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Nephilim Descended from Elohim

This is not an advertisement from a psychic tarot card reading snake oil vendor, this is an Elohim head sitting on the moon, taken from an Apollo 17 mission video. In the public domain. And that is relevant to the discussion as the Nephilim were descended from the Elohim. Deleting the data will not make it go away. I am sorry you do not like the data, but that won't make it go away either. And as science must contend with the data, you do not serve science by deleting the data from Wikipedia. You merely serve to make Wikipedia irrelevant, when hundreds of thousands of people see this image in places like youtube, and from the Apollo 17 website. Also the other related data which I posted, was not speculation either but actual scientific data. Censoring scientific data is not part of the Wikipedia mindset. I will not bother to repost it, but people may view it in the history if they so wish.—Preceding unsigned comment added by Rick S33555 (talk • contribs)

It's just a rock on the moon. And please sign your posts with four tildes (~~~~). --Ghostexorcist 10:16, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Signed as requested Rick S33555 10:26, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

And as far as your opinion goes as for it being just a rock, well thats your opinion and I will fight for you to have your opinion, and I will fight for others to have theirs as well. Censoring the data is not the same as voicing your opinion and NASA is as credible a source as you can get. And there is more data, which you have censored, such as the image of the Anunaki, (see history) and if that is just a natural rock formation, then so is Mount Rushmore. Further and pursuant to all that, show me the tablets.

Rick S33555 10:26, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

It's just a picture of a rock on the moon from a screenshot of a clip from youtube, which is a blacklisted site on wikipedia because it regularly breaks copyright laws. It is not a WP:Reliable Source. Yes, Mount Rushmore is a natural rock formation, the faces carved into it are not. Show you the tablets? --Ghostexorcist 10:32, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Well I personally do not own a satellite, and so as such, cannot show you a satellite image from space, but I can show you coordinates, so that you can go and use google earth, and see this for yourself. 15,10,21,56 S and 75,14,32,12 W at an eye elevation of 14 miles.

That is an Anunnaki, and part of the same discussion, which includes the origin of the Nephilim.

I posted an image, from an Apollo 17 video, I did not post a link to youtube. The image is in the public domain as all NASA footage is in the public domain. Granted, the video did appear there on youtube where I obtained it and fair use dictates I show the source, but the footage is NASA footage.

And my reference to show me the tablets is a common expression because the belief in the 10 commandments is well known, but they do not physically exist. No hard data only hearsay evidence. So it is unfair, to censor actual physical evidence when much of the subject matter in this topic is hearsay evidence. It seems to me that you are taking a biased opinion based on preconceived notions and not allowing others to make up their own minds what the data means. The head there on the moon is a giant head, and as such is one of a few examples of giant heads that may be shown here. So I submit that you should really allow the facts to speak for themselves and not allow your personal opinions to interfere with the honest pursuit of the facts.

As for no published data on this subject you can read Zechariah Sitchin and countless other well documented texts by PhD's in many scientific fields of endeavor. Rick S33555 11:44, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

I say again, it's a screenshot from youtube. It's not reliable. How can anyone read about the "published data" if you don't offer citations? --Ghostexorcist 11:56, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

I am sorry for being difficult, but I find it very annoying when the scientific facts are treated with such disrespect. People went to the moon and they brought back evidence such as this and for you to dismiss it as nonsense flies in the face of their heroic effort in mankind's pursuit of the truth.

Here is the screen capture taken just now from one of the videos which depicts the head. http://s2.supload.com/free/VideoandlocationofElohimHead-10-10-2007.jpg/view/[dead link] Here is a link to the video. http://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a17/a17v.1652245.rm Here is the page the video is on so you can do your own further research of you wish... I will even narrow it down for you to geology station 6. http://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a17/video17.html#station6

And as far as references to texts are you suggesting that Zecharia Sitchin is not a scholar?

"Zecharia Sitchin was born in Russia and raised in Palestine, where he acquired a profound knowledge of modern and ancient Hebrew, other Semitic and European languages, the Old Testament, and the history and archeology of the Near East. He is one of the few scholars who is able to read and understand Sumerian. Sitchin attended and graduated from the University of London, majoring in economic history. A leading journalist and editor in Israel for many years, he now lives and writes in New York.""

And are you suggesting also that Von Daniken is a crackpot? Why? Because he dares to mention relics that he finds on his journeys around the world, having researched in the field, first hand for over 30 years. Spoken to countless people in locales and studied their traditional legends and mythology. He has done more field work that any Harvard archaeologist. Just because his opinions do not match yours is no reason to vilify him or his work.

Do you have some explanation for that 4 mile long rock art sculpture of an Anunnaki at those coordinates in google earth I gave you or for the Elohim head found by Apollo 17? So why then do you revile these men who _do have an explanation? I will tell you why, because you are afraid of that which confronts you and so you wish to minimize it by relegating it to the fringe and offering guilt by association to somehow discredit the ideas of men who spent their entire professional careers studying these subjects. Read em and weep. The locations are there I have provided them at the NASA website and you have censored data and have shown yourself to be not a fair judge in this matter. Unqualified to delete my posts.

Rick S33555 12:44, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I do have an explanation for the 4 mile long rock art sculpture: It's a rock. You still have not provided correct citations to support your claims. --Ghostexorcist 12:48, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Well I have shown you an Elohim head on the moon. From Apollo 17 footage, and you might ask then well where is his birth certificate and of course I cannot provide that and you could then say well where is his passport? And I could not provide that either. If you ask for his citizenship from some alien planet I am afraid that he is without his wallet, so then what sort of citation could I provide that would satisfy you? Although Zecharia Sitchin and numerous other people have written extensively on their translations of the Sumerian texts and Biblical texts, no citation says expect to find an Elohim head on the moon. Although there are plenty of references to the moon and even in Indian mythology with the Ramayana, where a battle is fought on the moon. So then you dismiss the rock art of the Anunnaki. And you say it is a rock. Yes, a rock with a clear depiction of a person, who with his right hand is holding up two fingers and with his left hand has his index finger as a missile. And so then to explain that all to you, so that you can see how that fits in with other archaeology would take some time if you are a nay sayer, as nay sayers just deny the evidence. So extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence and these two things I have already shown you are quite extraordinary. Above and beyond extraordinary. And so then giving you more coordinates in google earth to yet more Anunnaki I can do. Here beside that one, is the smoking gun. (You have no idea what you are dealing with here) And keep in mind, you are almost asking for proof of God here. So don't say to me, that that is just too incredible. 14,58,55,43 S and 75,22,14,43 W eye elevation of 11.47 miles and rotate clockwise 10 degrees to the east for proper orientation.

And so then I can show you how these water bringer Gods, the Anunnaki, who fired the missiles, tie in with the Elohim, where one impacted, and where one is still sitting on the moon, which did not detonate, and how this all fits into their battle with the Elohim, and how as has been claimed by many, that there was a flood of sorts which resulted in the demise of the Nephilim their creation. But if you delete everything, including references to where that other missile is, and the relics which depict this story in Egyptian archaeology and Sumerian studies, well then how can I show the information so that people will be able to understand the connections between the Elohim, the Anunnaki, and the Nephilim?

Rick S33555 13:38, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

"Well I have shown you an Elohim head on the moon. From Apollo 17 footage..." You have shown me a rock on the moon from a screenshot from a blacklisted website.
"Although there are plenty of references to the moon and even in Indian mythology with the Ramayana, where a battle is fought on the moon." I am well aware of the events of the Ramayana because I have initiated several Hindu-mythology related articles.
You still have not provided credible proof for your claims. I think the overall problem I have with your "original research" is your claim about gods firing missiles at one another. I have to request you stop posting here like wikipedia is a forum. If you want to make valuable edits to the main article with verifiable sources, please feel free to do so at any time. --Ghostexorcist 14:11, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

This NASA website is not a blacklisted website. Here is a link to the video. http://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a17/a17v.1652245.rm Here is a screenshot. http://s2.supload.com/free/VideoandlocationofElohimHead-10-10-2007.jpg/view/[dead link]

You are not being reasonable. I am just trying to show you evidence of the Nephilim, which I'll admit, some believe are mythical creatures, who were created by God, and so you ask for evidence that God did it, from a what a scientific journal? Well the good lord works in mysterious ways and he has made some rock art for you that tells the story and that is his citation. Here is another one, fair use policy I won't make you look up the coordinates, it is there by Nazca as well. http://s2.supload.com/free/NazcaHead-9-5-2007.jpg/view/[dead link]

So hear me out. Two missiles were fired at the moon because the Elohim were mining into the moon, and were destroying the gene pool with genetic engineering (Biblical reference Genesis Elohim and the daughters of men etc) one went off and created Aitken Basin and punctured the moon causing water to outgass from the moon and it fell on the earth in vast quantities. The Nephilim which were on the earth, were forced to the equator where competition for food made them extinct along with the megafauna. If you examine these artifacts, the Narmer Palette and the Victory Stele at Naram-Sin you will see depictions of those two missiles. The Water Bringer God symbolism is in many relics from the Middle East and Peru such as the [dead link] La Venta Stele etc.

I'll admit that I am not expert on Wikipedia style and that is why when I did post to the page I just forwarded the information here for discussion on how to present this data. So here is a link to the water bringer Gods as well, and if someone can piece this information together in Wikipedia fashion, then that would be nice because it is relevant data. And also, Zecharia Sitchin and Von Daniken should not be merely placed in the popular culture heading but rather in a separate heading The Extraterrestrial Hypothesis. I have seen this site used in Wikipedia but I post it here simply because I can't provide every reference for Zecharia Sitchins work etc. Perhaps someone else can. http://www.crystalinks.com/godswaterbuckets.html

Rick S33555 14:49, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Basically, you have demonstrated to me that you have no textual citations to support your original research. You can show me all of the moon rock formation photos and stelae you want, but it still doesn't help your case. --Ghostexorcist 14:55, 10 October 2007 (UTC)
To an extent, whether the rock is what it is claimed to be or not is irrelevant. What matters is whether there are reliable sources which specifically argue that it is, and whether inclusion of that information on this page would raise concerns about the idea receiving undue weight. So far as I have seen, there has yet to be presented any evidence that any reliable source has made the claim regarding the rock that you make, or any of the other claims you put forward as well. On that basis, the content cannot be responsibly added to wikipedia. If and when a reliable source does make such a contention, then there would be no objection to including the information somewhere in wikipedia, maybe here, maybe elsewhere. However, until and unless a reliable source, as defined by the WP:RS page makes that contention, and provided the content does not place undue relative weight on the theory as per WP:Undue weight, we cannot by policy include such content in any article. John Carter 15:11, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

I just can't even imagine a source that could make that claim besides me the pope and God, and so I guess I will bow to your wishes unless you might somehow suggest what a reliable source might look like on the earth that could identify that as an Elohim? You and I both know the journal Nature is not going to publish any article of that nature and also I cannot even post image snapshots from google earth, so I guess at the end of the day Wikipedia is not flexible enough to deal with the real world and the facts as they present themselves. Thanks for your time. Rick S33555 17:20, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

WP:Reliable source answers your question. --Ghostexorcist 19:59, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Well this is the only reliable source I have for you. But of course it doesn't say what it is, and so it requires a great deal of understanding to know what it is. Thats Hecate, thats the underworld and thats an Elohim head with bat wings to signify Catholicism. And I can pass that information on, but its not satisfactory for Wikipedia's guidelines regarding reference to that specific head in question and as such, I am sure you understand that I would be unable to prove that it is, and so once again I have to just leave it to others to write scholarly texts and then perhaps it can be used. Rick S33555 18:57, 13 October 2007 (UTC)


This is some kind of trolling, scifi, role-playing, whatever other kind of spam[1]. Just auto-revert it. 24.243.3.27 (talk) 18:37, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

"I got a rock." -- Charles Brown, It's the Great Pumpkin, Charlie Brown (1966)  Mr JM  02:19, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

Please God, may I never sit next to this man on a ten-hour flight!PiCo (talk) 05:27, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

I found this interesting - as this part of the live article this point... "Certain wise men of old wrote concerning them, and say in their [sacred] books that angels came down from heaven and mingled with the daughters of Cain, who bare unto them these giants. But these [wise men] err in what they say. God forbid such a thing, that angels who are spirits, should be found committing sin with human beings. Never, that cannot be. And if such a thing were of the nature of angels, or Satans, that fell, they would not leave one woman on earth, undefiled ... But many men say, that angels came down from heaven, and joined themselves to women, and had children by them. This cannot be true. But they were children of Seth, who were of the children of Adam, that dwelt on the mountain, high up, while they preserved their virginity, their innocence and their glory like angels; and were then called 'angels of God.' But when they transgressed and mingled with the children of Cain, and begat children, ill-informed men said, that angels had come down from heaven, and mingled with the daughters of men, who bear them giants." ... and it is not cited/referenced to anything. If a quote need citing to be part of the article, then this part needs to be cited or removed. - WereTech (talk) 05:57, 16 August 2018 (UTC)

The source is The Conflict of Adam and Eve with Satan, as the quote is preceeded by saying that it comes from "the Conflict". You are right though, this should be cited to a translation.
But shouldn't this have been posted in a new section at the bottom of the talk page?--Ermenrich (talk) 13:31, 16 August 2018 (UTC)

I'm more confused now than ever

I've read what Wikipedia has for the definition for Nephilim. However, after reading this material I'm more confused now than ever. I'm an avid reader of the bible daily needing some clarity on this race of people. I've concluded that this race of people or group was as Adam (tall) but world renowned now that gives me just pause here. Was Noah and the people of that day what short, non-warriors or what? The Nephilims are mentioned after the flood so what gives and where did they originate? I may have to wait until I'm face to face with the Son of God, Jesus to know. Too many ifs in this content. therecabites@yahoo.com```` —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.155.97.18 (talk) 15:27, 26 January 2010 (UTC)

The peoples of that day were quite short by today's standards, with a few exceptions e.g. some Nordic, and African races, and Neanderthals. http://www.naturalheightgrowth.com/2012/12/20/how-tall-is-the-height-of-jesus-christ/. The only mention of Nephilim are in the Bible, so there is no more information, and currently everything else is speculation. BruceTutty (talk) 09:14, 1 January 2016 (UTC)

Not to start an argument that seems to already have been started here, but the Sumerians were around before the Bible was written. I suggest you check out Sumerian mythology and make your own comparisons and conclusions. In my own view point (which by standards does not need to be said when writing, but people often time neglect to understand), the beginning of the Bible are nothing more than condensed versions of Sumerian Mythology; including the creation story, humanity being cast out of Eden, Noah, the flood, and the Tower of Babel, etc. As I said, read the Sumerian myths for yourself and make your own conclusions. WereTech (talk) 06:04, 16 August 2018 (UTC)

Reference here "Parallels Some stories recorded in the older parts of the Hebrew Bible bear strong similarities to the stories in Sumerian mythology. For example, the biblical account of Noah and the Great Flood bears a striking resemblance to the Sumerian deluge myth, recorded in a Sumerian tablet discovered at Nippur.[33]:97–101 The Judaic underworld Sheol is very similar in description with the Sumerian Kur, ruled by the goddess Ereshkigal, as well as the Babylonian underworld Irkalla. Sumerian scholar Samuel Noah Kramer has also noted similarities between many Sumerian and Akkadian "proverbs" and the later Hebrew proverbs, many of which are featured in the Book of Proverbs.[34]:133–135"[1] WereTech (talk) 06:10, 16 August 2018 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sumerian_religion

Has anyone else ever noticed this?

If you look at the way the text is written, it basically just says "the sons of god did it with the daughters of man, and the nephilim were on the earth in those days" technically there's no causative relationship between those two. It might even just be saying "back in the time of heroes, the sons of god got it on with the daughters of man" . are there any, like, sources from biblical scholars regarding this? Not that it would solve anything, it'd actually raise even more questions if they were unrelated... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.73.70.113 (talk) 00:57, 4 November 2009 (UTC)

Agreed, there is no linguistic link in English, they are two different statements. Perhaps this depends on the punctuation having a different meaning in Greek, Latin, or Hebrew. The English translation says that the "sons of god did it with the daughters of man", and after a comma says that "and the nephilim were on the earth in those days". BruceTutty (talk) 09:00, 1 January 2016 (UTC)

Yes, there is a scholarly source that makes exactly that observation--and promotes that as the correct reading! It is Keil and Delitzsch's 10 vol Commentary on the Old Testament. I think the summary statement at the top of this article needs to be changed because it endorses only one interpretation--the most popular--but the most incorrect! The Genesis text does not support the conclusion that the Nephilim were the offspring of the mentioned union. The summary statement at the top of the article should simply indicate that the Nephilim poorly-understood figures that are mentioned in the Bible, particularly in Genesis. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.177.110.46 (talk) 18:13, 25 July 2018 (UTC)

It is thought by some that the Neanderthals or Homo heidelbergensis include the Nephilim.137.118.99.79 (talk) 02:43, 18 April 2019 (UTC)

Numbers and Ezekiel

As I said in my edit summary, we don't clarify whether there is any relationship between the use of the name in Numbers and its use in Genesis.

"Westermann (1974:511-512) points out that in Gen 6:4 the Nephilim were identified with the ‘heroes that were of old, warriors of renown’ and that there was nothing mythical here. But the Nephilim of 4a, in the light of Ezek 32:27, are clearly mythical. He concludes that two narrative conclusions were blended in 6:4, one following the mythical line, the other simply the etiological line. The thrust of the mythical line was the telling of the story of the transgression of the divine order which ensured the separation of gods and men in accordance with the theme of similar stories in the primeval narrative (cp. Gen 3 and 11). Later traditions ‘historicized’ the Nephilim and transformed them either into the legendary precursors of the Israelites in Canaan or elaborated the tradition of fallen angelic beings who were actively engaged in stirring mankind into rebellion against divine authority." fromD the Dictionary of Deities and Demons in the Bible By Karel van der Toorn, Bob Becking, Pieter Willem van der Horst.[2] Doug Weller talk 10:31, 9 April 2018 (UTC)

info

WP:TLDR from the Greek twin of Zecharia Sitchen
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

Ξυπνάτε ρεεεε

Here is in english a short summary of Dimosthenis Liakopoulos trilogies from why and how they live amongst us:

"Before many billions of years, what we call "graceful and omnipotent God" mainly because of the joy that is given from life itself and the existence to every being, created the Angels (spirits) and the Elohim (fire flames). Built the angelic creatures other intangible (spirits) and other with energic body (fire flame). The Angels carry the message of God while the Elohim are the functionaries of God by performing in practice the will. From the beginning of creation, there is the meaning of existence and rightfully the meaning of non existence, since the universe that was created is essentially the universe of opposites. Because it seems God didn't wanted the abolition of the existences and the transition of them to a state of non existence, decided to create the human and assign him one ancient mission, which was nothing else than to ensure the existence of the whole creation that God would had created especially for him. After "announcing" the creation of the material universe, the archangel Samael from the genus Ofanim, which had been designated as responsible for the harmony (the so called musical harmony) of the universe, when he learned that humans would be created, beings with spirit and body and capability of evolvement to reach the divine and perform the purpose for which they were created, disagreed with the decision of God to entrust this task to humans and defected from God and made great war in the universe having with his side the Angels who agreed with him the so called Nahrben (demons). The final intervention of the first Elohim, the first and most ancient creation of God brought Samael "tethered" before God. Then Samael deducted from the grace of God and was given only two powers. One to the world of spirits and one to the world of matter. In the world of spirits was given the power to approach anyone he wants and say whatever he wants (to put thoughts). In the world of matter was given the power to interfere in the atoms of matter. What we call atom and is so small that it is invisible to the eye. Looks like a small solar system. In the center instead of the sun is the core and around instead of the wandering planets are the wandering electrons at various distances. The power of Samael is to expel from the atom the most remote, the last electron, and it would be fair to do so. This "self explanatory" process to nowadays is the cause of electricity existance and was to disturb the material universe. Initially Samael didn't had the ability to activate it because the universe belonged to human who didn't had done something wrong, so that his universe, his "home" essentially, to suffer any damage from Samael. When Samael convinced humans that they can, like him, play the "gods" and exist without the God but to "exist" with the non "God" the humans deducted from Paradise (the third sphere of creation) and lost their powers that had over their world and activated Samael's power to expel the last electron. So humans lost their energic incorruptible bodies, since Samael had the power of damaging them not only spiritually but also physically. Then humans with their corruptible biological bodies were subject to the laws of evolution of species. Around 40.000 B.C. two hundred and one of the Elohim, the angelic creatures with the energic bodies, deducted after the influence of Samael, transformed into human beings and joined the humans who created the genus of Titans-Gigades or as they called themselves Nefelim. The leader of these angelic creatures, that were eventually persuaded by Samael and opposed to the mission that had been assigned to them by God was Rahvel Semieza from the genus of Elohim. The first join was done to the largest for that time city of humans, who were not as many "think" residents of the caves. The city was called Aradis, which meant the city of valley. It extended east of mount Olympus, where now is Katerini until Thessaloniki since Thermaikos bay didn't exist. The first Nefelim were of two types. The anthropomorphic cyan Giants that were born from humans and the batmorphic Nahsramon that were born from Lilith Lamasthu (the abomination of the revelation), who was the first female human that was created and alone deducted from Paradise because she wanted to kill and Adam and for her replacement Eve was created (which means Life). The first "gods" were the deducted Elohim themselves, the second generation of "gods" were their children the Nefelim and the subsequent generations of beings that were also named "gods" were the monstrous filthy genera of beings that were created by cloning the "divine" DNA and mixing it with various animals, so were created the so called filthy genera to fight in wars, the Satyrs, the Griffins, the Minotaurs, the Reptilians, the Centaurs, the Cyclopes, the Hecatonchires and so on. The Nefelim according to all the ancient texts of all peoples and all religions were beings "immortal" and omnipotent. They were only killed by copper that was strong poison for them. The Nefelim became the biggest scourge ever faced by human, because initially they ate the toil of the humans and then the humans themselves who were for the defiled and genus of slaves and food of the "gods" who fought each other for power of the fake, virtual world. The technology at that time reached to very high levels and humans lived in a world technologically very developed, but suffered because for the "gods" they were nothing else than "consumables" (food) or Goim as they called them. Around 33.000 B.C. was created the caste of Zeus that descended from the cyan Giants and saved humans. Zeus created the genus of El that were philanthropists and had their base to Olympus in the country that now is called Ellas and was called then El-Las (which means base of the El). The El fought in Titanomahia-Gigadomahia against all the other "gods" and defeated and expelled them from the face of Earth and closed them to Tartara, the copper hollow interior of the Earth that was created by Elohim El Sedai. The Titanomahia-Gigadomahia was fought on the Earth, on the Moon, on the Mars and on other worlds. The governance of the El followed which was completely different to the humans, who although were vassals to the new "gods" the El, but were not slaves and above all food of the "gods". For this reason Zeus is mentioned in ancient texts as savior Zeus while the El as benefactors of the humans. Then around 23.000 B.C., the El led by Apollon took instruction from God and left Earth for the constellation of Sirius, but some, who were led by Zeus and stayed on Earth were punished because they wanted another millennial prolongation of their power and their leaders headed by Zeus were closed inside crystal capsules and confined in the depths of the second highest mountain in the world, the so called mountain without name, symbolically called K-2, in Karakoram, north of Himalayas. The humans continued their lives with technology remnant of the era of the "gods", who after their removal from the Earth left their technology heritage to humans. Around 10.000 B.C. - 9.600 B.C. according to Platon, the Ellines who were descendants of the El (El-Lin which means the one who lives with the thinking of the El), fought with the children of darkness of the Nefelim, the Atlanteans. The Atlanteans were defeated and vanished, but the whole planet returned to stone age and from there begins the paleolithic period, then the neolithic period, then the copper age and so on. Since then, after that war, the events that occurred enabled the Nefelim to have tens of thousands watchers in the form of human beings that "live amongst us". They oversee the events so that the humans who have the Earth's surface never get in the interior and destroy them. Nowadays, the technology of the Nefelim is greatly superior to humans. But there was a time when human technology could destroy them. So they were given the power to "live amongst us", affecting from the background the lives of the humans and are separated into two major brotherhoods. The Black brotherhood (old world order) that ruled undisturbed until about 1.750 A.D. controlling puppet kings and the White brotherhood (new world order) that from 1.750 A.D. started to control everything, controlling the governments of pseudodemocracies (since the so called democratic governments are a global joke and never work for the interest of human populations) which replaced the governments of kings, which also expelled or turned into puppets. After 1.900 A.D. the White brotherhood decided to gradually reintroduce the technology of the "gods" to control more effectively the increasing world population of the humans that they want to reduce. That presence of the Nefelim took advantage the deducted archangel Samael (devil) to implement the infernal plan of world domination over the earth under the reign of his son leadership the antichrist. The plan of his is expressed by the 25 protocols of iniquity. To protect the helpless humans Elohim El Sedai created a control system that controls the entire solar system. The plan of Samael that is based largely on the existence and effects of electricity is almost complete. That plan, needless to say, is applied in absolute secrecy, since the existence of the Nefelim and the El has become since ancient years a legend and the legend became a myth and with the myths they say only the mindless are interested. Nowadays people consider that for all around them are responsible the governments that supposedly govern states and supposedly are elected by "free" elections. Those who consider that they understand a few things more, consider that the governments are pressured by the so called "strong" countries, such as America, Germany, Russia and so on. The more advanced consider that behind all hides the international capital that has no country, but governs all the world's governments. The conspiracy theorists consider that behind the capital are hiding the Hebrews who want to dominate in this complicated world and bring the Zionist dictatorship, since they believe that their Yahweh has promised them this futile world. So they took all banks, all multinational firms, companies, all governments, all United Nation, all NATO, all Hollywood, all media, all educational system and all administrative mechanisms of religions, promoting the plan of their global sovereignty. I ask the conspiracy theorists. What do you consider most probable? the Hebrews to be such intellects and so superintelligent and have achieved something like that? or behind all is hiding someone that is immortal and having millions of helpers around the world and trying for thousands of years to set up the global control and the global state without having the stress of timing restrictions as we humans have? Anyway all have their great plans either they want, either they don't want they will do the plan of the God in the end."

The section with the heading Related Terms reads:

In the Hebrew Bible, there are a number of other words which, like "nephilim", are sometimes translated as "giants":

Anunnaki Emim Rephaim Anakim Gibborim

However, to the best of my knowledge, after searching various online versions of the Bible, the word Annunaki doesn't appear anywhere in the Hebrew scriptures, including apocryphal sources. If that's the case, then this section is misleading for suggesting that Annunaki appears in the Bible. I just wanted to discuss before editing the section in case I'm missing or misunderstanding something.

Also, I notice that the two posts above mine, from Ξυπνάτε ρεεεε (Greek for Wake uuuuup!), seem to be peddling some bizarre fringe theories from someone who's the Greek equivalent of a televangelist. Does this stuff get moderated?

~~Mpaniello~~

@Mpaniello: I've removed Anunnaki, as it doesn't belong there. I've closed the above sections. They're WP:FRINGE, but one could imagine that that individual is trying (in their own way) to suggest changes to the article (even if those changes will never happen), which is why I didn't just remove them.
Also, please sign your posts with four tildes (~~~~) without sticking your name in the middle of them. Ian.thomson (talk) 17:35, 2 August 2018 (UTC)

Thanks so much, Ian, and sorry for the signature error, still getting the hang of things! Mpaniello (talk) 21:41, 2 August 2018 (UTC)

info

WP:TLDR from the Greek twin of Zecharia Sitchen
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

Ξυπνάτε ρεεεε

From Dimosthenis Liakopoulos trilogies, why and how they live amongst us:

The Nefelim tribes are:

The Slaveh tribe (these ones are as devils with "human" body).

The Nahsramon tribe and the Bahomeh tribe (these ones have bat wings and "human" body and head, alias Batmen).

The Valah tribe (these ones have goat feet and head and "human" body).

The Narudh tribe (these ones have goat feet and "human" body and head, alias Satyrs).

The Lahmeh tribe (these ones have wings, lion body and eagle head, alias Griffins).

The Losdveh tribe (these ones have lion head and "human" body).

The Maltseh tribe (these ones have wolf head and "human" body, alias Lycanthires).

The Kahreh tribe (these ones have bull head and "human" body, alias Minotaurs).

The Kahsnah tribe (these ones have lizard head and "human" body, alias Reptilians).

The Saherneh tribe (these ones have eagle head and "human" body).

The Mashraveh tribe (these ones have wings, bull body and "human" head, alias Sphinxes).

The Revah tribe (these ones have horse body and "human" hands and head, alias Centaurs).

The Dusveh tribe (these ones are as "humans" but they have one eye, alias Cyclopes).

The Zashradeh tribe (these ones are as "humans" but they have six hands, alias Hecatonchires).

The Kasrabah tribe (these ones are as "humans" but their head is to their waist).

The Vasraneh tribe (these ones are as "humans" but they have grey body, alias Greys the so called grey "aliens").

The Kronian tribes that have the Ran tribe, the Hebre tribe and the cyan Giants tribe (these ones are as "humans").

And the "new" tribes of the Nefelim that combine biological and mechanical parts are:

The Kasponeh (they are as insects with six legs).

The Kalhak (they are as locusts with eight legs and bat head).

The Bararna (they are divided into non flying and flying, the non flying ones are of two types, the ones that are as brontosaurus with four legs and the ones with two legs while the flying ones are as reptiles with wings).

The Darpasah (they are as dogs with four legs).

All these tribes are separated into seventy two kings with seventy two kingdoms as much as the seventy two portals to Tartara (hollow Earth).

They are to Earth since fourty two thousand years.

Now they're super-heros.. wait, WHAT?

Incomprehensible rant

In the section relating the Sons of God to fallen angels, this rather bizarre statement can be found: From this parallelism it could be inferred that the sons of God are understood as some superhuman beings.[21]

Never mind that the concept of being divine beings has NO relation to any sort of human subspecies.. it is UTTERLY out of place under a section making the point of the Sons of God being fallen angels.

Just to be certain that it wasn't a misquote, I went to the original article to verify. It actually IS a misquote, but the author of the original article is making various wild suppositions, so personally, I would just strike the comment entirely.

Note that the preceding comment about the fallen angels having male anatomy but being of godly origin is almost equally out of place, as angels in general are sexless in the first place. This statement should be tagged and just deleted entirely unless someone can show how the fallen angels were granted the ability to HAVE a sex and procreate, possibly sourced in the apocrypha, catechisms or etc.

Finally, I would like to note that the CreationWiki article on the old Hebrew term Bene Ha Elohim does a MUCH MUCH better job of explaining the Sons of God as being of divine origin than the one here does. http://www.creationwiki.org/Bene_Elohim

---

Below I noted various, ridiculously hotheaded and lengthy, discussions on whether or not Nephilim are mentioned in Sumerian texts. They in fact ARE mentioned. As I recall, the actual term (Nephilim) translates almost directly, in actual fact. The problem is that THAT research predates the internet and quick access to questionable information. It also predates the modern understanding of the 'Anunnaki' entirely, and is actually unrelated. That's why the Anunnaki 'researcher' was unable to locate the source of the information readily. I believe that with a bit of ACTUAL research and effort, either author of the diatribe below could have found the source information faster than the lengthy argument took.

However, I just checked the Wikipedia page on the Anunnaki.. and it begins with the wild statement that the Anunnaki were universally recognized in ALL of the ancient pantheons. HORSE MANURE!! In the first place, even the word itself Anunnaki is of questionable translation, let alone it's loosely interpreted translation of events. In the second place, I would LOVE to hear somebody squarely place an alien race in to the middle of the Akkadian legends. Talk about a square peg in a round hole. Somebody is smoking some serious crack.

Ok so, on a related note, the guy with the OPINION that Sumerian mythology precedes the Bible.. WRONG. The written Bible predates every other derivative work on the planet (for obvious reasons other than academic). Even Baal is an obvious bastardization of the Cain story. The inverse is ludicrous. Note that while we may have reason to doubt that Ethiopian translations are cannon, we CAN relatively safely respect their records relating to the oldest written copies of the bible.. which as I said, predates every other pantheon in existence, including Baal and even archaic Goddess worship (Wicca).

Wicca is commonly recognized as the worlds oldest religion simply by the merit that in the days of Adam and Eve, nobody actually WORSHIPPED God. God walked the earth in the days of the garden and after. The first inkling of worship is when Cain and Able both (spontaneously) decided to offer God gifts out of thanks (not worship). The rest, as they say.. is history. ^^

--- Finally, the reason I came here in the first place.. I've run across an article stating that the....

Never mind, I found more inconsistencies on the Ell page. I think I answered my own question while postulating on that Talk page (still curious why 3,000 ells isn't mentioned on THIS page):


Someone do some quick math for me and figure out how tall a hominid 3,000 ells would be?

Uh-huh. I just saw some other article from someone (obviously using this as their source) claiming that the Nephilim MUST have been 2.4 miles tall. I didn't check his actual math, but based on this interpretation, I think I know where he got that idea.

First off, the cubit and ell were confused and cross referenced in definition in medieval times. THAT'S why you have wildly different measurements dating from the old testament compared to relatively modern interpretations. As correctly mentioned below, the term was generally defined by whichever local monarch carried the biggest stick (not a pun for ruler).

In addition, there is a large amount of confusion about HOW the length of an ell was determined in ancient times. It's obvious that no one here is privy to that information. It is commonly understood that the length of an ell was measured by forming the shape an 'L' with some joint of the fingers, wrist or elbow. Obviously, it would be impossible to get a measurement of 45" using this methodology, without detaching some part of your arm to do it. Now maybe I'm over-simplifying the matter (on the other hand my best guess is as good as anyone elses' guess), but my best L is made by using my thumb and forefinger to make the traditional 'Loser' hand gesture. (Ok, honestly, I'm recalling a pre-internet based scholarly exposition on the topic which used this same modality). The distance from my thumb to forefinger in this position is (oddly) six inches, precisely. (I am 6' 2" tall.) Let's adjust for Old testament men being significantly shorter (4' 6" to 5') that brings us to 4.5" or 5". (Hmm, 4.5" verses 45".. HMM..) I'm going to guess that human nature hasn't changed in the last few millennia, and that the king was the tall handsome burly guy.. so we'll use 5" as the 'kings measure'.

5" x 3,000 (ells) = 15,000 inches = 1,250 feet = still ludicrous.

Now I can't recall the logic of it, but since they can categorically throw the 5" figure out, they had some logic to use the width of a finger next. They had some logic to relate the width of the finger to a centimeter, so I'll just follow that..

1cm x 3,000 = 3,000cm / 2.54 = 1182 in. = 98.5 ft. = implausible, but POSSIBLE

Personally I always pictured the Nephilim as somewhere in the neighborhood of 15-20 ft. tall. Largely due to David vs. Goliath legends I suppose. HOWEVER, the author in question compares the description of the Nephilim in the various biblical references to the description of the titans.. which is PERFECTLY in line with this! Everyone on the planet pictures the Kraken as a giant squid, even BEFORE modern science had FOUND a giant squid! (Untwist that logic, I'll wait. ;) )

THEN I noticed an ASTOUNDING correlation. Let's look at the Hebrew passage: The Nephilim were in the earth in those days, | | and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bore children to them; the same were the mighty men that were of old, the men of renown.

The place where I separated the two statements is where it is commonly noted that the one does not NECESSARILY relate to the other.

Now the next statement:

And there we saw the Nephilim, || the sons of Anak, || who come of the Nephilim; and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.

WUT..? This appears to be describing three different groups of people.. unless we transliterate Nephilim to the literal giants.. THEN we can read it as describing two different races..

And there we saw the Giants, the sons of Anak, || who come of the (old?) Giants; and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.[12]

I hereby offer the postulation that the ONE race of Giants, the SONS of Anak, commonly referred to as Nephalim (the Titans) were in the order of 100 feet tall. I offer that there was a SECOND race of Giants, the Anak of which Goliath was a party, in the order of twenty feet tall. This race of giants aligns with various other global cultural myths of giants around the world.. including the slightly ridiculous legend of the Annunaki.. if you translated it less loosely to mean 'aliens from some far fetched planet on an orbit around the sun which couldn't support life'. :D

Is it following the scientific method precisely, well no, but it's logical without any far stretches of the imagination. Personally, I think the logic flows in a BEAUTIFUL ways with enough coincidences to make it a serious possibility by definition alone, let alone what appears to be some next-level genius on my part.

Ok, I'm done here. That's my epiphany of the day. Take it for what it is, that's all I ask. :)

...Ok, one final final thought.. did the Greek empire ever reach far enough that we could posit that Mt. Olympus was originally located in Israel? Ok, NOW I think I'm done making epiphanies for the day. :) Crogonint (talk) 23:29, 30 August 2018 (UTC)

Holy cow. I do not even know how to respond to this wall of text. Maybe if you slowed down and suggested some specific way to improve the article we could get somewhere. Maybe. Alephb (talk) 00:21, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
I kind of doubt it. Any way we can get an admin to box this off so it doesn't take up the whole talk page?--Ermenrich (talk) 02:07, 31 August 2018 (UTC)

SERIOUSLY?? My first few points were rather basic and clear cut. That's why I put them at the top. Just exactly how is it too difficult to distinguish between an angelic being and a super-human one? Absolutely ludicrous.

The rest of my initial points are just as remedial. Claiming that you can't follow them is revealing volumes about your character.

If you can't follow my logic in the latter half, I can't fault you there. Occasionally my genius even surprises me. ^^

I won't even bother complaining about the 'incomprehensible rant' label. Any sufficiently advanced technology could be labeled as magic. Similarly, I'll just assume that you're acting like heathens when you label my (rather short, actually) explanation as 'incomprehensible'.

Whatever.

Just trying to help you knowledgeable authors provide correct and discernible information that the masses can comprehend. If you're not capable of that.. perhaps you should just step down. Crogonint (talk) 19:09, 4 September 2018 (UTC)

@Crogonint: "Superhuman" means "more powerful than human." The term predates "superhero" by a good bit. Your post appears to be a mixture of Stream of consciousness and possibly copied dialogue (with no indication of who is saying what). Please expand your vocabulary and be more concise instead of rambling and blaming others.
Wikis (including Wikipedia) are not accepted as reliable sources because they are user generated (not professionally published). Creationwiki would qualify as a WP:FRINGE source.
Wikipedia does not engage in original research. All we do is cite, summarize, and paraphrase professionally-published mainstream academic or journalistic sources. The talk page is for article improvement, not general discussion or tangents that are only apparently relevant to the person posting them. Ian.thomson (talk) 19:43, 4 September 2018 (UTC)
The "no original research" policy is to safeguard the slower editors like myself. If I had to be exposed to high-quality research like the above on a regular basis, I would feel sad and inadequate, and would have to leave Wikipedia in shame. But rephrasing stuff found in mainstream academic sources -- that I can handle. Alephb (talk) 23:23, 4 September 2018 (UTC)

Nephilim (Nefilem) of Genasis 6:4 were Extraterrestrials

I added... Some have claimed that the “sons of God” and/or the Nephilim of Genesis 6:4 were aliens.<ref]https://christiananswers.net/q-aig/aig-c036.html </ref] 2601:580:B:954A:158E:C2B3:2CC1:E91C (talk) 15:30, 12 December 2019 (UTC)

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