Talk:Payment for order flow

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This article is written in such a way that PFOF, a perfectly legal business model in many jurisdictions, is described as if it was one of Bernie Madoff's many crimes. That's totally wrong and unencyclopedic. Contrary to the tone of this article, PFOF isn't in the same legal and moral level of a Ponzi scheme. Methionylthreonyl... (talk) 12:11, 31 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Vanguard: Payment for order flow as of 2022

The article currently claims that 'The Vanguard Group' accepts payment for order flow. The Business Insider article used as a source links to an SEC Rule 606 disclosure from 2020: https://nms606.karngroup.com/vgrd/606a/2020Q3/588e3c62ff which shows Vanguard receiving payment for order flow in some months.

However, an article on vanguard.com from 2022 claims that vanguard doesn't "receive (or take) any form of payment for order flow": https://investor.vanguard.com/investor-resources-education/article/payment-for-order-flow-what-you-need-to-know

The 2022 Q2 SEC Rule 606 disclosure (https://nms606.karngroup.com/vgrd/606a/2022Q2/588e3c62ff) seems to confirm this for April-June of 2022: Each month contains the following statement for each organization under "Material Aspects":

"Vanguard Brokerage Services does not receive any payment for order flow. Vanguard Brokerage Services does not receive any monetary payments, services, property, or other direct or indirect benefit that would result in remuneration, compensation, or consideration in return for the routing of customer orders"

Aaron1011 (talk) 22:07, 24 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

public.com PFOF

The article describes public.com as a broker that doesn't receive PFOF in the following sentence:

while brokers that do not receive payment for order flow include Interactive Brokers (pro accounts that are charged commissions), Merrill Edge, Fidelity Investments, Vanguard, and Public.com.

However, if you closely look on their website, they say:

Public does not participate in PFOF for equities trades, including stocks and ETFs...However, PFOF is an essential part of the options market structure.

In short, while they don't accept PFOF for many types of investments, they do in fact accept PFOF for options trading. They just worded that fact in such a way that it seems (in my opinion) like they're trying to equivocate that knowledge for the average passerby since their current promotion is that they'll give "order flow rebate" for those that decide to register by the end of March 2024. From their description of that program:

If you are enrolled in our Options Order Flow Rebate Program (“Program”), Public will automatically share 50% of our options order flow revenue from each completed transaction with you, reducing the cost of your options trade. We are calling the revenue that Public shares with you an “order flow rebate.”

All in all, since Public.com actually still receives PFOF on options contract (regardless of the fact they happened to also share the 50% of it to participants in their "Rebate Program"), they shouldn't be included in the list of brokers that do not receive PFOF currently described by this article. Lovelaces17 (talk) 04:57, 20 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Bernie Madoff is not a reliable source on the ethics of securities industry practices

Convicted of securities fraud and sentenced to 150 years imprisonment, forfeiture of US$17.179 billion, and banned for life from the securities industry, Bernie Madoff is not a reliable source on the ethics of securities industry practices. Therefore, I deleted Madoff's endorsement of PFOF from the article. —Finell 05:33, 27 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]