Talk:Riboflavin/GA2

GA Review

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Reviewer: Mertbiol (talk · contribs) 18:04, 28 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I will take on this review. Here are some comments on the first half and I will add some more later. Best wishes Mertbiol (talk) 18:04, 28 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

General

Please ensure that all apostrophes are of the straight type, rather than the curved type (see MOS:APOSTROPHE).
- Done 11-29-21

Lead

I suggest changing "consumed as a dietary supplement" in the first sentence to "sold as a dietary supplement" or "taken as a dietary supplement".
- Done 11-30-21
I suggest changing "involved in the metabolism of other vitamins" in the fourth sentence to "required for the metabolism of other vitamins", to avoid repetition of "involved in".
- Done 11-30-21
I suggest changing the em-dash in the fourth sentence before "folate, vitamin B6..." to "such as" or "including" OR delete "other vitamins", so that the sentence reads "The coenzymes are also required for the metabolism of niacin, vitamin B6, and folate."
- Done 11-29-21
I am not convinced that the fourth sentence is sufficiently likely to be challenged for reference [4] to be included in the lead.
- Done 11-30-21
  - No, this was not done Reference [4] is still in the lead. Please remove it. Mertbiol (talk) 14:41, 1 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
In the final sentence of the first paragraph, I suggest replacing "used medicinally as a prescription drug" with "prescribed"
- Done 11-29-21
I suggest rewording the second sentence of the second paragraph so that it reads "Some countries require the addition of riboflavin to grains." (You need to make clear what "its" refers to.)
- Done 11-29-21
I suggest combining the third and fourth sentences of the second paragraph to read: "Riboflavin deficiency is rare and is usually treated using supplements, which may be given orally or by injection."
- Not done 11-29-21 Instead, sentences of second paragrapy re-ordered. (FYI: If by injection, would be a prescription drug, not a supplement.)
I think that your use of "well-tolerated" is not sufficiently well explained in the lead - are the supplements well tolerated (in which case you need a reference to say this in the main body - I can't see one) or are you referring to the tolerable upper intake level?
- Removed "well-tolerated" 11-29-21 and reworded sentence. Safety/tolerance is not an important enough topic to be included in the Lead
- Done 11-29-21 In contect of UL, text in Lead changed to be clear
Please link [[clearance (pharmacology)|excreted in urine]].
- Done 11-29-21
I suggest adding a sentence on the biosynthesis and industrial synthesis of riboflavin to the lead.
- Done 11-29-21 Added to end of Lead
Please link [[food coloring|coloring agent]] in the final sentence of the lead.
- Done 11-29-21

Definition

I suggest deleting the second sentence, as you have covered the biosynthesis in depth in a later section.
- Done 11-29-21
Please link vitamer, flavin mononucleotide and flavin adenine dinucleotide.
- Done 11-30-21
Please introduce the abbreviations FMN and FAD in this section.
- Done and done 11-29-21, but have left the wikilinking and abbreviation creations existing elsewhere if you agree that the Definition section can be deleted (my query on your Talk page)
  - Definition stayed 11-29-21 so wikilinking and abbrev creations elsewhere in the article removed, and FMN and FAD used rather than spelling out the words
In the final sentence, please explain where you would find FMN and FAD in a 10% to 90% ratio - is this in a typical animal cell, in a mammalian cell, in a bacterial cell, in all cells?
- ~~Not done~~ 11-29-21 The reference states 10% and 90% but provides no information about in animals, plants, bacteria. I am thinking animal cells, but looking elsewhere for a new ref.
  - Done 11-29-21. Found better information and refs at Flavin adenine dinucleotide

Functions

As you will have introduced the abbreviations FMN and FAD in the definitions section, please remove the full names from this section.
- Done 12-1-21
I suggest deleting "synthesize" from the phrase "conversion of tryptophan to synthesize niacin"
- Done 12-1-21
I suggest rephrasing "including coded for in archeal, bacterial and fungal genomes" to read "including coded for in archaea, bacteria and fungi".
- Done 12-1-21
Please replace "interconverted among" with "converted between"
- Done 12-1-21
I suggest replacing "FAD also catalyzes the activity of glutathione reductase..." with "FAD is also required for glutathione reductase activity"
- Done 12-1-21
In the first paragraph of the "Micronutrient metabolism" section, I suggest replacing the em dashes surrounding "5,10-methylenetetrahydrofolate reductase" with commas.
- Done 12-1-21
I suggest deleting "essential dietary mineral" before "iron" to avoid repetition of "essential"
- Done 12-1-21

Synthesis

Please use the abbreviations FMN and FAD in the final sentence of the "Biosynthesis" section.
- Done 11-29-21
A hyphen is required in "industrial-scale production".
- Done 11-29-21
I suggest starting a new paragraph with "Riboflavin is sometimes overproduced, possibly as a protective mechanism..."
- Done 11-29-21

Chemical properties

I suggest replacing "having a slight odor and bitter taste" with "with a slight odor and bitter taste."
- Done 11-29-21
Please check whether wikilinks would be appropriate for polar, non-polar, chloroform, benzene, acetone.
- Not done. The Wikilink to solvent describes polar and non-polar. I would prefer to not add links for the chemicals so as to avoid overlinking; as riboflavin is not soluble in these chemicals links would not add to better knowledge about riboflavin 11-29-21

Medical uses

Please wikilink [[topical medication|topically]] and [[Ultraviolet#UVA|Ultraviolet A]].
- DONE 11-29-21
I suggest rephrasing "included high-dose riboflavin (400 mg) as" with "stated that high-dose bioflavin (400 mg) is"
- DONE 11-29-21
Please replace "and not recommended" at the end of the final sentence of this section with "and supplements are not recommended". (Otherwise it sounds as if the research is not recommended!)
- DONE 11-29-21

Dietary recommendations

"the" missing after "The National Academy of Medicine updated" in the first sentence.
- Done 12-1-21
Please replace "ages 14 and up" with "aged 14 and over"
- Done 12-1-21 Other uses of "ages" changed to "aged"
I suggest replacing "so as to identify amounts that will cover people with higher than average requirements" with "to provide adequate intake levels for individuals with higher than average requirements".
- Done 12-1-21
Missing "are" in the sentence "AI and UL defined the same as in United States."
- Done 12-1-21
Please replace "ages 15 and older" with "aged 15 and over"
- Done 12-1-21
Please replace "The EFSA also reviewed the safety question and like the U.S..." with "The EFSA also considered the maximum safe intake and like the U.S. National Academy of Medicine..."
- Done 12-1-21
Please rearrange the first two sentences of the "Safety" subsection to read "In humans, there is no evidence for riboflavin toxicity produced by excessive intakes and absorption becomes less efficient as doses increases. Any excess riboflavin is excreted via the kidneys into urine, resulting in a bright yellow color known as flavinuria." (Please also add appropriate wikilinks.)
- Done 12-1-21
The final sentence of the safety subsection is too long. I suggest you rephrase so that it reads "During a clinical trial on the effectiveness of riboflavin for treating the frequency and severity of migraines, subjects were given up to 400 mg of riboflavin orally per day for periods of 3-12 months. Among side effects reported were abdominal pains and diarrhea" or similar.
- Done 12-1-21

Intake table

Please provide a title for this table, so that it is more obvious what it means. e.g. "Daily intakes for riboflavin recommended by relevant agencies"
- Done 11-30-21 Used "Recommended daily intakes"
Please make it clear which body in the United States is making the recommendation
- Not done 11-30-21 Ref numbers 4 and 27 in the right side column indicate where the RDA and PRI numbers come from.
  - I am not satisfied with this response How can you head the top half of the table with "Recommended daily intakes United States" and the bottom half with "European Food Safety Authority"? You should either write "Recommended daily allowances United States" and "Population Reference Intakes European Union" OR "Recommended daily allowances US National Academy of Medicine" and "Population Reference Intakes European Food Safety Authority". Mertbiol (talk) 14:28, 1 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    - Revised to your first set of suggested titles. 12-1-21
Please remove the additional cell in the title row of the EFSA section.
- Done 11-30-21 if you meant removing the empty cell third column

Thats all for now, I will add more comments later. Best wishes Mertbiol (talk) 18:04, 28 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Sources

I do not understand how you have grouped/ordered the items in the food composition tables. I suggest reorganising so that (e.g.) meat, fish and dairy products are in the left table, cereals and grains are in the centre and other vegetables are on the right.
- Not done. The columns are not catagories. Verly loosely, the order is high to low, with attempt to include foods commonly eaten and foods that would allow a lacto-ovo-vegetarian or vegan to meet dietary recommendations.
  - I am not satisfied with this response A very loose order is not good enough - you need to address this properly. You either order by riboflavin content (from high to low) or you group according to class of foodstuff. Why is (e.g.) turkey below beef in your order as it stands? Mertbiol (talk) 14:28, 1 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
There is a comma instead of a decimal point in the entry for Whey in the left hand table.
- Done 11-30-21
I cannot find a mention of “The milling of cereals results in considerable loss (up to 60%) of riboflavin” in reference [3]. Please provide a suitable reference.
- Done 11-30-21 That unreferenced statement was in the article when I started my GA effort in early October 2021. Found a ref that states 85% loss.
I suggest replacing "bovine milk" with "cows milk".
- Done 11-30-21
I suggest replacing "India stipulates 1.5 mg/kg for wheat flour" with "The Indian governments recommends 1.5 mg/kg for wheat flour."
- Done 11-30-21
Please provide a better source for "India stipulates 1.5 mg/kg for wheat flour" which does not require so much searching in the linked database.
- Done 11-30-21 Replaced with ref that recommends (optional) 4 mg/kg ("maida" and "atta" are white and whole wheat flour, respectively)

Adsorption, metabolism, excretion

I suggest rephrasing the first sentence of this section as "More than 90% of riboflavin in the diet is in the form of FMN and FAD, bound to proteins." which better represents the text in reference [3].
- Done 11-30-21
I suggest replacing "frees" with "releases" in the second sentence.
- Done 11-30-21
Please change "maximal" to "maximum" and "was" to "is" in the phrase: "the maximal amount of riboflavin that can be absorbed from a single dose was 27 mg".
- Done 11-30-21
I suggest changing the final sentence of the second paragraph to read "Infants with mutations in the genes encoding these transport proteins can be treated with riboflavin administered orally." to better reflect reference [32].
- Done 11-30-21
Please link [[urine specific gravity]], [[urine osmolality]] and [[feces]].
- Done 11-30-21

Deficiency

Please link [[cranial nerves]], [[acyl-CoA-dehydrogenase]] and [[chronic stress]].
- Done 11-29-21
I suggest transferring the details of the EGRAC to a footnote, as this information seems too detailed for the main text of an encyclopedia.
- Not done. Instead, shortened second parapgraph by removing analysis details. 11/29/21

History

Entire section rewritten

I think you need to explain the meaning of "egg white injury" - you could do this in a footnote.
- Not done. Instead, deleted all mention, It and the thiamin text were in retrospect a digression into research teasing out the B vitamins.
The connection between the final sentence of the second paragraph and riboflavin in unclear. Thiamin is not mentioned previously in the article. I suggest deleting this sentence.
- Done 11-30-21
I think you need to expand on "leading to evidence in 1939 that riboflavin was essential for human health". What evidence was produced in 1939?
- Done 11-30-21
Please change "caused" to "causes" in the first sentence of the final paragraph.
- Done 11-30-21

First pass

That's everything for the first pass. You have already told me that you are going away on vacation, so there is no rush to respond. Over to you. Best wishes Mertbiol (talk) 10:15, 29 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

As I respond to each bullet I will add an indented Done underneath, with a date. If not complying exactly, I will start my response indented and Bold. David notMD (talk) 16:02, 29 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

History section completely rewritten 11-30-31. Please review again if you do a second round of suggested changes. David notMD (talk) 13:13, 30 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

A Laboratory synthesis subsection has been added with a chem diagram by another editor. David notMD (talk) 17:43, 30 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I am not satisfied with the responses that you have made to my comments on the tables. Please address these issues properly. Mertbiol (talk) 14:28, 1 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

See revised for the RDAs and PRIs tables. David notMD (talk) 20:06, 1 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Second pass

I have made several tweaks to the article, mostly to improve the flow of the prose. In particular, I have cut a few very long sentences into two parts, to make them easier for a lay person to read and understand. I have also made some of the changes that I requested above, but that the nominator had skipped.
There are a few instances when I have been unable to verify facts in the article in the reference provided:

I cannot find a mention of E101a in reference [8] (PubChem database)

Done Ref to current UKFSA added: both riboflavin and FMN are called E101 now. Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:18, 9 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I cannot see where "Beyond a load dose of 1.1 mg, urinary excretion increased rapidly, so that with a dose of 2.5 mg, urinary content was 800 micrograms" is supported in reference [4] (Institute of Medicine)
- Figure 5.1 shows urinary excretion increasing rapidly and a value of 800 micrograms for dose of 2.5 mg. Sentence reworded to end as "...so that with a dose of 2.5 mg, urinary output was 800 micrograms for a 24-hour urine collection."
I cannot see where "The name "riboflavin" comes from "ribose" (the sugar whose reduced form, ribitol, forms part of its structure) and "flavin", the ring-moiety which imparts the yellow color to the oxidized molecule (from Latin flavus, "yellow")" is supported in reference [10] (Micronutrient Information Center, Linus Pauling Institute)
- Ref swap: It is Present Knowledge in Nutrition, not Linus Pauling, stating that "flavin" was derived from the Latin "flavus" for yellow

I am also not a huge fan of using the reference [8] (PubChem database) in general and I would like to see the original research papers cited alongside the PubChem database.

- Partially addressed I removed two of the six uses of PubMed as a reference, as the factual content in the text is adequately supported by another ref (Institute of Medicine/DRIs). The other four appear to be simple factual statements about solubility, toxic fumes if heated, orange/yellow color.

Best wishes Mertbiol (talk) 21:16, 6 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I am once again in front of my computer. Will address these ASAP. PubChem existed as a ref before I started serious work on bringing this to GA; I will replace as much as I can. David notMD (talk) 10:53, 9 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@David notMD: As I mentioned earlier, I'm don't believe Pubchem should be used for substantive information, although it is probably OK for simple statements about colour, for example. I removed some of the those earlier citations and am happy to help with finding alternative sources (especially chemistry) if you run into problems. Just ping me here for any you need help with. Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:58, 9 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Mertbiol: Between my work and that by Michael D. Turnbull, I believe the second pass comments have been addressed. David notMD (talk) 18:41, 9 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Final Verdict

GA review – see WP:WIAGA for criteria

Is it reasonably well written?
A. Prose quality:

B. MoS compliance for lead, layout, words to watch, fiction, and lists:
Is it factually accurate and verifiable?
A. References to sources:
Well referenced.

B. Citation of reliable sources where necessary:
Well referenced.

C. No original research:
Is it broad in its coverage?
A. Major aspects:

B. Focused:
Is it neutral?
Fair representation without bias:
Is it stable?
No edit wars, etc:
Does it contain images to illustrate the topic?
A. Images are copyright tagged, and non-free images have fair use rationales:
Well illustrated.

B. Images are provided where possible and appropriate, with suitable captions:
Well illustrated.
Overall:
Pass or Fail:

Congratulations to @David notMD: and @Michael D. Turnbull: I think this article has now reached GA standard. Well done to both of you!! I have very much enjoyed reviewing the article. Thanks and best wishes, Mertbiol (talk) 21:13, 9 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Outstanding work and tenacious determination by David and Michael. Thanks and congratulations. Zefr (talk) 21:39, 9 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]