Talk:Komi-Permyak language

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On 30 December 2023, it was proposed that this article be moved from Permyak language to Komi-Permyak language. The result of the discussion was moved.

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Rename

This would need much more of a discussion than a mere reference to EB. Just "Permyak" is, as far as I can tell, a minority view and the standard term for the language in the field is in fact the longer "Komi-Permyak". See e.g. Riese, "Permian" and Hausenberg, "Komi" in The Uralic Languages ed. Abondolo, 1998; Rédei, "Die syrjänische Sprache" in The Uralic languages ed. Sinor, 1988. (Though with the last-mentioned I suppose you could argue that the German or for that matter Russian etc. standard terminology does not need to impact the English standard terminology.) As far as tertiary sources go, Glottolog, too, uses "Komi-Permyak". --Trɔpʏliʊm • blah 16:56, 20 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I agree. I always see this language named Komi-Permyak. --Amir E. Aharoni (talk) 06:55, 23 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

User:SrpskiAnonimac

SrpskiAnonimac, Encyclopædia Britannica, Permyak language, Alternative Title: Komi-Permyak language Белорецкий (talk) 13:16, 21 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

SrpskiAnonimac, Encyclopædia Britannica, Permyak language, Alternative Title: Komi-Permyak language VadimSPb78 (talk) 13:56, 14 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 30 December 2023

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. Per csonensus. – robertsky (talk) 03:19, 7 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Permyak language → Komi-Permyak language – The name is Komi-Permyak in Glottolog and ISO 639-3. The Oxford Guidebook to Uralic languages says that Permyak is not used by the Komi-Permyak speakers themselves, and despite the fact that it figures in the official name of the Komi-Permyak language (Ru. komi-permjackij jazyk, KoP komi-permjacköj kyv) is has a slightly negative connotation for the Komi. Traditionally, the Komi-Permyaks, just as the Komi-Zyryans, have called themselves simply Komi. Jähmefyysikko (talk) 13:58, 30 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Support, based on the arguments brought forward in Talk:Permyak_language#Rename above. Glottolog and ISO 639-3 are not always good guidance for us, but this time they follow common practice. The quote from the Oxford Guide doesn't really help, because it only says that "Komi-Permyak" is the "official" name in Russia, and that actually the speakers neither use "Permyak" nor "Komi-Permyak" (but simply Komi).

The most compelling argument comes from a Google Scholar search: "Komi-Permyak language" has 266 results, "Permyak language" has 275; since the former are included among the latter, that means only a dwindling number of sources uses only "Permyak language" (sources that flip-flop between "Permyak language" and "Komi-Permyak language" not included). –Austronesier (talk) 19:02, 30 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

PS: This would also restore the long-standing title that was disruptively changed without discussion in a move-warring fashion:[1] –Austronesier (talk) 19:10, 30 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Support. Ngram seems to indicate that Komi-Permyak is used about as much as Permyak,[2] and the other factors make it the preferred term. —Michael Z. 15:34, 3 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.