Talk:List of investors in Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities

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This list does have some problems. 1st there need to be references with links. The main problem to me is the likelihood of double or even triple counting. How do we indicate that x may have invested in y who invested in z who invested in Madoff? Some may consider this WP:OR in compiling our own list, when other lists are available from reliable sources; but in any case similar lists keep on being inserted in the Madoff article and I'd like to keep them away from there. Smallbones (talk) 18:08, 13 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Regarding the link to the Wall Street Journal

I have only added the link. I have not reconciled the Wikipedia article to the Wall Street Journal's data. patsw (talk) 21:24, 18 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not alleged

This is not an allegation since there is an admission which has been reported by reliable sources. patsw (talk) 21:24, 18 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The FBI alleges that Madoff confessed, which is what has been reported. We cannot convict him before a court does ==> "alleged" is the correct way to phrase this. Smallbones (talk) 23:47, 18 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Bernard L. Madoff Securities LLP

Is there any solid evidence that there was an entity named Bernard L. Madoff Securities LLP or that it had significant investors? Madoff's broker-dealer was named Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities LLC. John M Baker (talk) 22:16, 22 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]

The SEC Report, for example. Also, have at a google search.--Epeefleche (talk) 23:46, 22 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]

The SEC report has two references to "Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities, LLP," and none at all to "Bernard L. Madoff Securities LLP," and most of the Google search results also seem to be for "Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities LLP." Neither reference in the SEC report provides any reason to believe that the supposed LLP had any investors.

My guess is that "LLP" in those two examples is just an error for "LLC." LLPs usually are professional entities such as law or accounting firms, not investment vehicles. In any case, even if there was a Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities, LLP or even Bernard L. Madoff Securities LLP, the investors seem to have invested through Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities LLC. John M Baker (talk) 04:42, 23 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Hi. The SEC Report refers to an LLP. Is it an error? Possibly. If you do a Lexis/Nexis search, you will find decisions that also refer to an LLP. Also possibly an error? Perhaps. I would have to dig further. But at times an LLP is created alongside an LLC -- for example, to own shares in an LLC. And one thing we know of Madoff-he was creative. So I don't have a definitive answer, other than you have the biggest SEC report on the matter, and caselaw, that do refer to an LLP.--Epeefleche (talk) 06:13, 23 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Okay, I've researched this further. As I suspected, this is a list of investors in Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities LLC. I will correct the article. Whether or not there ever was an entity named Bernard L. Madoff Securities LLP or Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities, LLC, I cannot say for sure, but that was not the name of the entity against which investors had a claim in the legal proceeding in bankruptcy court.

Should the article's name be changed, presumably to List of investors in Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities? John M Baker (talk) 21:30, 23 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]

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Probable error in the entry for "Avram and Carol Goldberg (Stop n Shop founders)"

This list contains an entry that says [QUOTE:]

Madoff investor investor type potential exposure source

Avram and Carol Goldberg (Stop n Shop founders) US individuals n/a Reuters

but that entry seems to be in error. That entry contains a link to [the article about] "Stop n Shop".

However, ... [when I checked it ... very recently], the article about "Stop n Shop" did not seem to contain even a single instance of:

the character string "Goldberg"

nor

the character string "Avram"

nor

the character string "Carol".

(... "never mind" containing an instance of [actually mentioning] "Madoff"!)

So, maybe it is possible that the article about "Stop n Shop" is so poorly written (and researched) that it fails to mention the founders of the company. However, it seems far more likely that some hapless editor just entered this line into this "list" -- (or, modified this line) -- without any intention to (or -- perhaps more likely? -- without the 'ability' to?) ... stick to the truth.

Any comments? --Mike Schwartz (talk) 05:48, 26 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]