Talk:Religious views on female genital mutilation/Archive 2

Archive 1

Archive 2

Rouzi source

Arslan-San: Do you have a peer reviewed version of the Rouzi source. ResearchGate is a social network, and like facebook and youtube it does not meet RS guidelines. Further, Type I, II and III FGM which is not really in religious texts, therefore undue to this article. Per WP:BRD, please discuss and gain consensus. Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 01:24, 5 June 2017 (UTC)

@Doug Weller: Do we have a separate guideline on non-peer reviewed essays / blogs on social networks? whether they are RS or non-RS for wikipedia articles? Thanks, Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 01:37, 5 June 2017 (UTC)

Ms Sarah Welch ResearchGate isn't the publisher, it's The European Journal of Contraception and Reproductive Health Care that published it. Doug Weller talk 10:45, 11 June 2017 (UTC)

@Doug Weller: Thanks. I missed that. Will review what we should add to this article, now that I have located the article. Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 13:57, 11 June 2017 (UTC)

Beta Israel

Regardless of these views, in Ethiopia, there resides a Jewish minority group, often referred to as Falasha or Beta Israel, who practice the procedure of female genital cutting.

Falasha is a derogatory name for the group and doesn't belong.

However, there is still a question to the validity of the Beta Israel's claim. "Non science scholars today excessively rely on the existing religious texts of the Beta Israel to analyze their Jewish heritage and distinctive traits that are not shared ...

The rest of the paragraph is about Beta Israel's genetic heritage and doesn't belong in the article. Their status in the Jewish world is a sensitive topic that does not need to be addressed here. ImTheIP (talk) 12:25, 13 June 2017 (UTC)

FR

I'm going to remove this list of sources again because they're unverifiable for most readers and editors. SarahSV ^(talk) 18:14, 24 October 2017 (UTC)

This article is on religious views. Main religion related is Islam, and it is important that it should be verifiable to those people related. Removing the information, you are depriving them.--Md iet (talk) 02:42, 25 October 2017 (UTC)

This is a very contentious issue, so we need to rely on mainstream, English-language, reliable secondary sources that are reasonably easy to access, whether in the body of the article or in further reading. We should avoid primary sources, websites, and other sources that are difficult to access and that can't be understood by most of our readers. For any health-related claim, the sources must comply with WP:MEDRS. SarahSV ^(talk) 03:50, 25 October 2017 (UTC)

Disgraceful tolerance

I'm shocked that wikipedia allows this kind of material to appear in an article. People are posting 'learned' opinions as to why it is OK to hack off women's sex organs, and which amount of hacking is allowed when.

We are told: "There are dichotomous differences of opinion among Sunni scholars in regards to female genital cutting." Well, shouldn't we be sorting the sheep from the goats? Any 'scholar' that thinks this practice is OK is no scholar, but an ignorant and bigoted peasant. Let's not honour these oafs with the honorific 'scholar', because by all accounts, there is no support for these practices in Islamic teaching.

Or am I wrong? MrDemeanour (talk) 22:50, 29 November 2017 (UTC)

Redirecting "Female Circumcision" and "Khafd" page issues

1. The page "Female Circumcision" page redirects to the FGM page, and the "Khafd" page redirects to Religious views on female genital mutilation. The problem with this redirecting is that it equates Female Circumcision = FGM. This is incorrect. Female Circumcision is a name given to a procedure/practice, and FGM is an umbrella term by the WHO, given for many (about 6) different procedure/practice from which female circumcision is one of them. Just like piercing is also a practice that comes under the FGM umbrella term. Therefore, Female Circumsiion ⊆ FGM (FC is a subset of FGM), not Female Circumcision = FGM.

2. This is further established by the WHO themselves who refer to Type 1a as female "circumcision" on page 2 of . Reference: http://www.who.int/reproductivehealth/topics/fgm/management-health-complications-fgm/en/ WHO guidelines on the management of health complications from female genital mutilation 3. Therefore, in order to be clear, I propose having a short description of "female circumcision", describing Type 1a clitoral hood procedure as per the WHO document. And then mention that the WHO considers this FGM. Below this, have a "see more" tab below it then linking it to the FGM page.

If you're looking for more sources, look no further that the Britanica Dictionary. It calls the Islamic practice of Khafd "FEMALE CIRCUMCISION" https://www.britannica.com/topic/khafd https://www.britannica.com/topic/khitan-Islam Hence, what I propose is not to do a blanket re-directing. First clarify the term "Female Circumcision" and "Khafd" according to the WHO guidelines and dictionary. They say that the WHO considers it amoungst one of the practices of FGM, and then have a "See more" tag to the FGM page.Muffizainu (talk) 00:26, 6 March 2018 (UTC) Muffizainu (talk) 13:23, 8 March 2018 (UTC)

Translation error

I've added a tag at "makrumah lilnisa (noble but not required)." The Arabic term مكرمة للنساء means "noble for women", NOT, "not required". Muffizainu (talk) 15:22, 15 March 2018 (UTC)

Why a map about religious FGM without Malaysia, Indonesia, Sri Lanka, India, Iran, Saudi-Arabia, Dagestan?

Islamic FGM: For the Shafi'i school it is obligatory (wājib) - and the Shia sect of Bohra (f. e. Dawoodi Bohra) "circumcize" (mutilate) their daughters. The muftis or ulama of MUI (Indonesia), or of JAKIM (Malaysia) defend Khitan al-inath (sunat perempuan; khitan bagi wanita). So a map about religious FGM has to show Malaysia, Indonesia, Sri Lanka, India, Pakistan, Iran, Oman, Saudi-Arabia, and Dagestan. 2003:E8:5BC9:4E94:E42D:FEC1:B43C:8688 (talk) 14:50, 29 June 2018 (UTC)

[ image description ] "None, except the Shafi'i version of Sunni Islam"

yes, but also the Dawoodi Bohra - a Shia sect - regards FGM/C as wajib / farD, as a religious obligation. 2003:E8:5BC8:D093:9403:88EC:715C:1366 (talk) 14:47, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

Infobox and lead

SlimVirgin, regarding this and this, I didn't notice until yesterday that an IP (obviously the same person) came along and re-added the material a month later. Thoughts? No need to ping me since this page is on my watchlist. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 06:53, 28 January 2019 (UTC)

Thanks for pointing it out. I've restored the last good version with a couple of tweaks. SarahSV ^(talk) 21:16, 28 January 2019 (UTC)

Thanks. Since the article is on my watchlist, I'll be there to revert problematic edits. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 00:05, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

That would be very helpful, thank you. SarahSV ^(talk) 00:13, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

BANREVERT

I'm reverting two edits that were done by a banner user who used two different sockpuppets to insert some content in the lead[1][2][3]. If anyone wants to restore it, they would need to examine the sources carefully and determine if they were faithfully represented and whether this content is WP:DUE enough for the lead. VR _talk 02:04, 27 October 2021 (UTC)

Why does it say jews didn't practice FGM?

90% of them in Eastern Europe before ww2 were from Belarus, because they had moved there from countries like Azerbaijan and Armenia which are located next to all the countries that practiced it. They did it because they thought that part of the body caused promiscuity and they didn't want them to feel anything.

There were even Jews in Hungary during WW2 who had FGM done to them. The Orthodox Rabbis would try to take as much skin as possible because it symbolized an oath and if they were arrested for it the others would just teach new Rabbi's how to do it. Eastern Europeans would often socialize with them and witness them doing it in the old Gothic churches with the babies crying.

I've seen this in ww2 documentaries in which women were questioned for their identity and asked to reveal their circumscions and it was even talked about on official holocaust remembrance sites. 67.80.64.41 (talk) 20:04, 2 March 2023 (UTC)