Talk:SR Class 4Sub

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Text and/or other creative content from this version of British Rail Class 405 was copied or moved into SR Class 4Sub with this edit on 15:24, 31 October 2011. The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists.

Two articles?

Ok I don't currently understand. To quote the article:

The SR and BR (S) continued to build or else rebuild 4-car units to slightly different designs which became part of the 4-Sub Class. Many of these later examples survived in passenger use until late 1983, by which time British Rail had allocated to them TOPS Class 405.

In what way is a Class 405 not a 4-Sub by another name? Edgepedia (talk) 17:35, 14 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I raised this point elsewhere some time ago, and I think the answer was that the Class 405 article was intended to cover those units built new as 4-car (the Shebas, Marys etc.) whereas the 4-SUB article was intended to cover the augmented and reformed 3-car units, most of which didn't last beyond 1960 - the last were withdrawn in January 1962. --Redrose64 (talk) 19:59, 14 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, that is correct. I started the 4Sub article as the Class 405 article then contained a lot of material unrelated to that class (which were all the newly built sets). The story is very complex and the 'Sub' category covered several quite different multiple unit sets, so if anyone can make the situation clearer please do so.--Das48 (talk) 07:38, 15 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

1970's London Bridge to E Croydon "slows"

These were 4SUB's with the rare inclusion of the last of the corridor compartment coaches of several compartments connected with a gangway which also had toilets in the coach, surprisingly well appointed for what was all 2nd class including BR logo'd anti-macassar on the compartment seats, curtains on the outside windows and blinds as per MK1 stock on the corridor side windows and slightly plusher seat material compared to the standard lined 2nd class set coverings found in the open saloons.

These never made it to the cycling to Waterloo of the last sets and I believe were sent to Slades Green before scrapping, certainly as lampsman at Waterloo I noted the 4SUB's there were all open saloon types with the only modernisation of note being the later NSE blue seat coverings and lurid fluorescent tubes replacing the stock incandescent bulbs. The 4SUBs were fairly routinely cycled out in favour of EPB's and later on old express slam doors that were still lingering on, being removed as and when their maintenance schedules saw them requiring overhaul of any expense and thus pulled from the system to be broken up. Its interesting to note whilst many of the EPB's ended up at Bournemouth West sidings, no 4SUBs were noted being present there.

92.25.9.56 (talk) 21:07, 25 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I have never heard of a 4-SUB including a corridor coach, or even a toilet. All the books that I have read show that the cars were either non-corridor compartment or non-gangwayed saloon. What is your source? --Redrose64 🦌 (talk) 21:49, 25 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]