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Talk:Repopulation of wolves in California

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this paper

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@Fettlemap: : Status of the Wolf in California. Lloyd G. Ingles. Journal of Mammalogy, Volume 44, Issue 1, 20 February 1963, Pages 109–110, https://doi.org/10.2307/1377174.

The last wolf confirmed in California until OR-7 might be of 1962 and there is a picture attached to it that is a gray wolf. What do you think ? Gimly24 (talk) 19:22, 23 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I forgot to reply but I didn't have access to read the article. Seems pertinent and would contribute to the article. Cheers, Fettlemap (talk) 20:29, 7 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Would you like me to send you this study ? (Edit : you can also see it whole by looking at the link above and the next study. The end is viewable on the other page (see : https://doi.org/10.2307/1377175). Up to your preference :) Gimly24 (talk) 21:25, 7 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I will use the links. Fettlemap (talk) 00:13, 8 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Pups Tabs (Table)

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I had this idea of making a simple table of pup production of packs with information given in article page. I'm testing it. Gimly24 (talk) 18:31, 7 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

A recent article confirmed that the CDFW doesn't know how many of the pups survive into the first and second years nor how many take off on their own. Fettlemap (talk) 04:52, 7 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes of course. Knowing how many pups are born is easier to know and assess than knowing each one's fate, which is a difficult thing to assess and confirm. In general, pup survival in wolves to the end of their birth year turns around 60% if I remember correctly. Also while we are there, when the CDFW collared the two Whaleback wolves this March, one of them was OR-85M. He was recollared (age 4, 98 lbs). One of his offspring of 2021 was also collared : a 97 lbs black yearling male. They were collared in mid-march, thus the young wolf would have been around 23 months. Gimly24 (talk) 15:03, 7 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Pup production of California's Wolf Packs
Pack Number of litters Number of pups Year
Shasta 1 5 2015
Lassen 1 4 2017
1 5 2018
1 4 2019
2 8 (4 & 4) 2020
1 6 2021
1 5 2022
Whaleback 1 7 2021
1 8 2022
  • Note #1 : Lassen's pup production of 2022 to seek information (Edit : Found and added in Article).
  • Note #2 : LAS1F is the Lassen female for 2017-2020, LAS09F is the Lassen female for 2020-2022 and the female of the Whaleback is the same for 2021-2022. Gimly24 (talk) 18:48, 7 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Reorganize Article Sections

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Given that this is a developing topic, and this article has grown with the wolf population, it seems the article section structure no longer best serves the reader. I'd like to suggest a new structure that should provide for better cohesion and wanted to get folks' thoughts. Other than moving the content around, it would be untouched.

Here's the new sections I'm proposing:

  • Precursors in Oregon This section stays as-is
  • Initial entry This section includes only the bit about OR-7
  • Further exploration and first resident packs This section is effectively a combination the two existing sections: First resident packs and Further exploration and challenges
  • Conservation and challenges This section covers the application of the Endangered Species Act, CDFW management plan, livestock depredation, etc

Arcturus95 (talk) 06:21, 23 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I agree that it is due for a reorganization and appreciate you discussing it. I am on my phone today so it is harder to see what it might look like. OR-7 has his own article so no need for an entire section. Better to include some of the first resident packs in Initial entry section. The third section can just be "Natural expansion" emphasizing the lack of human intervention. It needs a shorter title. Your suggestion to gather the regulation and management issues into a new section is a good one. There is sufficient material and it will continue to expand. Thanks for your work, 〜 Adflatuss • talk 15:11, 23 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sounds good. I'm with you on most of those points.
As for "Initial entry" vs "Natural expansion": Part of the reason I felt there is a need for a reorganization is that the current separation of "First resident packs" and "Further exploration" seems based on an arbitrary distinction. If doing a reorganization, it would be best to remedy that. Hence my suggestion to do a combined section - where the name "Natural expansion" is definitely better.
Let me know your thoughts once you get the opportunity for a deeper look. Thanks :) Arcturus95 (talk) 17:31, 23 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The current separation of "First resident packs" and "Further exploration" is definitely arbitrary but was done to create sections of appropriate length. A new division is suggested based on not just OR-7 but the first few packs seems about right.
Please go ahead and reorganize without waiting for further comment. Nothing is final as other eyes view the article and new events and content are added. Cheers, 〜 Adflatuss • talk 20:27, 23 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Cool. New to editing Wikipedia, so treading lightly :)
Took a stab at it. Thanks for your feedback. Arcturus95 (talk) 23:15, 23 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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