Talk:Nancy Heche

calling for discussion

This article was nominated for deletion. Unfortunately, the prime reason for the nomination seems to be a perceived bias -- which really should have been discussed, and fixed, here, rather than an immediate jump to trying to delete the article.

In looking for references I found several writers who identify themselves as gay, who offered some cogent criticisms of Heche. The following reference contained information that I thought seemed significant.

• Daniel Kusner asserts Nancy's book doesn't apologize for, or acknowledge, that she failed to protect her children from sexual abuse from her husband.
• Daniel Kusner asserts Nancy Heche and her husband used Cocaine, in spite of portraying themselves as religious conservatives.
  • Daniel A. Kusner (2006-10-12). "Mommie Fearest: Nancy Heche". Spread magazine. Retrieved 2012-05-04. When she's not thoroughly detailing the minutiae of Don and Nancy's budding romance at Bible camp, Nancy's book primarily focuses on Don's deception. She continually explains that even though Don was a raging freak and obvious liar, she never answered the constant ringing of the Clue Phone. Faith in her Bible-sanctioned marriage made Nancy blind, deaf and stupid.

"...she never answered the constant ringing of the Clue Phone." That is a very creative phrase.

So, who is Kusner, and what is this reference?

Kusner calls it Spread Magazine -- but it seems to be a blog, ie no editor. On the other hand I googled him, he is a published writer. Some people do publish what they call blogs, which should not be dismissed as "just a blog", because the author has already established that they are a reliable authoritative source.

If sex columnist Dan Savage, for instance, writes a blog, it would be an WP:RS, without regard to whether he wrote it without an editor.

I am not going to use this reference by Kusner, yet, as I would like other's input as to whether this reference should be considered an RS.

Cheers! Geo Swan (talk) 15:18, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

Anne Heche talks about her mother here. I don't know can we include sentence or two from this nytimes interview?--В и к и T 15:38, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

update following {{afd}}?

There were a number of valid concerns raised during the {{afd}} for this article. I argued there that those concerns weren't grounds for deletion, and that they should instead be discussed on the talk page.

Well, it has been about 8 months now, and I don't see any further discussion. Maybe those with concerns were tuckered out by the {{afd}} discussion?

Anyhow, I left my note, above, eight months ago, so I included Kusner's comment. Geo Swan (talk) 21:54, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

College professor and psychotherapist...

Hmmm. If an individual is a professor or psychotherapist I'd expect the article to say where they had worked as a professor, and where they earned their credentials as a therapist.

The article currently asserts she is a professor and psychotherapist, but I don't see where this is substantiated.

Multiple occupations provide counseling, not just psychiatrists and clinical psychologists. Social workers, mental health nurses, and some religious ministers also provide mental health counseling. Ministers who provide counseling usually have at least a minor in psychology, durint their undergrad. In addition there are individuals, like peer drug counselors, who may provide counseling with no actual academic training, at all. Of these groups, if I am not mistaken only psychiatrists and clinical psychologists get called psychotherapists.

If this problem still exists, when I next visit this article, I will correct these claims. Geo Swan (talk) 23:41, 25 October 2020 (UTC)

College Professor and psychotherapist - I also was looking for Nancy Heche's professional credentials. NONE LISTED! Very weird that nothing is mentioned regarding where she attended college, work experiences, etc. I am not saying it is wrong for her to use her personal life experiences and her beliefs to help others. But, if she is using a "title" such as this, which traditionally requires a college degree, why not include this information in her bio? Where's the fact checkers?

Update: I searched google where did Nancy Heche attend college? - Found this top line with no source: She has an education degree from Indiana University and had worked as a school teacher, a stockbroker and a banker before becoming a counselor. She and her husband, Don Heche, had five children.

I know if you impersonate a police office, you get arrested. You cannot just say you are a teacher and get a job without credentials, and so on. You get the idea. Maybe she went back to college later in life, but the void leaves the reader with questions. Wikipedia should research and update with more accurate and specific information about Nancy Heche's education and credentials for psychotherapist.

Thanks, M Capozzia 2/28/2022 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2603:9001:2105:60FC:75E4:76A9:AB4:F292 (talk) 05:42, 28 February 2022 (UTC)

Nancy Heche's memoir does in fact discuss her educational background. Her field is pastoral counseling, which is somewhere between being a minister and being a therapist. She holds master's and doctorate degrees in this field, not from sketchy bible colleges, but from Northwestern and Loyola, in addition to the earlier Indiana University degree. Like it or not, her educational background is legitimate. BTW, that says nothing of her views one way or the other - she'd be far from the first academic with to subscribe to unscientific ideas - the world is full of such people. I'll note here that it's important to treat Nancy Heche as a subject of a WP:BLP and also subject to the same WP:NPOV that any other article topic is due, rather than looking for ways to "trash" her in the ariticle. One doesn't have to agree with her views at all (I sure don't) to maintain a neutral and encyclopedic tone. Peter G Werner (talk) 22:17, 22 August 2022 (UTC)

Needs cleanup

I do think Nancy Heche is a notable figure independent of daughter Anne Heche given her history of high-profile Christian right activism since 2005. Albeit, a subject of only moderate notability, which really should only be the subject of a short article outlining her biography and her controversial views and activism in a neutral manner.

In its current state, the article is in serious need of cleanup, as the current state of it is poorly sourced and not reflective of the standards of WP:BLP, and has WP:NPOV issues as well. Another big issue is that half the article is about Anne Heche's book, which is WP:UNDUEWEIGHT. And there's very little sourcing from Nancy Heche's memoir The Truth Comes Out - one does not have to agree *at all* with Nancy Heche's views or the highly-religious language of the book to glean useful autobiographical facts about the subject of the article. Related discussion at Talk:Anne_Heche#The_Heche_family.

Peter G Werner (talk) 22:30, 22 August 2022 (UTC)

Update: I've edited the article to remove the most blatantly POV statements so as to resolve that issue. I still think the article could be much better sourced, better organized, and not give undue weight to Nancy Heche's relationship with daughter Anne Heche. A complete rewrite would probably be for the best. For the outline and simple facts of her life, her memoir, The Truth Comes Out is generally the best source, and far preferable to the claims stated in derivative sources. This is regardless of what you think about Heche's views - the memoir is reliable for its timeline and statement of basic biographical facts. In terms of her activism, both her self-description and views of her critics (notably, Anne Heche) are worth stating, per WP:NPOV. Peter G Werner (talk) 20:48, 29 August 2022 (UTC)