Talk:Suleiman of Dulkadir

Suleiman of Dulkadir is currently a Royalty, nobility and heraldry good article nominee. Nominated by Aintabli (talk) at 02:57, 15 February 2024 (UTC)

An editor has placed this article on hold to allow improvements to be made to satisfy the good article criteria. Recommendations have been left on the review page, and editors have seven days to address these issues. Improvements made in this period will influence the reviewer's decision whether or not to list the article as a good article.

Short description: Beg of the Dulkadir from 1442 to 1454

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GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Suleiman of Dulkadir/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: Aintabli (talk · contribs) 02:57, 15 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Reviewer: Cplakidas (talk · contribs) 11:35, 8 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Will take this on hopefully within the next few days/week. Constantine ✍ 11:35, 8 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)

It is reasonably well written.
a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):
It is factually accurate and verifiable, as shown by a source spot-check.
a (reference section): b (inline citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism):
It is broad in its coverage.
a (major aspects): b (focused):
It follows the neutral point of view policy.
Fair representation without bias:
It is stable.
No edit wars, etc.:
It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.
a (images are tagged and non-free content have non-free use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
Overall:
Pass/Fail:

Lede

Can you localize Dulkadir and give some context? E.g. '...Dulkadir, a Turkoman principality in southeastern Anatolia,...'
Done
wali should be placed in appropriate transliteration template
Done
regnant Mamluk Sultan is there a reason for the 'regnant' distinction?
Could be, but I don't remember anymore. Removed.
It would be useful to clarify that the Ottoman and Mamluk sultans represented the two major powers of the region, which Dulkadir found itself sandwiched between
Done
Clarify his relationship to the Aq Qoyunlu
Done Aintabli (talk) 15:32, 9 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Early life and background

Parallel to his father's support for parallel to or as a result of?
"As a result of" works.
Give some context on who Mehmed Chelebi and Musa Chelebi were (i.e. brothers and rival contenders for the throne)
Done
ridden by internal struggles somewhat idiomatic
Changed ridden by to invested in Aintabli (talk) 05:02, 13 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
As in the lede, it would help clarify Dulkadir's relations to all these states, and especially the Ottomans and Mamluks; we see them involved in the Ottoman civil war and in the next sentence fighting for the Mamluks. Were they independent, allied to, vassals?
Created background section, which explains that the Dulkadirids started as a client state of the Mamluks, and later rulers were allied with the Ottomans. Aintabli (talk) 22:45, 16 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Reign

He was fairly experienced when he ascended to the throne after his father's death in October 1442. suggest moving this to the start of the section, to bridge the gap with the last chronological mention.
Done Aintabli (talk) 22:45, 16 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
against the Karamanids and the Qara Qoyunlu Who were the Qara Qoyunlu and why were they a threat?
Introduced both.
Link Halil Pasha to Çandarlı Halil Pasha the Younger
Done
wali, kadi, ulama etc should be in the appropriate transliteration template
Done Sorry for making you repeatedly point this out. Aintabli (talk) 04:45, 22 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Following their struggle with Jahangir, the leader of the Aq Qoyunlu, from the placement of the qualifier it is not immediately clear who was the leader of the Aq Qoyunlu. Also provide regnal dates and a time for this struggle and the reason/more details ('struggle' is way too generic). E.g. "In YYYY, Kasim Beg, uncle of the Aq Qoyunlu ruler Jahangir (r. YYYY-YYYY), conspired against his nephew (or whatever the context was). After the failure of...."
Reworded, added by 1450 as the chronological marker, added regnal interval for Jahangir and Jahan Shah.
Introduce Uzun Hasan and his relationship with Jahangir
Done
decree every Syrian Mamluk governor to help Suleiman, his father-in-law either 'order every Syrian Mamluk governor to help Suleiman' or 'decree that every Syrian Mamluk governor help Suleiman'. You can decree an order, but not a person. TO help avoid confusion, I also suggest 'his father-in-law Suleiman'.
Chose the second option.
wage war in Ray, Iran why was that important? Most readers won't know how/why this affected the Qara Qoyunlu
Removed.
30-thousand-strong per MOS, either 'thirty-thousand-strong' or '30,000-strong'
Fixed.

Overall the article, though short, looks good. Though I am not an expert it appears comprehensive and relies on good sources. Constantine ✍ 12:23, 5 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Cplakidas: Apologies once again for the delay. Please let me know if I haven't adequately addressed some of the points or if more improvements need to be made. I am grateful that you are taking the time to review my nomination. Aintabli (talk) 04:31, 30 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]