Talk:Túpac Amaru

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WikiProject Biography Summer 2007 Assessment Drive

Nearly a B.

The article may be improved by following the WikiProject Biography 11 easy steps to producing at least a B article. -- Yamara 03:09, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Túpac Amaru II

José Gabriel Condorcanqui (Túpac Amaru II) was the great-great-great-grandson of Túpac Amaru. Because the term great-great-great-grandson is awkward, I changed it to "a decendant"

for more on the lineage, please refer to the following:

family tree from the Spanish wikipedia

page 209 of the book Shadows of Empire: the Indian Nobility of Cusco, 1750-1825 by David T. Garrett, accessible via google books here

also the following websites 123

Ianm1121 (talk) 03:07, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

Discussion

This article was moved to "Tupaq Amaru"; I moved it back because nearly all links and the article itself used "Túpac". Getting statistics on the most common spelling is difficult since Google hits for Tupac Shakur interfere, but even so "Tupaq" gets only 888 hits compared to 114,000 for "'tupac amaru' -shakur", suggesting "Túpac" is indeed the most common name. JRM · Talk 09:38, 14 August 2005 (UTC)

good move :) --Dynamax 21:55, 14 August 2005 (UTC)

Both spellings are "correct." These are transcriptions of Quechua names into a European script. "Túpac" is the colonial Spanish spelling, and is the more common one because he lived during colonial Spanish times. "Tupaq" is the modern Quechua spelling. Quechua distinguishes between "k" (pronounced similar to k in English) and "q" (pronounced similarly but at the back of the throat). Spanish does not make this distinction, so both the k and the q sound end up as "c" (or "qu" before e and i -- e.g. Yupanki > Yupanqui) in Spanish transciptions. --Potosino 03:58, 19 May 2006 (UTC)

The death of Titu Cusi is recorded as occurring in 1570 on this page, but on the Titu Cusi page it says he died in 1571. Which is it? --72.140.146.246 00:56, 2 November 2005 (UTC)

It's 1571; I corrected. Llajwa 22:04, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

incorrect death...

Tupac Amaru I and Tupac Amaru II were both, in actuality, brutally drawn and quartered. With it, Toledo crushed burgeoning Inca Nationalism.

Translation of the name

The translation of the name is a bit misleading, afaik amaru is the name of an incan god, a god of wisdom, who is also a serpent

Trial and Dead

there is a lot words about trial "a couple of days later" and famous last words and everything - there is just not mentioned with one word on which DATE all this happens. Is this really totally unknown with "10,000 to 15,000 witnesses"? -- Hartmann Schedel ^Prost 01:38, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

may I get my question back into memory? thanks in advice -- Hartmann Schedel ^cheers 21:29, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

Last Words

The Sapa Inca's last words are translated in the article as:

• "Mother Earth, witness how my enemies shed my blood."

However, the actual Quechua sentence being quoted is as follows:

• "Ccollanan Pachacamac ricuy auccacunac yahuarniy hichascancuta."

This, in modern standardized Southern Quechua would be rendered as follows:

• "Qullanan Pacha Kamaq, rikuy awkakunaq yawarniy ichachkankuta."

Fluent Quechua speakers out there, kindly correct if I'm wrong, but isn't the above sentence a lot closer the following?

• "Wife of Pacha Kamaq, behold these warriors' spilling of my blood."

It's more of a question than a correction; the loose translation gets the gist of what was intended but is a little too "enhanced" for comfort. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rcgy (talk • contribs) 15:39, 7 July 2011 (UTC) I agree more or less with you. If it was to be "Mother Earth", shouldn't it be "Pachamama" instead of "Pachacamac"? Comment added by Marc. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.23.145.35 (talk) 21:58, 29 January 2012 (UTC)

citations lacking template

I applied this tag since the article has many statements that require citations. Considering the extensive bibliography, editors should have a good place to begin to reference un-sourced information. The prevailing amount of information without citations my require deleting much of the article in the future if the matter is not addressed. I welcome comments regarding this matter. Kind regards to all. Hu Nhu (talk) 23:46, 28 August 2023 (UTC)

Add this to the article

Tupac Amaru converted to Catholicism prior to his execution. (Source: The Last Days Of The Incas by Kim Macquarrie)

• pp 373-374 "A gathering of Spanish priests who spoke runasimi, meanwhile, did their best to convince Tupac Amaru to convert to Christianity, no doubt hoping that the emperor would choose to save himself spiritually, even if it proved impossible to do so physically. The twenty-nine-year-old emperor, who had done his best to strengthen the Inca religion in Vilcabamba during his brief, sixteen-month reign, eventually agreed to convert. A strong motivation for doing so was no doubt the fact that he had been informed that a trial was being conducted against him, a trial in which his very life hung in the balance. Tupac Amaru was being accused, basically, of having been the ruler of a rebel state that had launched raids upon Spanish-controlled Peru, and also of having allowed heathen religious practices to be tolerated within his kingdom. The raids, of course, had been launched not by Tupac Amaru, but by his older brother Titu Cusi, and by his father, Manco Inca. Both of those emperors had done so only after the Spaniards had attacked and occupied Tawantinsuyu, which, from the Incas’ point of view, the Spaniards had no right to rule. The “heathen religious practices” the emperor was accused of were likewise part of the Incas’ own native religion, one that they had practiced since time immemorial and long before the arrival of the Spaniards. Tupac Amaru himself was neither conversant in the Spanish language nor familiar with Spanish jurisprudence, nor did he have any legal counsel to defend him. His trial therefore was the sixteenth-century equivalent of a kangaroo court. Even if the Inca emperor had been supplied with the finest legal representation from Spain, however, and even had such representation argued that the Spaniards had no legal right to invade the Inca Empire, it is unlikely that the results would have been different. The prosecution, no doubt, would have argued that God himself had given the pope the right to assign Tawantinsuyu to the king and queen of Spain, and that the Spaniards were thus simply carrying out God’s will. For the Incas of Vilcabamba to resist such a commandment was therefore both blasphemy and treason, and were actions that were obviously contrary to God’s will. Besides, even though Tupac Amaru was now converting to Christianity, he had nevertheless been the spiritual leader of a pagan religion, one that had worshipped false idols and that in fact had worshipped Tupac Amaru as a false god himself."
• " pp. 376-378 "Standing alongside his executioner—who was an ethnic Cañari and thus an enemy of the Incas—and with a black-robed priest at his side, Tupac Amaru looked out over the vast multitude and slowly raised his right hand. He then “let it fall. With a lordly mind he alone remained calm, and all the noise was followed by a silence so profound that no living soul moved, either among those who were in the square or among those at a distance.” Then, when all had become silent and everyone on the square strained to see the last legitimate heir of the four suyus and to hear what he might say, Tupac Amaru, the Royal Serpent, addressed the crowd:

 “Lords, you are [gathered] here from all the four suyus. Let it be known that I am a Christian and they have baptized me and I wish to die under the law of God—and I have to die. And that everything that my ancestors the Incas and I have told you up till now—that you should worship the sun god, Punchao, and the shrines, idols, stones, rivers, mountains, and sacred things—is a lie and completely false. When we used to tell you that we were entering [a temple] to speak to the sun, and that it told you to do what we said and that it spoke—this … [was] a lie. Because it did not speak rather we did, for it is an object of gold and cannot speak. And my brother Titu Cusi told me that whenever I wished to tell the Indians [to do] something, that I should enter alone into the [sun temple of] Punchao and that no one was to enter with me … and that afterwards I should come out and tell the Indians that it had spoken to me, and that it had said whatever I wanted to tell them, because the Indians perform better what they have been commanded to do and … [they better obey what] they venerate—and [the god they most venerated] was the [sun god].”
 … And … Tupac Amaru … [asked the crowd] to forgive him for having deceived them until now, and to pray to God for him. [And] all of this he said … with [great] royal authority and majesty, neither contrived nor artificial but very natural … despite his being a prisoner and in this predicament. After delivering this surprising speech, spoken in runasimi so that few Spaniards other than a handful of priests understood it, and which no doubt stunned his native listeners, The Inca then received consolation from the Fathers who were at his side and, taking leave of all, he put his head on the block, like a lamb. The executioner then came forward and, taking the hair in his left hand, he severed the head with a knife at one blow, and held it on high for all to see. As the head was severed the bells of the cathedral began to ring, and were followed by those of all the monasteries and parish churches in the city. The execution caused the greatest sorrow and brought tears to all eyes. Thus on September 24, 1572, thirty-six years after Manco Inca had launched his great rebellion, the last Inca emperor—Tupac Amaru—lived no more."

103.98.78.156 (talk) 17:52, 29 September 2023 (UTC)