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Page move

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Lloyds have announced the change of name from Lloyds TSB to Lloyds Bank. [1] This presents a problem for article naming as Lloyds Bank already exists with the pre-TSB-merger institution. Looking at the example of Standard Bank (historic) / Standard Bank, the current Lloyds Bank article should move to Lloyds Bank (historic) and Lloyds TSB should move to Lloyds Bank. Any alternative ideas to deal with this? 07:08, 9 September 2013 (UTC)

I agree with the above proposal --AntL (talk) 12:04, 10 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I did the move, but I'm majorly confused about what's what. To me it seems best if this becomes a disambiguation page, linking to all Lloyds financial institutions, of which there seems to be lot. Lloyds Bank (historic) seems like a rather poor disambiguation to me, but I'm unable to come up with anything better myself, so I really can't critisize on that one. Speaking of disambiguation, the page at Lloyd needs some love as well. Martijn Hoekstra (talk) 20:22, 16 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Lloyds Bank has merged with over 50 separate banks over the course of its existence. What is so different about the merger with TSB that means that on that occasion and on no other it became a new and separate entity? Why don't we just have one article for Lloyds Bank from its creation to the present day? JimmyGuano (talk) 20:48, 16 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Don't ask me, I just reacted to the technicalities of the move request, but I think that this time Lloyds TSB took up the brand name Lloyds Bank again. Others will probably know more. Martijn Hoekstra (talk) 21:06, 16 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
It's OK, I wasn't having a go at you, or anyone else for that matter. I just wonder if we're making it all a bit more complicated than it needs to be. If you have to understand the content of our pages before you can understand their structure, then we're putting barriers between our readers and the knowledge and understanding that they're looking for. Where things are complicated (and the corporate history of lloyds bank is) then lets explain it in article content but keep the structure as simple as possible. JimmyGuano (talk) 21:18, 16 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The bank is obviously in a transitional period (with some branches displaying the new name), but is it not a little early to have moved the pages? Lloyds TSB officially becomes Lloyds Bank on 23 September. --AntL (talk) 22:09, 16 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Lloyds Bank (historic) will work for the original bank. Lloyds TSB should not have been moved to Lloyds Bank until the 23 September when the bank will be renamed. This information is included within the lead of (what is now) the Lloyds Bank article. I'd suggest to Martijn Hoekstra that he revert the move as it was made a week too early. I would have raised that at WP:RM but that the discussion would close after the date the bank will be renamed. Cloudbound (talk) 18:37, 17 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I lifted move protected when I performed the requested move to make sure moving back wouldn't be an issue. I suggest that if Cloudbound thinks this is the better action he performs it himself (apparently the new hip way of asking someone to do something is suggesting it in the third person). Martijn Hoekstra (talk) 12:37, 18 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
No need for comments like that Martijn. I did contact you directly to inform you that the name had been changed early. I can't perform the move myself, and requesting it could drag things out past the date the bank is renamed, hence why it would be easier if you reversed your edit. In all honesty though, it doesn't really matter now. Cloudbound (talk) 21:33, 18 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Lloyds Bank (historic) and Lloyds Bank is one idea. Adding/ moving up-to-date content to the (historic) Lloyds Bank page and reverting this to Lloyds TSB is another. 2.27.81.249 (talk) 00:00, 19 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
While apparently it doesn't matter now for this situation, I would like to urge you that if you think something needs to be fixed, just to fix it (like I said on my talk when you contacted me about it). I did lift move protection specifically for the reason the move needed to be reverted or done differently (see also the page logs here). Just fixing it, and have discussion later if it turns out to be an issue is the wiki way. The bold-revert-discuss cycle is an important part of the wiki-workcycle. Dancing around each other to prevent making a change that might offend someone else is often counter-productive as it can lead to stagnation and analyses paralysis and offers more chance of misunderstandings. Martijn Hoekstra (talk) 06:21, 19 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
As I said before, I can't make the change myself because there is a redirect in place. Cloudbound (talk) 17:05, 19 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I didn't notice you mentioning it before, and you can move a page over a redirect (provided the redirect is the only revision in the article history). Martijn Hoekstra (talk) 18:24, 19 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I refer you to my comment dated 21:33, 18 September 2013. Cloudbound (talk) 18:43, 19 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Ah, I completely misunderstood that comment. I thought you meant you couldn't do the original move, and requesting the original would take too long, but now it happened too fast. I didn't realise you meant you couldn't move it back yourself, primarily because you can move it back yourself. Martijn Hoekstra (talk) 18:51, 19 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Merge

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I've had a rethink, and merged the content from Lloyds Bank (historic) here, as there was a fair amount of duplication going on across the two articles. I've made it clear that the bank was named Lloyds TSB Bank plc between 1998 and 2013, and treated this different name as part of the bank's history. I hope you'll all be happy with this merge; I think it has simplified things a lot and the article flows more logically now than it did before. Cloudbound (talk) 18:43, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

2013 logo - vector

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I uploaded the new logo in vector format here: File:Lloyds Bank.svg. However, due to a bug in Wikipedia renderer, the logo does not display correctly - some elements, e.g., the horse's ears, get cut off on screen (even though the image displays correctly in graphics software). I tried various ways to get past this error but unsuccessfully. Anyone is welcome to download this svg image and fiddle with it. kashmiri TALK 00:32, 21 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Asset Protection Scheme

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The main article states that Lloyds Bank negotiated not to join the Asset Protection Scheme. My recollection is that it was pressured into joining it by the then Bank of England Governor: Mervyn King and the Treasury, and then ,on realising that the Scheme was , for Lloyds, in effect, a very expensive missold insurance policy, left the scheme after a matter of months, but was obliged by the authorities to pay £2.5 billion as an exit fee.The Daily Telegraph article "RBS to exit £100bn state insurance scheme" by Henry Wilson, Banking correspondent, on 17.10.12 supports this view. Tonkerty (talk) 11:44, 19 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

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