Talk:Piano Sonata No. 14 (Mozart)

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POV

there's slight issue with POV:

"It is said that Mozart wrote the Fantasy as a reconstruction of the improvisation he made before writing the sonata." I removed this for various obvious reasons.

Significance of key: 'The key of C minor is generally associated with tragic, violent emotions and the battle with fate." This is highly subjective. Different key meant different things to different composers (if it held any meaning at all). This will also be removed if there are no objections.

"Since the second movement is in rondo form and slower than the others, it could exist independently from the sonata more easily than the other movements." the first phrase and the second phrase have no relationship, and the second phrase is again subjective.

"Other significant compositions in C minor (which have strikingly similar main themes) are Beethoven's 3rd Piano Concerto, opus 37 and Mozart's own Piano Concerto No. 24, K. 491." use of language is problematic.

If there are no objections to the removal of the final three statements, it will be removed. Chanhee920 (talk) 12:35, 17 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I removed the last one. There's nothing similar about the themes other than a rising arpeggio. The first bit about C minor, I'm indifferent about. As for the second statement, I agree its quite odd, but I'm a bit concerned it might be part of the Wolf footnote from the previous sentence. Should it be reworded to say that's Wolf's opinion or should it be cut out completely? DavidRF (talk) 15:21, 17 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

To me, "Since the second movement is in rondo form and slower than the others," sounds like the contributer's opinion. I just cannot imagine a professional musicologist saying that a movement in a sonata could more easily be independent because it is slow. Every sonata has slow movement, and a lot of sonatas use the rondo form as well (Beethoven pathetique). I don't know what should be done with it. Perhaps we should message the person who added this,and get him to quote the exact statement here. Chanhee920 (talk) 17:19, 17 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

A Mannheim rocket, or Mannheim crescendo is a particular type of orchestral crescendo. A good example comes at the beginning of Mozart's symphony concertant for violin and viola. This opening motive is not orchestral nor a crescendo. To apply this terminology to a solo piano playing a broken chord is to dilute it's meaning and its value. — Preceding unsigned comment added by PJinBoston (talk • contribs) 14:38, 18 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

To say that mozart's sonata is "prophetic" of Beethoven's later and comparitively inferior sonata is to try to give credit to the later artist for what the earlier has done, or to portray it as groundwork for something better. No artist ever "anticipates" another, but all great artists learn from those before them. Particularly with their earlier pieces as was the case here for Beethoven. It's always seemed apparent to me that Beethoven modeled his sonata after Mozart's. There are other examples such as the slow movement of his seventh symphony being inspired by the slow movement of Mozart's symphony 39. Let's be honest and say that Beethoven took Mozart's as a model. — Preceding unsigned comment added by PJinBoston (talk • contribs) 14:49, 18 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

re: "significance of the key" Let us at last dispense with the facile psychology studies. The key choice has no significance other than a purely musical one. To mention his mother is to imply a connection with the work - there is no evidence for that. It's completely wrong to say that a minor key implies some personal connection. Can't a composer choose a minor key for musical reasons. This section needs to be removed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by PJinBoston (talk • contribs) 14:56, 18 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]