Talk:Marvel's young adult television series

Proposing deletion of this article.

There is nothing unique to this article that is not already covered in other MCU articles, or that can’t be condensed. Considering the shows are only connected by a single crossover that was not planned in the same way the Defenders Saga shows were in the beginning (i.e. announced with the intention to be interconnected), and they’re not even from the same network, the article here grouping them together seems a bit forced. If we wanted to keep them together we could simply keep them together on the List of Marvel Cinematic Universe TV Shows page without having this page too. ChimaFan12 (talk) 01:27, 25 July 2023 (UTC)

We are not merging this back into the TV series list, as we are trying to avoid that becoming too long. That was one of the reasons why these article splits were done a few years back. This is not a "forced" connection and is supported by the same comments Loeb gave and how they connected the two series and had detailed plans for more young adult series, such as the unaired New Warriors, which is also included here. This is exactly the type of nuclear option I cautioned we avoid, and starting yet another discussion across these articles is not helpful. The different networks and cast and connectivity only add credence to this separate group article's existence. We are not going to upend all of this work and navigation because you don't like it. This article also includes: "He [Loeb] said Marvel had wanted to cross the two series over since their first seasons, and this was possible now since Hulu became Disney controlled in May 2019 (Disney already owned Freeform)." Trailblazer101 (talk) 07:27, 25 July 2023 (UTC)

How are you going to accuse me of executing a nuclear option when I’m here to make a proposal and go through the process? What I’m suggesting is that the article wouldn’t be too long. Just as with the AIF article, all this content can be condensed and put on a page with those other subjects. I also don’t understand the fear about the pages being too long, frankly. Given the limited scope of what’s here, a slightly condensed version improved to remove redundancy would fit perfectly on that page. ChimaFan12 (talk) 08:16, 25 July 2023 (UTC)

Suggesting the deletion of a page which clearly establishes enough detail and information to justify its own existence and to merge it with an already long page doesn't seem helpful, and you were already told in some of the other talk discussions that it is ill-advised and highly unlikely that such merges would be supported. The TV series list article is already filled with information covering the wide scope of the MCU series. It was split up to remain a broad coverage of the series, with more specific details on each group in separate articles to avoid a sub-heading at the list for just one or two different groups when no others would have that there. Not all of the content covered in Development here belongs to one or all of the individual series articles, as this is about the development of the group. For concerns of article length, see WP:Article size (specifically WP:SIZERULE). Again, there was consensus among the MCU editors to perform the splits for these series group articles a few years back, and without any hard justification other than opinion on the difference between this group and the Netflix one, there is no reason for this article to be merged as it clearly stands on its own and would be overshadowed by the rest of the series list if merged there. Trailblazer101 (talk) 12:14, 25 July 2023 (UTC)

In regards to your last sentence, luckily we both know I can hold a conversation for a while. If you look just under WP:SIZERULE, we can see that it discusses content removal which generally suggests that information shouldn’t be tangential. In the case of these shows, given what Marvel has said on the matter, we know that they are, that the association of these shows basically is, and that the information on the page (which again is highly redundant) can certainly be condensed. Let’s have a discussion about how to do that without any of the usual suspects performing WP:OWNERSHIP violations. ChimaFan12 (talk) 19:01, 25 July 2023 (UTC)

I am merely explaining what the prior consensus among MCU taskforce editors was from a few years back, which was not only the editors involved in these discussions. Upholding consensus is not a valid violation of OWNERSHIP. You have not provided sufficient reason for this article to be merged into another one. Condensing information elsewhere is not the answer as it limits what information we provide to our readers, and I fail to see how providing a detailed explanation of this content qualifies deletion or merging. Wanting to delete an article because you don't agree with all of the information there without valid rationale can not stand the guidelines of WP:Articles for deletion, and it does not appear that editors will reverse the prior consensus for these series group splits. Trailblazer101 (talk) 01:39, 26 July 2023 (UTC)

I have provided sufficient reason. The OWNERSHIP kicks in when you revert edits that condense content that is not backed up by consensus and make it so only you and selected members of the taskforce are allowed to make edits without it being up to committee. If the information provided is redundant, as it is here and on Adventure into Fear, condensing it is only a positive thing. ChimaFan12 (talk) 01:44, 26 July 2023 (UTC)

How about this. As you say it could be easily condensed in a few lines added to the main MCU TV series article, why don't you do it at your sandbox and show it here? If it can be effectively done, you'll have a much better case convincing others to do what's essentially a de-split. —El Millo (talk) 03:58, 26 July 2023 (UTC)

This article meets its own notability to justify its existence, and has been split off from the main MCU TV series list for size. Additionally, if this was the only content merged back to main list, it would have too much WP:UNDUE weight when looking at that list as a whole. Each of the distinct sub groups of Marvel Television series have their overview sections at that list to summarize their own lists, which provides a nice balance to each of them. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 14:01, 25 July 2023 (UTC)

It really does not. The grouping of these shows is incredibly tangential and existed more in the realm of possibility than in reality. We can easily condense the crossover information (which is very redundant here, and contradictory, to boot) to a single paragraph on each of the pages under a section entitled Crossovers in the MCU, or in the case of New Warriors, Potential Crossovers, as nothing was ever as concrete as it would only be towards the end of Runaways and Cloak and Dagger’s runs. ChimaFan12 (talk) 19:03, 25 July 2023 (UTC)

There is clear consensus to support the split which led to this article being created, and this discussion is yet another unnecessary attack in your WP:BLUDGEONing campaign to try and change the things about the MCU TV articles that you personally dislike. You do not have the support for any of it and are just being disruptive. - adamstom97 (talk) 05:48, 29 July 2023 (UTC)

I'm having this discussion as a proposal. I have not made any changes nor forced anything onto the page without consensus. Please stop resorting to personal attacks. I have not done the same throughout this entire process. ChimaFan12 (talk) 07:32, 29 July 2023 (UTC)

I will do this. Thank you. ChimaFan12 (talk) 07:17, 29 July 2023 (UTC)