Talk:Réseau Breton

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Querries of the origin of some steam locomotives

In the article locomotive E 217 is listed to have been built by Franco Belge, Raismes ( FrBe.R ) According to the FrBe works list the factory built only E 210 - 216 with works numbers 1068 - 1074 in 1896.

The FrBe works number 1063 / 1895 was 1435 mm gauge Bt-n2 for Dairah Sanieh in Egypt.

Works numbers 1064 - 1065 / 1896 were 1435 mm gauge 1B1-n2 Etat Belge type 12 nos 2099 - 2100.

Works numbers 1066 - 1067 / 1896 were Tracteur de Blant

Works numbers 1068 - 1074 / 1896 were 1000 mm gauge 1Bt-n2 CF Ouest E 210 - 216.

Works numbers 1075 - 1086 / 1897 were 1435 mm gauge 2B-n2 CF Ouest 939 - 950.

Works numbers 1087 - 1093 / 1896 were 1435 mm gauge C-n2 Etat Belge type 25 nos 2193 - 2199.

Works number 1094 / 1896 was 1055 mm gauge B-2T Rowan steam railcars for Compagnie Franco-Algerien.

Works numbers 1095 - 1098 / 1897 were Tracteur de Blant for Gilbert, St.Brieuc.

Works numbers 1099 - 1103 / 1897 were 1435 mm gauge Etat Belge 1C-n2 type 16 nos 2235 - 2239.

Works numbers 1104 - 1110 / 1897 were 1435 mm gauge Etat Belge C-n2 type 25.

Works numbers 1111 - 1118 / 1897 were 1067 mm gauge 2B-n2 Assuan-Shellal, Egypt.

Works numbers 1119 - 1120 / 1897 were 1067 mm gauge Ct-n2 delivered to Coiseau & Cousin.

Works numbers 1121 - 1128 / 1898 were 1435 mm gauge Etat Belge C-n2 type 25 nos 2315 - 2322.

Works numbers 1129 - 1138 / 1897 were 1435 mm gauge CF Etat ( France ) 1B1t-n2 nos 0241 - 0250.

Works number 1139 / 1897 was an industrial tank locomotive delivered to Mines d´Anzin.

Works number 1140 / 1898 was Ct-n2 delivered to Mines de Marles.

Works number 1141 / 1898 was an industrial tank locomotive delivered to Tuilerie de Laforst.

Thus, metre gauge 1Bt-n2 locomotive E 217 must have come from other builder than Franco Belge.

Societe Alsacienne de Constructions Mecanicues ( or shortly SA. ) is one of the best recorded locomotive builder in France. It delivered only these 1000 mm gauge C1t-n2 type locomotives:

S.A.-B ( B for Belfort Works ) 3725 / 1885 C.F. Economiques 3501

S.A.-M ( M for Mulhouse Works ) 3948 - 3958 / 1886 C.F. Economiques 3504 - 3414

S.A.-B 3959 / 1886 C.F. Economiques 3515

S.A.-M 3981 - 3984 / 1887 Est Algerien 01 - 04

S.A.-M 4015 - 4017 / 1888 C.F. Economiques 3516 - 3518

S.A.-M 4051 / 1889 C.F. Economiques 3543

S.A.-B 4052 - 4068 / 1889 C.F. Economiques 3544 - 3560

S.A.-B 4089 - 4095 / 1889 C.F. Economiques 3534 - 3540

S.A.-B 4215 - 4216 / 1890 Est Algerien 05 -06

S.A.-B 4277 - 4278 / 1891 C.F. Economiques 3564 - 3565

S.A.-B 4500 / 1894 Est Algerien 07

S.A.-B 4601 / 1894 Est Algerien 08

As can be seen there was no deliveries to C.F. Ouest (Reseau Breton ) in 1892.

Thus E 301 - 303 must have been built by another builder than Societe Alsacienne.

Then the mysterios C'C't-n4v Mallets of 1914. C.F. Rhone et Loire ordered in 1912 two years before the Great War from Pinguely 1000 mm gauge 1Ct-n2 numbers 1 - 19 ( Pinguely 285 - 303 ).

Numbers 1 - 3 were Pinguely 285 - 287 / 1912.

Numbers 4 - 5 were Pinguely 288 - 289 / 1913

Numbers 6 - 14 were Pinguely 290 - 298 / 1914

When the war broke out in August 1914 the rest of the order nos 15 - 19 was cancelled. When this happened these locomotives were in various stages of construction. Pinguely managed despite great difficulties to complete the locomotives ( Pinguely Works numbers 299 - 303 / 1915 and sold them to Algeria where they were allocated to metre gauge Biskra - Touggourt line at the northern edge of Sahara.

This leaves only Pinguely works numbers 304, 305, and 334 free for not recorded locomotives. If one assumes that these works numbers were used for Reseau Breton C'C't-n4v Mallets they covered only E 410 - 412. Numbers E 413 - 417 must have been built by another works.

However, a metre gauge C'C't-n4v Mallet is rare product indeed. By this time Decauville was building 600 mm gauge C'C'-n4 Mallet locomotives for Morocco to C.F. Marnia - Taourirt, but not any metre gauge Mallets.

On opposite side of the front line Henschel Werke in Kassel built 20 C'C't-n4v metre gauge Mallets for Deutsche Feldbahnen with works numbers 15150 - 15169 / 1917. When completed all were allocated to Northern France for metre gauge lines in German occupied area.

After the war they were sold for other customers.

Henschel 15150 - 15156 / 1917 to C.F. Franco Ethiophia

Henschel 15157 - 15158 / 1917 to Hedjas Railway ( regauged to 1050 mm )

Henschel 15160 / 1917 to Bavarian State Railways becoming number 996.

Henschel 15161 / 1917 to Ruhr - Lippe Eisenbahn Kleinbahn number 14.

Henschel 15162 / 1917 to C.F. Economiques 6001.

Henschel 15164 - 15169 to Hedjas Railway ( regauged to 1050 mm )

This leaves two locomotives ( Henschel 15159 and 15163 ) to be traced for.

In France the main builder for metre gauge C'Ct-n4v Mallets was Batignolles which built at that period Mallets for French colonial railways in Africa. Bone - Guelma Mallets 551 - 567 come out in 1908 with Batignolles works numbers 1702 - 1718. C.F. Guinee Francaise received nos 101 - 111 ( Batignolles 1767 - 1777 / 1910 ) and nos 112 - 113 ( Batignolles 1818 - 1819 / 1911 ).

Corpet Louvet built only one batch of C'C't-n4v Mallets ( Works numbers 1409 - 1413 / 1913 )for C.F. du Centre numbered 101 - 105 but these were later sold to Ivory Coast in French West Africa for C.F. Abidjan - Niger.

This leaves only two possible French buiders for E 413 - 417. Weidknecht in Paris and Ateliers et Chantiers de la Loire, Penhoet, Nantes.

Weidknecht did not have its own boiler shop in its works at Pont de Flandre , thus this builder was depended of other boiler builders. This presumably rules out Weidknecht as possible builder.

Interesting research work is waiting for those who want to solve the builders of E 410 - 417. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.112.190.60 (talk) 04:23, 16 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Interesting comments, 88. I've now got Gordon Gravett's book and will be expanding the article in the coming weeks. If you ever return or have registered an account do let me know. Mjroots (talk) 10:48, 13 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

E301-3 were originally built by SACM for the Chemin de fer de Cher, which was a CF Economiques line. Mjroots (talk) 10:52, 13 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]