Talk:Benkei

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Benkei article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Biography: Military

	Biography portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography articles
	This article is supported by the military biography work group (assessed as Low-importance).

Military history: Biography / Asian / Japanese / Medieval

This article is within the scope of the Military history WikiProject. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks. To use this banner, please see the full instructions.Military historyWikipedia:WikiProject Military historyTemplate:WikiProject Military historymilitary history articles

This article has been checked against the following criteria for B-class status:
Referencing and citation: criterion not met Coverage and accuracy: criterion met Structure: criterion not met Grammar and style: criterion met Supporting materials: criterion met

Associated task forces:
/
	Military biography task force
	Asian military history task force
	Japanese military history task force
	Medieval warfare task force (c. 500 – c. 1500)

Japan: Biography / Military history / Mythology / Religion High‑importance

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Japan, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Japan-related articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project, participate in relevant discussions, and see lists of open tasks. Current time in Japan: 17:10, November 17, 2024 (JST, Reiwa 6) (Refresh)JapanWikipedia:WikiProject JapanTemplate:WikiProject JapanJapan-related articles

High

This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

This article is supported by the Biography task force.

This article is supported by the joint Japanese military history task force.

This article is supported by the Mythology task force.

This article is supported by the Religion task force.

WikiProject Japan to do list:

Peer review: None
A-class review: None

Featured content candidates –

Articles: None
Pictures: None
Lists: None

Good article nominations: Vinland Saga (TV series), Godzilla Minus One
Add requested images to articles that need them.
Pages for Deletion: Participate in Japan-related deletion discussions.
Improve and expand Japan-related stubs.
Create some requested articles.
Help translate an article from the Japanese Wikipedia into English.
Assess unassessed articles

Buddhism C‑class Low‑importance

	This article falls within the scope of WikiProject Buddhism, an attempt to promote better coordination, content distribution, and cross-referencing between pages dealing with Buddhism. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page for more details on the projects.BuddhismWikipedia:WikiProject BuddhismTemplate:WikiProject BuddhismBuddhism articles
C	This article has been given a rating which conflicts with the project-independent quality rating in the banner shell. Please resolve this conflict if possible.
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Mythology C‑class

	Mythology portal This article is supported by WikiProject Mythology. This project provides a central approach to Mythology-related subjects on Wikipedia. Please participate by editing the article, and help us assess and improve articles to good and 1.0 standards, or visit the WikiProject page for more details.MythologyWikipedia:WikiProject MythologyTemplate:WikiProject MythologyMythology articles
C	This article has been given a rating which conflicts with the project-independent quality rating in the banner shell. Please resolve this conflict if possible.
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

Fictional mentions and inspiration

Benkei probably served as one of the inspirations for Jebu in Robert Shea's Shike books. Trying to think how to word this before I add it to the article. --131.207.161.152 14:05, 26 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Take all the mentions of Benkei and stick it in a new section, list-style, and label it "Benkei in fiction", or something like that. --maru (talk) contribs 16:51, 26 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Representations of character

I'm hoping someone knowledgeable in drama and fiction happens to be watching this page... I'm curious about the way Benkei is represented in different tales. In Kanjincho, and a number of other places, he is seen as being quite clever, calm, and reserved. However, in Yoshitsune Senbon Zakura, he is impetuous, violent, and not particularly observant, or it would seem cognizant, of the kinds of observances he, as a Buddhist monk, particularly one from Enryakuji, ought to be following. Any thoughts? Thanks. LordAmeth 20:31, 10 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Saito

Where does "Saito" (西塔) come from? It's not mentioned at all in the Japanese article. I'm curious about the source of this part of the name. ···日本穣^{? · Talk to Nihonjoe} 01:26, 12 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Just from looking at google there are about 100 000 hits for '武蔵坊弁慶' and 228 for '西塔武蔵坊弁慶' (several of these pages' main language not being Japanese, and so probably influenced by Wikipedia). While there's some Japanese evidence he was sometimes known as Saito Musashibo Benkei, it doesn't seem like this is how he's generally known.

--Rsm77 (talk) 19:40, 29 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I regret that I don't have any overly definitive sources on me right now, but Saitô Musashibô Benkei is absolutely a very common name for him, indeed, as far as I am aware, the most common name when one is not abbreviating to simply Benkei. Which kanji are used to write it, I have no idea. LordAmeth (talk) 23:30, 29 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

He was called Musashibou Benkei (武藏房辨慶) or Benkei Houshi (辨慶法師) in Azuma Kagami (吾妻鏡). There are three occurrences of Saitou no Musashibou Benkei (西塔の武蔵坊弁慶) in Gikeiki (義経記). Saitou (西塔) probably refers to the West Pagoda of Enryaku-ji (延暦寺). Viking Rollo (talk) 04:54, 22 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Wouldn't it be appropriate to change the title of this article to "Benkei"? This is already done by Encyclopedia Britannica [1]. It sounds like he is most commonly referred to by just this name, so much so that if we wish to use a longer name it becomes ambiguous what that name should be (three plausible suggestions were just given by Viking Rollo, and none of those corresponds exactly with the current title, which omits the "no" particle). It also seems that "Benkei" is perfectly unambiguous in Japan and elsewhere. The big statue of him in Kii Tanabe has simply "Benkei statue" inscribed in its base; a photo of this is the main feature of the Japanese wikipedia article on this topic, which also omits at least the Saitou part from its title. All the variations can of course be explained in the lead. Cesiumfrog (talk) 07:17, 22 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I agree. The table bellow is a quick research on Gikeiki text from http://www.j-texts.com/sheet/kgikei.html Viking Rollo (talk) 11:19, 22 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

count	name	rōmaji
3	西塔の武蔵坊弁慶	Saitou no Musashibou Benkei
0	西塔武蔵坊弁慶	Saitou Musashibou Benkei
2	武蔵坊弁慶	Musashibou Benkei
74	武蔵坊	Musashibou
194	弁慶	Benkei

Since Benkei was just a redirect to this article, I've moved it to that title. I also see just "Benkei" far more often than the full name or any other abbreviation of the full name. He's listed as simply "Benkei" in several encyclopedias. ···日本穣^? · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe · Join WikiProject Japan! 15:48, 22 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

tanabe

Tanabe, Wakayama has a couple big statues (and a festival, etc) of Benkei. What's the connection, is that where he was born? Cesiumfrog (talk) 09:35, 3 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Contemp refs

Longer than the actual real part of the article, I think I am going to be sick. This is getting modified to bejesus once I get my hands on some proper refs. Man Over-bored (talk) 15:40, 16 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Nanadogu Benkei

Is there a decent ref to the Nanadogu, or is that a myth made up by the Seven Basic Tools of Quality crowd?

Hcobb (talk) 19:17, 23 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

Grupo sacerdotes.png

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. Community Tech bot (talk) 04:21, 10 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

More on career and folklore

I have renamed "Adaptations" to "In popular culture", as it better describes the content of the section. I've also divided the info according to medium for comprehensibility. The article would benefit from additional info about Benkei's career as a retainer and the events leading up to his death (something a bit more detailed than "In the end..."). Also, there are countless folk tales revolving around Benkei, but virtually none are mentioned here. Perhaps a "Folklore" section enumerating those various stories and his influence on pop culture would be appropriate. Zargabaath (talk) 09:03, 20 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]