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Archive 1

English

Have any native English speakers actually edited this article yet? There are words missing and everything. It's a bit un-encyclopedic in its wording and you really need a source for each occurrence otherwise anyone could write anything. Mglovesfun 00:00, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

I went through the article and sourced each occurrence independently (actually, now that I consider it, I probably went a bit overboard). I also removed accounts which were erroneous, non-notable, or unverifiable. -Severa (!!!) 16:44, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Chrnological ordering

It seems neater to have the births in chronological order under each type: I'm going to go ahead and start doing that, I hope no one minds! AniBunny 19:12, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm sorry to undo some of your work, but I just noticed that an anonymous editor made a number of edits in September, and that these negatively impacted the readability of the article by transforming complete sentences into lists of names and also by removing a number of relevant wikilinks. I felt that the only solution was to mass revert to an earlier version rather than to try to sort it out all over again (I cleaned and sourced this article up from top to bottom a few months ago). Feel free to continue chronologizing the entries! Thanks! -Severa (!!!) 19:35, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Looking over the diffs, it is apparent that the entries were originally in chronological order, but that this order was thrown off by the anon's edits. There doesn't seem to be a need for you to remedy the entry ordering any longer. Thanks for helping to call attention to this issue. -Severa (!!!) 19:49, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

A few sets of triplets

I've just done a cleanup on the list of twins and found two sets of triplets mentioned there but not mentioned here. I didn't want to add them here without sourcing them, but the two articles are Garrett, Spencer and Mitchell Gray and Alexandria, McKenzie and Megan Calabrese. It's up to you what you do with this information :) anemone│projectors 01:51, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

Sources?

I couldn't find any reference for the alleged Danes triples+quintuplets. This would seem remarkable, but there's no citation and I couldn't find anything online, so I doubt the veracity. I put in fact tags; hopefully someone can provide a reference, or I'll come back later and remove them. Zander (talk) 02:23, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

40 Grand

I removed the statement htat a lady in toronto had 40,000 babies of the period of 18 years. I beleive it to be false, plain and simple lies —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.168.21.35 (talk) 12:54, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Just checked back on this. It's obviously untrue, but funny!

Quote: In Toronto, Ontario Canada from 1982 to 1990, a 16 year old teenage girl gave birth to 40,000 babies, 26,735 boys and 13,265 girls. It took eight years to give birth to all of those babie's and when her last one was born, she was 24 years old. All of them died and the mother died after her last child was born. Serveal nurses at the hospital quit over the years because they got tired of hearing the girl's screaming of pain--82.0.207.86 (talk) 21:38, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

JW blood transfusion

I definitely oppose the statement (blatantly prejudiced, by the way) that Jehovah's Witness parents in Canada refusing to accept a blood transfusion was the cause of the death of two of their sextuplets. It seems to me that the very high mortality rate among children of higher order multiple births would explain the deaths more feasibly than the refusal of a blood transfusion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 205.237.183.13 (talk) 05:48, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Triplets

While triplets are relatively rare, they are definitely not rare enough for us to mention every single case (I myself knew a set in school). As such, I've removed the cases without a reason for notability. [1] Personally I'd like to trim it more (e.g. the Chapmann triplets) but I'll let it be for now. Nil Einne (talk) 09:31, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

I trimmed a few more as well as some of the unsourced quads, and quads with no claim to notability or distinguishing characteristic. For reference, about 100 sets of quads are born every year in the US, so there needs to be a reason to list beyond that. Probably still more can come out of the triplets and quads lists. --Minderbinder (talk) 18:08, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

don't know how to do references

  • The Stevenson quintuplets, four girls and one boy, born in Seattle Washington March 30, 2006. www.stevensonquints.com

The Jones quintuplets "http://www.joneslife.net" where born in Austin, Texas at Seton Hospital on January 16, 2009.

I took out these web addresses from the quintuplets (5) section but they need to be added back in as references. sorry. anon 09:44, 30 January 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.191.93.192 (talk)

I would have added this, but is it notable enough? It is from http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20051228/dominican_sextuplets_051228?s_name=&no_ads= (And still don't know how to do references . . . .) anon 12:03, 30 January 2009 (UTC)
* The first set of sextuplets in the Dominican Republic were born to Maxima Perez and her husband, Emilio Figuero, on December 28, 2005. They had three boys and three girls. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.191.93.192 (talk) 12:03, 30 January 2009 (UTC)
  • The Haner sextuplets, four boys and two girls, were born to Michelle and Norman Haner in Albany, NY on March 22, 1996 at 28 weeks of gestation. They were the first sextuplets born in New York. Their names are Christian, Ryan, Joshua, Austin, Mary Ellen and Breanna. Published in the Albany Times-Union, March 23, 1996.04:49, 3 February 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bbcatchr (talk • contribs)

Qahtani septuplets

After an extensive online search, I found one reference to the Qahtani septuplets that said one of the babies had died a few months after birth. I added this. I am struck by how little we know of the longterm outcome of other multiples--could find nothing at all on the Qahtanis after 2001.67.122.210.153 (talk) 10:55, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

split off triplets

List of triplets

I believe that the triplets list should be split off, since there are quite alot of triplets in the world, and we have Category:Triplets, so this would be analogous to List of twins and Category:Twins. 76.66.193.90 (talk) 07:28, 1 March 2009 (UTC)

I'd disagree. It really should take a lot for a set of triplets to be notable since they are so common and I think that splitting them would just encourage people to make the list longer and more full of sets that aren't notable. Keep it here and just pare it down. --Minderbinder (talk) 18:17, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

Facts About Multiples as a RS

I am going to remove the material cited to http://www3.telus.net/tyee/multiples/ since this is not a reliable source. Any thoughts? Thank you, --Tom 21:23, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

Use

There is one exceptional reason not to create a separate article

1.There are not that many triplets to record.

What would be the use to create an article that would not really expand to much over time. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bookluvr107 (talk) 18:45, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

New Zealand and Australia

It says that the Johnson quads were born in Dunedin, New Zealand. However, in the exact same sentence, it goes on to say they were the first surviving quads in Australia? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 118.93.45.111 (talk) 09:37, 13 December 2009 (UTC)

Dodecamom?

Several media outlets are reporting that a woman in Tunisia is pregnant with 12 babies, 6 boys and 6 girls. Fox News, apparently becoming obsessed with these large birth mothers, has a story on it here. Dr. Cash (talk) 16:29, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

It was a fraud:[2] --Roentgenium111 (talk) 12:28, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

Unreported but remarkable quadruplets

In May 1989, at Mugonero Hospital, Kibuye Prefecture, Rwanda, a set of quadruplets were born, which for a while we thought would be a world record birthweight for quads. The doctor and I (hospital CEO) carefully weighed all 4 babies, and the combined birthweight was 9.77kg. This was 10 grams heavier than the record in the 1975 edition of the Guinness Book of World Records, so we submitted it with documentation, photographs etc to the Guinness Book. However, in the interim, a heavier birthweight had been recorded in Japan (according to the response they sent me). Even more unusual was that the quads consisted on identical triplet boys with a fraternal girl as the fourth. This was the first set of quads known to have survived in Rwanda, and local media had picked up the story. I have photos still; the mother's name was Kabanyana Belie. While not a world record weight, it would almost certainly have been the heaviest quad birthweight recorded in Africa. Possibly Guinness Book might still have the data on file. A google search for terms "quadruplets Rwanda Mugonero" throws up several archived references, notably from Adventist online news-sites (the hospital was Adventist-owned). One of these (Adventist Review, 23 Aug 1990, p20) indicates the quads were still alive at least a year later (including a photo). An article with photo reporting the birth was part of a larger church article in Record (aka South Pacific Record) 19 Aug 1989, p10. Both these are online. I would suggest this be inserted - both as including the African continent, and for their remarkable birth-weight. Ptilinopus (talk) 13:04, 9 February 2012 (UTC)

"Mexican woman due to give birth to nine in May"

Don't know how reliable it is, but copying it here for possible future use: [3] --Roentgenium111 (talk) 19:27, 27 April 2012 (UTC)

Fraud again: [4] :-( --Roentgenium111 (talk) 16:21, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Inclusion criteria for this article

This article seems to have degenerated into a list of any multiple births any user feels like including. It should be restricted to those who have their own article indicating that they have some notability (e.g first, heaviest, oldest etc) other than just being a multiple birth. DerbyCountyinNZ (Talk Contribs) 02:55, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

The first step to resolve this will be to remove all entries with neither an article or a citation or any claim to notability. Entries without article or citation will be moved to the talk page until someone creates an article that survives Afd for them, then the entry can go back in. I'll probably get onto this some time in the next week. DerbyCountyinNZ (Talk Contribs) 03:38, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

I think any multiple birth over quadruplets should be included. It is very rare, especially for something like sextuplets and higher. Mass removing entries is unethical, unnecessary, and constitutes vandalism and whitewashing of the encyclopedia, which goes against Wikipedia's policies. WTF? (talk) 23:40, 24 April 2012 (UTC)

It is not "very rare", even sextuplets are becoming more common. The lede of this article say "notable births and pregancies". As far as wikipedia policy goes notability means notable enough to have an article. Wiki is WP:NOTNEWS, which is what adding a report of a multiple birth with no other claim to notability is doing. Septuplets and above have a good chance of being notable in their own right at birth (at least, if they all survive), i.e. some sort of "first...". Sextuplets and under are no longer notable merely by being born, something else is required which is more likely to happen as they grow older. DerbyCountyinNZ (Talk Contribs) 00:12, 25 April 2012 (UTC)
I believe that you're misinterpreting the policy. Things can be "notable" enough to warrant a mention in a list, and there are lots of examples of this on wikipedia, while at the same time not meeting the notability requirements for having an article. So I think you're going way out of line here in deleting things from this page. WTF? (talk) 15:24, 25 April 2012 (UTC)
The lede specific states that this is a list of "notable" multiple births, not merely a list of multiple births. The former requires that entries in the list have a claim to notability other than merely existing, the latter requires nothing apart from existence. Clearly the latter would not only be far from complete but would become impossibly large relatively quickly. As wikipedia is not merely a collection of trivia. As per Wikipedia:LSC

Every entry meets the notability criteria for its own non-redirect article in the English Wikipedia. Red-linked entries are acceptable if the entry is verifiably a member of the listed group, and it is reasonable to expect an article could be forthcoming in the future.

That is why those entries without the reasonable expectation of having their own article have been moved to the talk page. If they get their own article then they can go back on the main page, as can any other multiple birth with an article. DerbyCountyinNZ (Talk Contribs) 19:05, 25 April 2012 (UTC)
I completely agree with removing the unnotable entries, but I'd suggest adding an "introductory" info sentence to each category where we don't list every birth known, so people aren't tempted to re-add them. If information on the occurrence rate of each multiple birth category is available, this could also be included. I suppose septuplets and higher are so rare that we currently list all instances?--Roentgenium111 (talk) 21:33, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Quindecaplets (15)

The pregnancy term 'quindecaplets' implies a multiple birth of 15 babies. One case of quindecaplets was registered in Italy, on July 22, 1971. A woman was pregnant with 15 children, including 10 girls and 5 boys, as a result of taking fertility drugs. Doctors had to extract all the fetuses from the woman's womb to keep her healthy. An Argentinean woman was pregnant with the highest number of babies conceived in the natural way, without taking any fertility drugs. She had 12 fetuses, but the woman lost the pregnancy. — Preceding unsigned comment added by AsparagusTips (talk • contribs) 18:17, 2 June 2013 (UTC)

Quite correct, but this article is about births not pregnancies. There is probably an appropriate article for this information somewhere. DerbyCountyinNZ (Talk Contribs) 22:15, 2 June 2013 (UTC)

Removed entries

These entries have been removed from the main article because they either have no article and no citation, or a citation which is now a dead link or is not WP:RS, or have no/insufficient notability. They should not be added back unless/until they have an article and an indication of why they are notable.

Quadruplets (4)

  • The Whitehead quadruplets (born 4 March 1992) are Laura, Lisa, Hannah and Katie. They were born to Ian and Karen in Orpington Kent.
  • The Yother quadruplets (born 1 April 1995) are 3 boys and 1 girl born in Orlando, Florida to Michael and Kathryn Yother (now Kathryn Brown). Allison, Eric, Joshua and Christopher were featured on several television shows up until they were around 5 years of age, when interest in their story faded.
  • The Coles quadruplets, (born 30 May 1996 born in Essex, England) are Josh, Jonathan, Adam and Amy.
  • The Aversa quadruplets,(born 4 March 1996 in UK) are Giorgia, Claudia, Chiara and Fabrizia. They are the first set of identical quadruplets born in the UK.
  • The Carles quadruplets (born March 2006 in the UK) are Ellie, Holly, Jessica and Georgina. They are the 2nd identical set of quadruplets in Britain.
  • The Medders quadruplets (born 4 November 2007) are Annika Peace, Berkley Claire, Callie Ranelle and Daley Providence. They wre were born in Fargo, North Dakota. Annika and Daley were later discovered to suffer from twin-to-twin transfusion syndrome, and then went through surgery to try to correct this problem. The surgery had never been performed in identical quadruplets before. However, due to subsequent complications, Annika died in utero. The remaining three babies were delivered by Caesarian section at 24 weeks and 6 days due to an infection. Daley (weighing 8 ounces at birth) died at birth and Berkley (weighing 1 pound 4 ounces at birth) died 3 days later, leaving Callie (weighing 1 pound at birth) as the sole survivor.[6]
  • The Crawford quadruplets (born 17 February 2011), a set of double identical twins, were born in Charlotte, N.C.to Miranda and Josh Crawford, a set of identical boys James and Jackson, and a set of identical girls Madison and Mia. The couple had a two-year-old daughter, Josslyn at the time of the quads birth.


Quintuplets (5)

  • The Beach quintuplets (born 17 March 1981 in Rochester, New York). Three boys (Timothy, John, and Patrick) and two girls (Corinne and Deborah) were born to Timothy and Corinne Beach. Timothy died of Sudden Infant Death Syndrome at the age of five months.
  • The Pisner quintuplets (born 21 June 1983 in Washington, DC) to Dan and Pam Pisner were the 9th surviving set of quintuplets in the United States. There are 4 boys and 1 girl (Devin, Ian, Shira, Michael, Elliot). Three graduated from University of Maryland, College Park and 2 graduated from Salisbury University in 2005. All of them are healthy and living in Maryland where their parents still reside.
  • The Helms quintuplets (born 2 March 1987 in Peoria, Illinois) were born to Ron and Roz Helms in 1987. They are four girls (Shannon, Meredith, Bevin, Samantha) and one boy (Benjamin) and were born 11 weeks premature.
  • The Chandler Quintuplets were born in May 1989. Parents Jeri and Peter have one older son, Zach. The quintuplets (Megan, Josh, Emily, Amanda and Heidi) are all now in college. Following their high school graduation from Peak to Peak High School in Lafayette, Colorado, the family appeared on the Today show. The Chandlers attend five different colleges in five different states.[2]
  • The Laverack Quintuplets, born on September 4, 1992, are three girls and two boys (Cameron, Amanda, Kristelle, Neroli, Andrew) and were born in New South Wales, Australia. "Brisbane Time" [3]
  • The Morris quintuplets (born July 10 and 13, 1994 in Topeka, Kansas) are four girls and one boy: Mallory Quinn, Jordan Quinn, Evan Quinton, Kasey Quinn and Holly Quinn. The boy died seventeen days after birth. They are the first recorded quintuplets in Kansas. "Chandler quintuplets ready to fly solo" [4]
  • The Chin quintuplets (born April 1, 1997 in Singapore City, Singapore) were the first quintuplets to be conceived in The KK Hospital for Women and Children. All of the infants survived. They were named Soon-kit (Adriel), Soon-an (André), Li-thing (Alicia), Li-en (Amanda), and Li-quin (Annabelle).[5]
  • The Reyes quintuplets (born September 26, 1997 at Sharp Mary Birch Hospital) were born to Arnold and Lily Reyes. The three boys (Gerard, Gilbert, Garner) and two girls (Adele and Audrey) are raised in Chula Vista, California.
  • On February 18, 2000, a set of quintuplets consisting of four girls and a boy was born at the CZMP Health Center in Łódź, Poland. A year later, in February 2001, another set of quintuplets (four boys and a girl), was born at the same hospital.Quintuplets in Cracow
  • The Brown quintuplets (born 29 October 2001) were born to Jennifer and Jeffrey Brown of Berks County, Pennsylvania and were 11 weeks premature. The babies, four girls (Faith, Kaitlyn, Jenna, Rachael) and one boy (Zachary), were born at Lankenau Medical Center in Wynnewood, PA.
  • The Moreno-Gonzalez quintuplets (born 26 April 2005 in Phoenix, Arizona). The quins, all boys, were born by a surrogate mother, 25-year-old Teresa Anderson. The biological parents, Luisa Gonzalez and her husband Enrique Moreno, had chosen their names weeks ago: Enrique, Jorge, Gabriel, Javier and Victor. After learning she was carrying quintuplets, Anderson decided not to accept money from the couple (a landscaper and a homemaker) because she realized they would need it to raise their unexpectedly outsize family.Surrogate Mother Gives Birth to Quintuplets in Arizona
  • The Phillips quintuplets (born 25 October 2008 in Houston, Texas). They are two boys (John Daniel and David James) and three girls (Rebecca Jenne, Alison Marie and Katelyn Elizabeth) and were born to Bill and Kelly Phillips.
  • The Jones quintuplets (born January 16, 2009 in Austin, Texas ) are stars of the show "Quints by Surprise" which airs on TLC. Four of the quintuplets are girls, and one is a boy.
  • The Maskell-Mistalski quintuplets (born 1 October 2009 in Buffalo, New York). There were three girls (Kayla Lizabeth, Anna Belle Americus and Ramona Wednesday), and two boys (Justin Michael and Tyler Jackson). Kayla died on October 17, 2009. Their mother is Bridget Maskell.
  • The Glass quins (born 27 August 2010 in Saint Louis, Missouri). There are 3 boys (Luke, Evan, and Brady) and 2 girls (Abigale and Sydney). They have two older siblings, Joshua and Kelsey Glass. Their parents are Jim and Beth Glass.
  • The Busby quintuplets (born 8 April 2015 in Texas). Five girls (Twins Ava and Olivia, Hazel, Riley, and Parker) born to Danielle and Adam Busby. They have an older daughter, Blayke.[7]

Sextuplets (6)

  • The Mooser sextuplets (born on 24 March 1986 in Munich, Germany) to Anne Marie and Martin Mooser. One girl was born vaginally after Anne Marie's water broke; the others were born by Cesarean section. Only seven hours after the delivery, the young mother died of a pulmonary embolism, and a boy, Stefan, died three weeks later. Robert, Matthias, Monika, Martina, and Brigitte survive.Mooser Sextuplets
  • The Coleman sextuplets (born 12 November 1986 in England) are three boys (Gary, Stuart, James) and three girls (Jayne, Hannah, Nichola). They were the second set of surviving sextuplets in the United Kingdom.Coleman Sextuplets
  • The Adam sextuplets (born on 14 January 1989 in France). Cédric, Gaëlle, Coralie, Doriane, Kevin and Mélanie were born to Daniel and Marie Claude Adam (living in Seine Maritime, Normandy). Initially there were 10 embryos but Marie Claude's doctor performed an embryo reduction, leaving six embryos.Sextuplets at age 10
  • The Vince sextuplets (born 19 May 1993 in Leeds) were the third set born in England. They are five girls (Rebecca, Katie, Stephanie, Jessica, Valerie) and one boy (Gregory).Vince sextuplets
  • The Perry sextuplets (born 19 March 2003 in Pennsylvania) were born to Erin and Joe Perry. Three boys and three girls (Ian, Simon, Joshua, Olivia, Zoe and Madison) were born at 28 weeks and weighted between 1 lb. 11 oz. and 2 lb. 9 oz. They had an older brother Parker.[6]
  • The Gosselin Sextuplets (born 10 May 2004 in Pennsylvania are three boys (Aaden, collin, Joel) and three girls (Alexis, Hannah, Leah) born 10 weeks premature were born to Jon and Kate Gosselin they have older twin sisters Mady and Cara Gosselin
  • The Hayes sextuplets (born September 14, 2004 in Long Branch, New Jersey) are the first surviving sextuplets to be born in New Jersey. The six children, three boys (Ryan Peter, Connor James, Eric John) and three girls (Tara Rose, Rachel Ann, Rebecca Mary), weighed a total of 24 lbs. and 14 oz., setting a world record for the heaviest set of sextuplets. The Hayes also have two sets of twins, Kevin and Kyle (eight years old at the time of the sextuplets' birth) and Kieran and Meghan (five years old) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.0.26.180 (talk) 10:28, 7 June 2014 (UTC)
  • The Jones quintuplets (born 16 January 2009) to Casey and Ethan Jones of Texas. Four girls (Brooklyn Faith, Britton Grace, Lila Addison and Ryan Elizabeth) and one boy (Jack William). They have an older sister, Eliot McKenna. They were documented on the TLC show [Quints by Surprise].
  • The Carey sextuplets (born 1 June 2011 in Abington, Pennsylvania) were born to Stacey and Brendan Carey. The three girls are Emma, Samantha and Olivia, and three boys are John, Patrick and Connor. They have an older sister named Julianna.
  • The Carroll sextuplets (born 18 June 2011) in Birmingham, Alabama were born to Heather and Mitchell Carroll. The five girls were Abbie Ruth, Sarah Brooklyn, Chloe Denise, Ellie Mackenzie, and Lillian Faith, and one boy was David Randall. They have an older brother Grant.

References

  1. ^ "Eight-Year-Old Adopted Quads In Virginia Excel In Academics And Athletics." Meredith Jackson also runs Cross Country with a 42 minute 5k.(July 30, 2001). Jet. Retrieved October 14, 2007.
  2. ^ http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/24890324
  3. ^ http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/national/i-understand-why-were-doing-this-but-x2026-20090519-bead.html
  4. ^ http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=108436585460
  5. ^ Today in History Singapore (book).
  6. ^ Sextuplets more than a handful for Ross parents

Birth Type

The entries in this list should include whether the births were vaginal or cesarean. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.56.157.70 (talk) 20:16, 4 February 2013 (UTC)

Why? DerbyCountyinNZ (Talk Contribs) 10:45, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

Gosselin Sextuplets?

Kate Gosselin, the mother of the Gosselin sextuplets, has stated on multiple occasions that she was supposed to have septuplets, but she lost one of them. Shouldn't they be listed under septuplets, with six who survived and one who died? 24.163.106.254 (talk) 22:18, 7 July 2014 (UTC)

Unless there is a reliable source confirming this it shouldn't be changed. DerbyCountyinNZ (Talk Contribs) 04:04, 8 July 2014 (UTC)

Annegret Raunigk quadruplets

A 65-year-old German woman, Annegret Raunigk, is expecting to give birth to quadruplets.

—Wavelength (talk) 21:17, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

Hoax?

Would love at least a mention on the talk page of this case:

Russian woman gives birth to ten full term babies in Kursk

Blog post discussing it in English
~ Zaelot (talk) 22:09, 11 December 2015 (UTC)

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Speichinger Sextuplets

This article fails to mention Marjorie Louise Speichinger of Missouri, born in 1936. Her five siblings were stillborn. For years Ms. Speichinger was the only known living sextuplet. 69.122.42.32 (talk) 13:21, 30 June 2017 (UTC)captcrisis

If there is a reliable source which states this then it would be appropriate for inclusion. DerbyCountyinNZ (Talk Contribs) 20:59, 30 June 2017 (UTC)
Easy to find. I knew this because I saw a picture of her in the 1972 Guinness Book of World Records. See the 1963 article from the Ogdensburg Advance-News which states that she's still alive and well (pdf, can't link to it, but find it via Google). 68.196.0.234 (talk) 15:56, 1 July 2017 (UTC) captcrisis
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