Talk:South Sudan People's Defence Forces

Army or armed forces?

Is the SPLA the ground forces (like the U.S. Army) of South Sudan, or a unified armed forces (like the Chinese PLA)? Illegitimate Barrister (talk) 06:48, 29 April 2013 (UTC)

Whatever they are, we ought to go with what the Constitution of South Sudan says about forming the Armed Forces for the country. -- 92.13.92.68 (talk) 20:28, 9 May 2013 (UTC)

The distinction between different branches of the military is quite secondary in South Sudan. There is a SPLA airforce, which I suppose is under the command of the SPLA. There is clearly no South Sudanese navy. There is also clearly no linkage between the wording in the constitution and the reality on the ground. The SPLA remains the SPLA, period. --Soman (talk) 02:12, 10 May 2013 (UTC)

• SPLA Lt-Gen. Johnson Gony Biliu, the commander of the army’s 7th Division in contested Upper Nile State, says that the army should fight to defend national sovereignty and the national constitution, not join in ethnic violence. Forces under the command of Biliu, a Nuer, helped drive out defectors and armed civilians who took over parts of Malakal last week. The following remarks by the commander were recorded by Radio Tamazuj on Tuesday, 31 December 2013. Gen. Johnson Gony Biliu: This is not the first time for such an incident to occur in Upper Nile. What I can say is that all those issues are created by the politicians, they are the ones who dragged the citizens to fight. They were the ones calling people on phones and said that there is a problem between Dinka and Nuer. I, as the head of Military Sector 2, can't drag myself into the issue just because I am from Nuer tribe . https://radiotamazuj.org/en/article/interview-%E2%80%98army-should-defend-constitution%E2%80%99

HSBA SIB 18, 'Armed Insurgencies in Greater Upper Nile' says division HQ is in the riverside town of Owachi.

• 6th Division (spread across a number of states as they were the former SPLA Joint Integrated Unit formation) - Rands and LeRiche, Security responses in Jonglei State in

the aftermath of inter-ethnic violence

Name Change

On Monday, 15 May, 2017, South Sudan's President Salva Kiir Mayardit issued several decrees that restructured South Sudan's army. Among the changes was the renaming of the army, from the "Sudan People’s Liberation Army (SPLA)" to the "South Sudan Defense Force (SSDF)." If this name change remains in force, this article will need some revision and a disambiguation from the South Sudan Defence Forces, which shares an acronym. Mr leroy playpus (talk) 11:19, 16 May 2017 (UTC)

I think that it is premature to change the lead of the article. Ateny Wek Ateny, press secretary to South Sudan President Salva Kiir, has said that the orders have been misinterpreted: "The real thing is that the SPLA still remain SPLA. If the change happens, it will happen in the future, not now." It might be better to move this particular event to a subsection, since the new name has not got much traction.

Also, the lead is kind of a mess right now. If it's going to stay, it should at least look something like this:

The South Sudanese Armed Forces (SSAF) or The South Sudan Defence Forces (SSDF), are military forces of Republic of South Sudan, formerly known as the Sudanese People's Liberation Army (SPLA). On May 16, 2017, the thirty-fourth anniversary of the SPLA's foundation, the South Sudanese President Salva Kiir Mayardit renamed the army from Sudan People's Liberation Army (SPLA) to South Sudan Defence Forces. The name change had been recommended in the Agreement on the Resolution of Conflict in the Republic of South Sudan of August 2015.

Mr leroy playpus (talk) 20:02, 8 June 2017 (UTC)

There was a similar discussion a few years back, regarding a wording in the SS Constitution. I'd say that just a declaration isn't enough, we'd need to see whether the change is actually implemented before renaming the article. --Soman (talk) 20:59, 12 October 2017 (UTC)

Notably, it appears the name change has still not taken place. In the only 2018 news piece I found it still says "In August, however, it was reported that the new name would be South Sudan People’s Defense Forces (SSPDF)." http://www.sudantribune.com/spip.php?article64550 There are numerous 2018 sources that indicate that the name is still SPLA: https://reliefweb.int/report/south-sudan/unmiss-supports-training-child-free-spla , https://www.voanews.com/a/south-sudan-cease-fire/4210001.html , https://www.irinnews.org/analysis/2018/04/12/who-s-who-south-sudan-s-splintering-civil-war , https://www.standardmedia.co.ke/article/2001277615/south-sudan-s-head-of-army-james-ajongo-is-dead --Soman (talk) 19:34, 1 August 2018 (UTC)

Various military details

See South Sudan: The Notable Firsts By Kuyok Abol Kuyok Buckshot06 (talk) 22:55, 3 May 2019 (UTC)

References

Split

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Currently, the article is confusing and misleading to the reader as there are two matters mentioned:

1. Sudan People's Liberation Army (SPLA): rebel group that operated in southern Sudan during the Second Sudanese Civil War;

2. South Sudan People's Defence Forces / South Sudanese Armed Forces: the Armed Forces of the Republic of South Sudan, independent country since 2011.

The article is saying in its infobox that the armed forces were founded in 1983 when Republic of South Sudan didn't even exist. That is why, I propose to split the article in two: an article for the rebel group (Sudan People's Liberation Army) and another for the Armed Forces (South Sudan People's Defence Forces).--Fontaine347 (talk) 16:09, 1 August 2021 (UTC)

• Oppose - based on the fact that it says (my bold) "Following South Sudan's independence in 2011, Kiir became President and the SPLA became the new republic's regular army. In May 2017 there was a restructure and the SPLA took on the name of South Sudan Defence Forces (SSDF), with another change in September 2018 to South Sudan People's Defence Forces." So the name, and presumably many of the people and structure, were continuous before and after independence - the name only changed in 2017, as far as I can see. Laterthanyouthink (talk) 02:42, 3 August 2021 (UTC)

Currently "Sudan People's Liberation Army" is a redirect to "South Sudan People's Defence Forces". Describing a rebel group / guerrilla organization within the article of a regular army from an independent country seems to be nonsensical.--Fontaine347 (talk) 21:57, 9 August 2021 (UTC)

• Oppose - it's a misconception from outsiders that the SPLA rebel army would have been substituted by a regular state military force once independence was achieved. That's precisely what didn't happen. SPLA continued after 2011, and the name-change SPLA-SSPDF was merely cosmetic. --Soman (talk) 22:31, 9 August 2021 (UTC)
• Oppose same. --Panam2014 (talk) 17:04, 6 November 2021 (UTC)
• Partial Oppose - we should follow precedence of other similar wikipedia articles where a rebel group becomes the de jure military.Degen Earthfast (talk) 21:29, 21 December 2021 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.