Talk:Rotenone

Is it still NOP approved?

Following is an extract from http://www.nysaes.cornell.edu/pp/resourceguide/mfs/11rotenone.php

Formulations and Application guidelines: Rotenone was commonly used by organic growers in the past. However, at this time (2005), no rotenone products have been reviewed for approval by OMRI. However, some formulations, such as dust or wettable powder products may be approved in the future. Dust formulations are best applied in early morning when the wind is still and dew in on the plants. Wettable powders sometimes have been difficult to spray, especially at high rates, due to large particle size.

Liquid formulations may contain piperonyl butoxide (PBO) or solvents that are prohibited under the NOP. Many liquid formulations of rotenone also contain pyrethrum. For pests that need to ingest rotenone for it to work, the pyrethrum/rotenone products would be undesirable, since the contact poison pyrethrum would reduce ingestion. Information from older studies indicates that in several cases, improved results were obtained when rotenone was sprayed with oils or soaps.

Laurels14 (talk) 15:24, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Needs more Biochemistry

This section needs to detail more information about the exact biochemical mechanism of Rotenone on Complex I. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.49.225.80 (talk) 01:16, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

Effects on Humans?! Where is the proof?

Ok, this caused me to jump a little "t causes Parkinson's disease-like symptoms if injected into rats and, intravenously, humans." Rotenone has NOT been injected in humans, and unless someone post solid evidence, I'm removing that. Observer31 (talk) 00:59, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

It did'nt kill the monster in Creature from the Black Lagoon... I guess it'd be okay for humans too. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.203.68.101 (talk) 17:31, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

Parkinsons link

I think the claim in this blog about the accuracy of the trials needs to be elaborated in this article. Particularly that "Research [linking it with Parkinson’s Disease] was largely discounted as the rats in the research had rotenone injected directly into their brains, which is not a very fair trial." Of course, this blog may not be a [{WP:RS|reliable source]] but it doesn't negate searching for sources that are. ClaretAsh 01:05, 12 February 2012 (UTC)

Rotenone Not 100% Effective

There is someone who keeps insisting Rotenone usually kills literally 100% of the fish in large bodies of water. This is not generally the case. There are MANY, MANY examples of the target species returning after a "treatment" and NOT because someone put them back in the lake or they came back in from a stream.

1. Lake Davis (two poisonings, two returns of the pike) 2. Panguitch Lake, Utah (several treatments to control Utah Chubs, each time chubs came back) 3. Strawberry Lake, Utah (trying to control chubs, chubs came back each time) 4. Lake John, Colorado (suckers came back every time) 5. Pauite Lake, Utah

There are many, many more examples too. Generally Rotenone shows a 93% - 97% kill rate in most studies. It is well known in scientific literature that it is not 100% effective. A total, permanent eradication of target species is RARE!!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.127.119.2 (talk) 22:51, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Also, the San Fran Chronicle Article cited as "proof" that Rotenone is 100% effective "proved" nothing of the sort. In fact, it was admitted that some fish probably survived. It is not a 100% kill. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.127.119.2 (talk) 22:58, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

"Generally Rotenone shows a 93% - 97% kill rate in most studies. It is well known in scientific literature that it is not 100% effective." That first sentence is exactly the sort of factual statement we need, with attendant specific cite from secondary literature. DMacks (talk) 23:06, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

MPTP discussion is off topic on this wiki?

The discussion of MPTP Section Toxicity-Parkinson's disease) is not appropriate on the Rotenone wiki. Whilst another complex I mitochondrial inhibitor, there is little reason to include this text. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.216.133.144 (talk) 20:33, 14 October 2012 (UTC)

Notable administrations criterea

Since rotenone has been used to kill fish in lakes and rivers since the 1950s, and these operations are reported with some regularity in local and regional news sources, many administrations of the chemical could be covered here. It might be beneficial to set a higher bar for inclusion in this section - national coverage, multiple supporting refs, etc.Dialectric (talk) 15:40, 24 September 2015 (UTC)

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Rotenone/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

There is a problem with the commentary "The study does not directly suggest that rotenone exposure is responsible for Parkinson's disease in humans ...". The whole point of having animal models for drug studies is that these are convenient and generalizable experimental paradigms for predicting drug actions in humans. So the experimental results in this case DO support the idea that rotenone can cause Parkinson's disease in humans - especially with the other literature that shows a probable mechanism via oxidative damage via microglia.

Last edited at 03:32, 7 August 2007 (UTC). Substituted at 04:56, 30 April 2016 (UTC)

Decline in usage due to safety concerns

In the 16 years since the original research linking rotenone to Parkinson's symptoms, many follow-up trials using low-dosages and indirect administration have confirmed this compound's neurotoxicity. In labs, it is so reliable it is used as a model to test treatments for Parkinson's disease. Human data shows farm workers in contact with rotenone have been shown to develop Parkinson's at higher rates. For these reasons, any debate over this compound's safety for dusting onto crops is historical.

In 2006, all US manufacturers of rotenone voluntarily cancelled production for all livestock, residential, and home owner uses, domestic pet uses, and all other uses except for piscicide uses. There are no allowed uses for food crops in the USA (US EPA). In 2015 the National Organic Standards Board recommended that the USDA go a step further, and list rotenone as a prohibited nonsynthetic substance by Jan 1, 2016, so that international suppliers using rotenone could no longer be labeled "organic." While this hasn't happened yet, the USDA AMS claim that "international use of rotenone in organic production is declining due to alternatives."

I wasn't able to find much about regulations outside the US, but I think the page should be updated to say that safety concerns have led to a decline in usage.

References

Toxicity to bees

Rotenone is highly toxic to honey bees - while it's not widely used, it's still IN use and it's worth mentioning that.Smidoid (talk) 11:03, 23 August 2016 (UTC)

Dead links

Links 9 and 10 are dead. I did not check others. When I click "edit" next to the links section, I get a blank page. 173.53.64.237 (talk) 13:18, 5 January 2020 (UTC)

The "References" section of many articles is a collection of links that are actually embedded in earlier parts of the article (where the footnote marker is). The § Uses section is where refs #7–15 are, so that's where I clicked "edit" to tag those URLs. Thanks for reporting it! DMacks (talk) 15:38, 5 January 2020 (UTC)

Use in Norwegian fisheries management

Rotenone continues to be used as a management tool in Norwegian freshwater fisheries to eliminate Gyrodactylus salaris infection from rivers. Usage has been growing more ambitious since first used in the 1990s with treatment of the Vefsna river system including some large lakes, and plans now to treat other large infected river systems. This is probably the largest single use of rotenone within Europe. 95.49.85.64 (talk) 11:51, 22 August 2022 (UTC)