NOTE in the Libretto Vocal Book:

Spelling Bee is designed to feel newly created with each performance, and to belong to the community that presents it. The involvement of audience volunteers allows for adaptability and surprise, so that no two performances are exactly alike. We love that it is alive in this way. At the same time, because it is a musical, because it tells a specific story of young people at a turning point in their lives--and of course because if performance time drags on everyone can quickly go from having a great time to hating the show--more is scripted than audiences may realize.

So this text contains elements meant to support the balancing act of the scripted and seemingly unscripted.

We all hope you enjoy making it yours. At the same time, be aware the show is like a well-oiled machine, which needs certain things to happen at certain times. Stick to the script and you should be rewarded.]

I saw it in Boston, and the cast kept throwing in local jokes, that definetly change at each venue. I think its meant to be geographically ambiguous, or possibly take place in the city the performance is in.

Yeah, definitely a local thing. Much like the Simpson's Springfield, I think it is meant to be geographically ambiguous. The second time I saw it, with the original Broadway cast in LA (Brentwood specifically), Olive arrived alone on the Big Blue Bus (interestingly whose line ends at the Veteran Affairs compound at which the Wadsworth Theater is housed) and Logainne came from Topanga Canyon, and other cast-member competitors from local suburbs. Definitely a local thing. Valley2city 18:13, 28 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Plot?

The show opens with RONA LISA PERETTI wandering into the empty Gymnasium. She has a flashback to her time winning the Bee, and the show kicks off with a song. The spellers enter and are given their numbers and register, audience volunteers are brought to the stage. DOUG PANCH the vice principal of [local high school] is replacing the superintendent, who has fallen ill, as the word reader. MITCHELL "MITCH" MAHONEY, the comfort counselor who is "doing his community service work with us here today," enters to lead in the pledge of allegiance. The rules are explained and the spelling begins. We learn about the spellers through the information sheets that RONA conveys to the audience with each spelling. LEAF CONEYBEAR has a flashback which shows the call that he will be attending the Bee despite placing 3rd. OLIVE OSTROVSKY stops an audience member from sitting in a chair she saved for her father, and we learn of her love for language, and some of the other male spellers (CHIP & CONEYBEAR) awe of Olive. Some of the words vary in difficulty, and after "Cow" (or similarly easy word) is given to an audience volunteer, the song PANDEMONIUM begins as they express their frustration over the randomness and unfairness of life (through the lens of the Bee). There is a flashback from Schwarzy's practice with her two fathers, CARL DAD & DAN DAD. CARL DAD pushes her, DAN DAD wants her to break. To be continued....

Words

Can we have a list of words used in the play? I just saw it tonight and headed to wikipedia to find some words, but they weren't there. Anyone else think that would be a good idea? There is a total of 67 words alluded to directly in the text in addition to 17 "corrects" which makes it 84 words that realistically occur in the Bee. only about 50% or less of these are actually spelled.

I can think of a few:

Syzygy.
Lugubrious.
Pakapoo.f
Chinchilla.
Vug.
Katterjoons or Catterjunes. These spellings are from the script. Catterjunes was the word made by Jay Reiss, and the script implies each Panch might have their own special made-up word.
Acouchi.

(And the "easy" ones, if we want them, include jihad, cow, and Mexican.) ---Dana 03:59, 8 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Some more: acouchi, phylactery, gardyloo, strabismus, sluice, camouflage, omphaloskepsis, ilspile, zoonosis, chromatophore, astrobleme, elanguescence, weltanschauung --Arcadian 11:54, 8 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I decided to add the section. I feel it's an important section to have, because I knew Wikipedia would be the best place to look to find these words. Thanks Arcadian for the other words. Please add more words if you know them. Thanks! ---Dana 01:40, 9 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

No, please do not add anymore WP:LISTCRUFT. -- Ssilvers 20:13, 19 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Catergunes

Can we have a section devoted to this word? I love it. I think I spelled it correctly, but either way, I can't find any information on it anywhere (though I suppose that's the nature of the word and why they chose it). It has to be somewhere, and if it's not, it has to be on Wikipedia. ---Dana 13:34, 11 April 2006 (UTC) Edit by someone else: it's Catterjunes. It's in the Urban Dictionary. there are two more spellings of this word: Catterjoons and Katterjoons. In the show all spellings are accepted(this word is meant to keep a speller in the show) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:387:1:805:0:0:0:AB (talk) 17:41, 11 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I saw the show in SF 20 May 2006. A bright young girl wowed the crowd by "correctly" spelling this and another difficult word, before missing xerophthalmia. Unfortunately, the first word was wanigan (alternately "wannigan"), but she spelled it "whannegan"; and the second she spelled "catterjune", which I suspect is not a word at all. I'm rather disappointed that the show violates the sanctity of the bee in order to play with the volunteer and the audience (but that may just be because I misspelled gardyloo--though my spelling "gardeloo" is given as an alternative on some sites). Pim 05:09, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I saw this show yesterday in Boston. The last audience speller spelled the word in question as "caterjune" (one T). I can't find any spelling of it anywhere on the Internet (and this page (search it) says "Caterjune(s) is not a real word and is always "correct." The cast is directed to semi-break character and act flustered when the participant gets it right." It also claims "Xerophalmeology is the ultra-elimination word for the volunteers. Occasionally Panch will refuse to give the speller a definition and/or use it in a sentence." which sounds like the way I remember it. -- Plutor ^talk 21:06, 10

Seriously, get real. It's a made-up word for the show. When I saw it the kid from the audience (a boy in this case) spelled it "correctly" as caterjune. Then the next word he got was xerosomethigorother. The vice principle cut him off after the first couple of letters. This is all scripted. The kid is always the last of the of the three of four audience members left and always gets caterjune, a made-up word, and always is credited with getting it right no matter how the kid spells it. Then gets the long word xeroas;dlkasdf or zeroxasfaasldkfn and is always cut off short told it's wrong. This is scripted folks! Really. It's amazing how many people don't figure this out and think the kid just figured out how to spell an extinct word that has no meaning or derivation, until Panch is forced to say it was something to do with Nantucket whaling if I recall correctly. If you doubt me, google "caterjune" and you'll get a slew of stories of the smart little audience kid who went to see "Bee" and spelled the obscure word correctly and impressed the cast. Crunch 01:55, 29 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Word?

Once again, how do we delete sections, this is not helpful at all.

I'm not sure about this. I know that the word I put down was spelled incorrectly, and that Xerophthalmia is a real word, but the word used ended with "ology", and the person got out because the word did not start with an "x". I am sure of this. -AtionSong 20:42, 3 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Casey Wollen?

The "Trivia" section needs to be changed, but I am not sure of the best way to do so. Currently, only the first statement has any relevance since the second has already been stated, and the third appears to be simply unnecessary. The entire section seems to have been added by Kiwiboy1221. Thoughts? Rctbone 23:12, 18 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, trivia violates the WP:MOS. See WP:TRIVIA. -- Ssilvers 20:15, 19 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Balmacaan

What? Balmacaan not a real word? Haven't they ever heard of a balmacaan suit?

This is not a word in the script it is a word may have been added in the spot of Catterjunes. Can we delete this section?

The word "balmacon," or whatever it is in the script, is not a real word, much like caterjunes. The definition given is something like "unknown. It is an old cowboy term," and the audience member can spell it however they want. Lissakw (talk) 07:51, 27 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Strike outs for passed dates

I see that someone has added strike throughs for dates that have passed in the tour. I understand the logic of this but I think strike throughs connote a cancellation, rather than a completed performace. Can we just assume that people will understand the current date and be intelligent enough to know which dates are in the past and which are in the future in relation to the current date? I suggest remove the strikethroughs. Crunch 01:57, 29 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I agree. However, at some point, the entire section will become non-notable. Maybe in a year or two, and all that really will need to be said is that there was a 30-city national tour (or whatever) in 2006-07, starring (list notable names here). -- Ssilvers 17:08, 12 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

endless list of casts and replacement casts

I am looking for a little feedback before I go pruning lists. I think this article has too many lists and not enough prose. I question the notability of the performers who were understudys in the other casts. It is becoming the standard in the musicals articles to only really list the most notable casts (New York, Londond etc.) and then to have a separate section discussing the other productions. Broadwaygal 17:50, 12 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

For goodness sake, yes. The notable cast members (those with Wikipedia articles) should be mentioned in the narrative paragraphs about that production. Other than that, only the Broadway cast should be listified (and the understudies eliminated), and the replacement history doesn't need to scream with bold letters. -- Ssilvers 17:06, 12 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Songlist

Which characters sing which songs. Can we add this info to the list of musical numbers? -- Ssilvers 14:16, 13 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

It turns out I have a pdf of the score. I tried to add some of the names. Most of the songs are by the whole company with a few solos...is it worth writing company over and over again???Thanks - Broadwaygal 14:40, 13 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

IBDB had a complete list, except it was missing one of the numbers listed on the album, so I added the info. Please check the one that says "cast album". Best regards, -- Ssilvers 14:56, 13 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The "Cast Album" number is not listed in the score and I was unable to find it. I don't have the cast album so I can't speak to which character performs the song --Broadwaygal 15:10, 13 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Character descriptions

I would put the old, longer character descriptions back in. Since Spelling Bee doesn't really have a plot (so there is no plot summary), the least we can do for the reader is give them some more description of the characters, no? Best regards, -- Ssilvers 21:07, 13 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Makes total sense actually...any ideas about the formatting? Thanks Broadwaygal 21:09, 13 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Format-wise, I'd just restore what was there just before your edit. I had already made some minor edits on it, and I was basically satisfied with it, although you may want to go through it to see if you like the tone. It was, perhaps, a little too informal, but I thought it was fairly descriptive. -- Ssilvers 21:16, 13 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Formatting of words used sections

Ssilvers, I don't know... I think the words used section was better as a formatted list. Because many of the words have comments after them, it all kind of runs together and is highly unreadable/unscanable. I think we should discuss this here and come to some sort of consensus on how the list of words should look. Valley2city 01:01, 14 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Hello. I think the list of words should be deleted. It's trivial and does not add to a reader's understanding of the show. Maybe a few examples of words used could be worked into the narrative some place. But embedding a lengthy, formatted list of words that takes up pages on a print-out does not conform with the Wikipedia manual of style (WP:MOS). See WP:EMBED. Best regards, -- Ssilvers 02:50, 14 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Broadwaygal, thanks for beginning the process of cutting that trivia down. -- Ssilvers 17:54, 15 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

You are very welcome! I think that it's best to just hit a few of the most interesting highlight words. --Broadwaygal 18:02, 15 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I think the additional pruning looks great! I feel that just a smattering of examples to give readers the flavor of the show is much more effective. Thanks! Broadwaygal 18:20, 15 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Now, let's get back to the cast lists. First, the Chicago list could be in two columns. Then, the Broadway lists need to be tabularized or consolidated somehow. -- Ssilvers 18:48, 15 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I would work on this today, except they're all gone... Broadwaygal 12:53, 20 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, I think we should bring them back in some form or another. I don't think they should be deleted entirelyValley2city 07:02, 22 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry to disagree, but it is a wonderful thing that MusicMaker deleted all that WP:LISTCRUFT. If there are notable actors who have appeared in this musical, their names should be listed in the discussions of the various Productions. I did not have the heart to delete them, but they definitely violate the Article Structure guidelines at WP:MUSICALS. Best regards, -- Ssilvers 13:41, 22 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with ssilvers. I was willing to work with what was there, but I think it's best to keep lists down to a minimum. Thanks--Broadwaygal 13:47, 22 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

By the way Valley (and everyone), what this article needs is a "plot" synopsis. I know, I know, there's not much plot, but there is some. The characters introduce themselves... four of them look particularly nervous... Olive's mom is at an Ashram and her dad is late... William's technique is to write the word on the floor with his show, etc. If we added just a couple of paragraphs about the sequence of events in this musical, we could upgrade the Article Assessment to B-class, because the rest of the article is looking pretty good. Is there a source we could cite for the plot synopsis? Does anyone have a script? See the Article Structure guidelines at WP:MUSICALS -- Ssilvers 14:23, 22 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

no intermission?

I don't know if that is necessarily true. I've seen the play twice, once on Broadway and once in Los Angeles. We didn't have an intermission in LA but I seem to remember that there was an intermission in the Broadway production, picking up the second act with "My Unfortunate Erection". Correct me if I am wrong. Valley2city 17:47, 28 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I just saw the show a couple of weeks ago on Broadway, and there was no intermission. Broadwaygal 17:57, 28 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Alright, perhaps they have removed the intermission in the past 13 months since I saw it in New York. It's a short enough play that it doesn't really need it, anyway. Besides, with the chance of catching a candy bar or two a moment later, what's the point in having a concessions stand open at that moment? Well, it's unbeknownst to 99% of the theatergoers, so that doesn't really matter. "Oreos! M&Ms! All for one dollar!" Oh the irony when you would go into the lobby and buy one for $4.50 when you can get it for free a few seconds later... Valley2city 18:22, 28 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Drowsy Chaperone definitely has an intermission. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.45.5.66 (talk) 02:13, 29 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I usually don't post, but just to clarify, all professional productions of Spelling Bee do not have an intermission. And The Drowsy Chaperone doesn't have one either, but I don't know why that was mentioned here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.205.169.20 (talk) 06:42, 1 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I have seen the show twice. The first time was in May of 2007 at the Fox Theater in St. Louis, MO and there was no intermission. I saw a touring version of it again this past weekend in Springfield, MO and, much to my surprise, there WAS an intermission. This was a PG version of the show (nearly all of the profanity was removed, as was "My Unfortunate Erection"), so they might have included the intermission to allow the potentially younger audience relief from sitting still for so long. I'm really not sure the reason, but I thought it should be noted that a professional version of the show did include an intermission. Tuskany (talk) 22:08, 26 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Redundant template

I think the new template at the bottom of the page is just redundant information. I think it should be deleted. Comments? -- Ssilvers 02:24, 25 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Locations of Shows

I would just like to say that there was a show in January 2008 of this musical in Toronto, and i am not able to edit the portion of the article that says the location of the shows. --Nksilk (talk) 22:08, 6 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

POV (in-the-round)

"The first performance in-the-round was at the North Shore Music Theater in Beverly, Massachusetts. This performance was considered successful and the circular theater adds a new dimension to an already amusing musical".

This seems like it could be notable, but it sounds a little biased. Anyone have any ideas how to fix the second sentence to make it more neutral or otherwise provide a citation for this? Valley2city 23:45, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Synopsis

The article is still missing a plot summary. Some of the stuff in the characters section should go in the plot summary. -- Ssilvers (talk) 02:04, 19 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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