Talk:Sarah Avraham

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A fact from Sarah Avraham appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 12 April 2014 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that Indian-born Israeli Sarah Avraham converted to Judaism and moved to Israel after the 2008 Mumbai attacks, and became a Kickboxing World Champion?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2014/April. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Sarah Avraham.

Wikipedia

References

Not sure why this has become such an issue, but the claim that "nothing [is] wrong with initial ref format" is incorrect. This formatting fails in mobile view and is awkward for non-standard monitor sizes. These are some of the reasons that forcing a number of columns is now deprecated in favour of the more flexible technique of setting column width. See the documentation for {{reflist}}. Do you have an actual reason for forcing that format—other than the fact that you added it yesterday ("previously")? Nikkimaria (talk) 03:38, 12 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I'm amazed that it has popped up as an issue on a page I just created, directly following our conversation here, and that your edit summaries have been so deficient ... especially after and given that I engaged you with substantive ones. We allow the format that I used. It is preferable on my screen. Your format makes it one column; the pre-existing format makes it two columns, which is easier to read. It may well not be better on your screen. This is the same as date formats, where two are acceptable. To avoid idotic reverting sequences, we defer to the initial format. We don't say "Nikki likes another format, which has not been mandated, so we will just defer to Nikki, even though there is a pre-existing format." If you want to have it mandated as the preferred format, go ahead and seek to make that change. The change you would like in what is mandated has not been made, nor do I feel it should be made.Epeefleche (talk) 03:44, 12 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I'm amazed at your failure to AGF; surely in your review you would have noted that I frequently make formatting corrections to DYKs? I would also encourage you to read the comments you are responding to more carefully. As I said above, column width is already mandated as the preferred format; my initial edit summary referred to the documentation stating this as an explanation for the change. It's got nothing to do with what I like. Nikkimaria (talk) 13:59, 12 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Will get back to you on this, but it may take me a day or two.Epeefleche (talk) 18:23, 12 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

"the" champion?

Category:Muay Thai organizations lists no fewer than five bodies issuing world titles in Muay Thai. I think the tournament Avraham competed in was this one, organised by a group called the World Muaythai Federation, which does not have a Wikipedia article, and seems less important than the International Federation of Muaythai Amateur. I have found very little on the internet about the 2014 event, other than articles about Avraham; maybe non-English sources have more. jnestorius^(talk) 18:01, 12 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I will see if I can find anything more. At this point, though, our remit is to reflect the RSs. What they state is what we mirror. Going beyond that, within the article, would have us venturing into wp:OR (the same goes for a marring tag based on OR -- as long as the article properly reflects the RSs, we have the appropriate clarification for wp purposes).--Epeefleche (talk) 18:23, 12 April 2014 (UTC)--Epeefleche (talk) 18:23, 12 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Reliability is not all-or-nothing (and if it is, there are quite a few of the sources I would put in the nothing column). As an example of discernment: the ceremony I've cited from Youtube suggests she came second at the championship, but given the muddled nature of the proceedings I'll trust the news reports over the ring announcers. OTOH it's not OR to recognise that the author of a "local person wins prize" story may not have a grasp of all the details. jnestorius^(talk) 19:43, 12 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

We have a number of RSs here; RSs do trump non-RS youtube videos. As well as OR. I'll stick with Yahoo and the other RS refs. And yes, it is unfortunately(?) OR to say: "I know the RS refs all say x, but I believe it is wrong, based on my personal knowledge and on non-RS youtube videos". See wp:RS and wp:OR.--Epeefleche (talk) 22:49, 12 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

The Youtube video is a WP:PRIMARYSOURCE, not OR, and is used in conformance with that policy. It does not contradict the "reliable" sources, it supplements them with the name of the organisation (WMF) and the flavor (pro-am) of the title. The "reliable" sources are silent on these points. jnestorius^(talk) 11:23, 13 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

The do conflict -- the weight class designation range in the RSs differ from what you inserted. Furthermore, RS secondary sources are preferred over primary sources -- as what you just linked to states: "Wikipedia articles should be based on reliable, published secondary sources and, to a lesser extent, on tertiary sources and primary sources.". Epeefleche (talk) 17:21, 13 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

"57 kg" does not conflict with "57 to 63.5 kg", but I agree the latter is better and have edited accordingly. ({{convert}} doesn't seem to support rounding to 0.5 of a unit.) jnestorius^(talk) 12:42, 15 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Verifying Biography Information

It has come to attention that the sources used for Avraham's background are solely from a right wing Jewish websites stemming from an article by blogger Asher Zeiger. The article particularity glorifies that she is an "Ex-Hindu". It makes a direct point to highlight she converted. However, this piece was meet with a very heavy response in the comment's section with readers from Avraham's own Kibbutz stating she was never raised Hindu.

And by Avraham's own admission in quotes, she grew up with Jewish beliefs because of her father's alignment to Judaism. None of the sources mention her father as a practicing Hindu. Because of this, I propose amending this description of the father and maintaining that he is Indian, ofcourse, along with Avraham's mother.

There is often a common assumption that everyone Indian is a Hindu. Unlike Judaism, Hinduism is not an ethnicity, so if the father never practiced Hinduism, as his affinity to Judaism shows, it would be libel to call him a Hindu.

I would appreciate if someone could bring up more balanced sources that instead don't propagandize her conversion to Judaism. As of yet, there is not validation of her being an "Ex-Hindu" from any other sources outside of Jewish sources and they do not even quote Avraham. This is especially important for WP:NPOV and WP:V. — Preceding unsigned comment added by HACKER HEADSHOT (talk • contribs) 00:22, 28 July 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Former name

What was her former name before conversion? --Error (talk) 23:58, 4 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]